(09-08-2017, 08:08 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: And this is a perfect example of a silly way to use averages. 

Games missed due to injury and production are two different things. 

You could certainly use availability when discussing a contract, but Eifert is a proven producer when healthy.

Yes...WHEN HEALTHY he's productive...meaning the Bengals need to rely on a backup TE in the average of 9 games a season that he misses.

That's huge. It's also relevant.

To win, you need to put productive players out there EVERY game. The margin for error in the NFL is razor thin.

Burfict is an awesome LB. Im glad this got done.

(09-08-2017, 11:45 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Yes...WHEN HEALTHY he's productive...meaning the Bengals need to rely on a backup TE in the average of 9 games a season that he misses.

That's huge. It's also relevant.

To win, you need to put productive players out there EVERY game. The margin for error in the NFL is razor thin.

It's where averages fail. I posted earlier that he's missed big chunks of consecutive games on 2 occasions. 15 games in '14 and 6 games last year. Other than that, a couple here and there, like most other NFL players. 

(09-09-2017, 12:06 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: It's where averages fail. I posted earlier that he's missed big chunks of consecutive games on 2 occasions. 15 games in '14 and 6 games last year. Other than that, a couple here and there, like most other NFL players. 

Yeah the averages make it sound worse than it really is. He played nearly full seasons in 2013 and 2015. I have a strong feeling he'll be turning in a full season (or close to it) this year. If he does, then suddenly his career looks no worse than MLJ's...and many on here threw tantrums when we didn't throw a big contract at that guy.

Eifert is the perfect case for using the franchise tag.

I don't care if he's injured or suspended for 14 games as long as the two he is playing is against the steelers.. 10 mil a year is worth it to me to see the steelers cry like babies.

(09-08-2017, 06:00 PM)jowczarski Wrote: @TheLeonardLeap - I don't care for this deal because I can't believe any other team was going to offer him anything close to this. 

That may be true .. but with the per game roster bonuses…it means he HAS to play to get any of it. So it’s not a bad outlay.

Sure, the contract structure looks pretty decent, but don't the Bengals then have to keep that much cap space open when they cut down to 53 men? So even if Burfict misses 1/3rd of the season as has become the norm, that money that was saved isn't going towards improving the team that year because it's too late to realize it/spend it. They can't spend their cap space with the expectation that he won't play 16 games, right?

Saving $3m or whatever doesn't mean much when it's $3m that isn't going towards helping the team win.

Plus as much as Burfict elevates the defense when he is on the field, I just have a hard time thinking in long terms about him. Between the knee, concussions, and suspension, what's the real odds that the Burfict who's play makes a noticeable difference is still around in 3-4 years? Much like Eifert, everything about his career thus far screams short career, and I don't know how smart it is to build your team around someone like that. Talent can only help you when it's on the field.

(09-09-2017, 12:48 AM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Eifert is the perfect case for using the franchise tag.

Agreed.  Should be about 10M which locks in not having to fill a need and hopefully CJ bounces back from injury and Kroft improve's steadily.

(09-08-2017, 08:02 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Consistently better, yes. Because he's there much more. I'll give him that.

Would you feel the same way if Burfict didn't have the history of missed games and stupid penalties that he does? I understand that's a big if. Just wondering.

Nope, wouldn't make a difference, actually

Seriously, you are correct in that it is a BIG thing, but I'm speaking strictly from an ability and talent standpoint.

They aren't far off, but Dunlap just has certain qualities that are super useful at his position, that Burfict doesn't have.

Bigger impact? Burfict without a doubt.

I'm not a fan of Burfict, as I have never been a fan of dirty players. Once a dirty player always a dirty player was an ole saying.

That said, as long as he doesn't resort back to dirty/cheapshot play again then I am glad he will be a Bengal for 3 more years. Just hope he doesnt resort back to that kind of play which will only hurt the team.

(09-07-2017, 08:06 PM)BonnieBengal Wrote: I think so because the NFL is clearly targeting Burfict and wants him out of the league, and Brown just signed on for more.  I also think with a pay raise this will give Burfict some financial relief after his suspension won't it? He'll miss three games but be making more when he gets back.

I don't think the NFL wants him out of the league. I think they want to run him out of Cincinnati.

I can just imagine if Burfict played for one of the NFL's darling teams. He would be compared to the greats of all time on a regular basis.  Espn would do 30 for 30's about him and he would be a sure fire first ballet hall of famer. They just don't like Mike Brown or the smaller market teams with no history so they put the hammer down whenever they can. 

One thing about Mike Brown that is true. He really loves his players, to a fault sometimes (Adam Jones, Peko, etc....) but in this case I love him sticking it to the NFL for once

(09-09-2017, 02:59 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Sure, the contract structure looks pretty decent, but don't the Bengals then have to keep that much cap space open when they cut down to 53 men? So even if Burfict misses 1/3rd of the season as has become the norm, that money that was saved isn't going towards improving the team that year because it's too late to realize it/spend it. They can't spend their cap space with the expectation that he won't play 16 games, right?

Saving $3m or whatever doesn't mean much when it's $3m that isn't going towards helping the team win.

Plus as much as Burfict elevates the defense when he is on the field, I just have a hard time thinking in long terms about him. Between the knee, concussions, and suspension, what's the real odds that the Burfict who's play makes a noticeable difference is still around in 3-4 years? Much like Eifert, everything about his career thus far screams short career, and I don't know how smart it is to build your team around someone like that. Talent can only help you when it's on the field.

I am no cap expert, but think they can roll any unused money into next year after the season spend is determined (after season).

(09-09-2017, 12:14 PM)Millhouse Wrote: I'm not a fan of Burfict, as I have never been a fan of dirty players. Once a dirty player always a dirty player was an ole saying.

That said, as long as he doesn't resort back to dirