(08-15-2017, 02:08 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: Literally all just you using ad hominem attacks and ignoring the content of my posts and trying to attack my credibility or others. 
Speaks volumes you assumed it was about you though. 

You called me out in the thread 20 times so yes that was an easy assumption my posts were giving you major butt pain.

(08-15-2017, 02:06 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: As Ocho says, going from worst to not worst is getting better I guess? 

But he's still bad. 

Yes.  Going from worst to not worst is a step forward, tiny as it may be.  And if he can take one step, maybe he can take two.  Munoz has repeatedly said how important confidence is for a lineman.  Every time he gets a little better, the confidence will grow and eventually, maybe it leads to the aggressiveness he lacks.

(08-15-2017, 02:09 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: He may be, but in time we may see he is not as bad as you want to make him out to be.

I have my concerns too, but in the end out of my control him getting better or worse so I just hope you are dead wrong so we have a good year.

again you act like I'm out to get him. 

Why couldn't you just address the content of the post from the beginning? This is the closest you've come to having this be about football and not me. 

(08-15-2017, 01:58 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: The problem with Lap, is that he's a company man. He largely just toes the line.

Lap probably knows more about football than I ever will. But sometimes, he's just being a great worker and friend and sending out lines the team needs to get out there. 

I don't see this about Lap.  I mean I don't think he's ever criticized the organization.  He's a total Bengals supporter.  But he's never been afraid to criticize players who are not cutting it.  He took off on Jeremy when his first run was to the outside against TB.  And he politely dumped all over Og last season. 

But you and Ocho are right at this point.  The improvement will have to be much more substantial to justify them not tagging Whit in the offseason.

(08-15-2017, 02:11 PM)McC Wrote: Yes.  Going from worst to not worst is a step forward, tiny as it may be.  And if he can take one step, maybe he can take two.  Munoz has repeatedly said how important confidence is for a lineman.  Every time he gets a little better, the confidence will grow and eventually, maybe it leads to the aggressiveness he lacks.

People in this thread want him to fail so they can tell us all how smart they are versus wanting him to succeed. Their egos simply can't take the hit and need the message board approval to stroke it. Life is good, it is almost the regular season and the optimist in me thinks we have tons of guys play better in 2017. If not, life will go on as it always has in the past 25+ years.

Ced taking baby steps forward is 100% better than none or getting worse. Let's just hope he starts taking bigger steps forward very soon.

(08-15-2017, 02:16 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: People in this thread want him to fail so they can tell us all how smart they are versus wanting him to succeed. Their egos simply can't take the hit and need the message board approval to stroke it. Life is good, it is almost the regular season and the optimist in me thinks we have tons of guys play better in 2017. If not, life will go on as it always has in the past 25+ years.

Ced taking baby steps forward is 100% better than none or getting worse. Let's just hope he starts taking bigger steps forward very soon.

More ad hominem. 

No one wants him to fail. Show me where someone WANTS him to fail. 

(08-15-2017, 02:17 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: So now I am an idiot and a baby. Who is attacking who in this thread again?

Glad you see it too. Bye. 

(08-15-2017, 02:11 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: You called me out in the thread 20 times so yes that was an easy assumption my posts were giving you major butt pain.

I'm not going to derail this thread into a he said/he said battle, but if you look at your first post in this thread, you completely ignored the content of his post and assumed he was on a witch hunt. His first reply to you was a return volley followed by an explanation of why he was critiquing. 

There's plenty of content in this thread for you or anyone to watch and see if what he's saying is, in your opinion, true or false. To the best of my knowledge, i don't recall you citing a reason why his evaluation is wrong, based on the amount of video he posted and what you can find on youtube. 

This post isn't an attack. Personally, i think he's being a bit harsh on where Ced can go, but i don't disagree with his assessment of Ced's technical play. 

(08-15-2017, 02:17 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: More ad hominem. 

No one wants him to fail. Show me where someone WANTS him to fail. 

Well, no one is going to come out and say it.  But it doesn't take Einstein to read between the lines.

(08-15-2017, 02:16 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: People in this thread want him to fail so they can tell us all how smart they are versus wanting him to succeed. Their egos simply can't take the hit and need the message board approval to stroke it. Life is good, it is almost the regular season and the optimist in me thinks we have tons of guys play better in 2017. If not, life will go on as it always has in the past 25+ years.

Ced taking baby steps forward is 100% better than none or getting worse. Let's just hope he starts taking bigger steps forward very soon.

False. Those who doubt him are backing it up with analysis. Those who are optimistic on him have...what...exactly....to base that off of?

(Practically) everyone on these forums (at least myself) wants Ogbuehi to succeed. But want and belief are two different things.

(08-15-2017, 02:00 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: I mean, you aren't wrong. 

They have been targeting the wrong things since the Zeitler pick. 
They've drafted guys with bad habits and poor technique. 

There's something wrong with how they are scouting OL right now. 

You noticed that too huh and it's not just the fundementals. It seems like they are going after the dancing bears and not the guys with power.

(08-15-2017, 02:19 PM)McC Wrote: Well, no one is going to come out and say it.  But it doesn't take Einstein to read between the lines.

If anyone is projecting, it's you and Luv
Critiquing play isn't saying you hope he fails. What kind of backwards logic is that? 

I want him to succeed. 
I want every Bengal to succeed. 

I just see issues in the core of his game that make me think that isn't likely.

Are we no longer allowed to do critique play? 

(08-15-2017, 02:20 PM)Synric Wrote: You noticed that too huh and it's not just the fundementals. It seems like they are going after the dancing bears and not the guys with power.

I've noticed it for years.

They did it again this year with Dielman. He spent a lot of time on the ground at Utah. 
But he's athletic and plays multiple positions and hits size benchmarks....

Og has a lot to work on. At this point we just have to hope with more snaps he gains confidence and improves.

He was a little better than last year Friday especially in the run game.

(08-15-2017, 02:11 PM)McC Wrote: Yes.  Going from worst to not worst is a step forward, tiny as it may be.  And if he can take one step, maybe he can take two.  Munoz has repeatedly said how important confidence is for a lineman.  Every time he gets a little better, the confidence will grow and eventually, maybe it leads to the aggressiveness he lacks.

If he keeps improving at the current rate he will be a probowler by year 2150

(08-15-2017, 02:25 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: I've noticed it for years.

They did it again this year with Dielman. He spent a lot of time on the ground at Utah. 
But he's athletic and plays multiple positions and hits size benchmarks....

I've said a few times I've always thought PA was a good technical coach....he just has a shitty eye for talent.

(08-15-2017, 02:23 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: If anyone is projecting, it's you and Luv
Critiquing play isn't saying you hope he fails. What kind of backwards logic is that? 

I want him to succeed. 
I want every Bengal to succeed. 

I just see issues in the core of his game that make me think that isn't likely.

Are we no longer allowed to do critique play? 

Okay.  We're just dumb asses who can't understand anything about subtleties or nuances or tone.  If a guys spends half a day creating a thread and then argues with every single person who disagrees, EVERY SINGLE ONE, that doesn't mean a thing.

(08-15-2017, 02:30 PM)Synric Wrote: I've said a few times I've always thought PA was a good technical coach....he just has a shitty eye for talent.

Yep. Which is why you'd think they'd expand the scouting department...

(08-15-2017, 02:23 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: If anyone is projecting, it's you and Luv
Critiquing play isn't saying you hope he fails. What kind of backwards logic is that? 

I want him to succeed. 
I want every Bengal to succeed. 

I just see issues in the core of his game that make me think that isn't likely.

Are we no longer allowed to do critique play? 

Of course we need to critique the play of our biggest question mark in Og. You do a great job of this RRL and know more
about O-line play than I. I just think sometimes we want to close our ears and just hope what you say is not true. Bodine
looked alright Friday except for the one terrible play and you never saw him improving much.

Maybe Og can get better.

Liked what i saw from everybody else of the starters on the Line against Tampa, especially Hopkins.

Isn't the true question here "What is the meaning of successful?"

For an Offensive Lineman, successful means they hold the point on the interior and on the outside the hold their blocks and the edges no matter the type of play run. I saw the same things Royle saw, and my concern may be similar - if the only way Og can hold up is for us to confine our pass game to little scat passes we can get out in under 2 seconds then we have a problem. If on the other hand he can at least be competent on longer plays then things are better.

Also, line play is a unit type of thing. So it isn't just Og here - Bodine has to prove he can hold the point so the pocket actually has a nose the QB can step up into. If he does like he has so far in his career and gets pushed back then the job of the tackles is made more difficult.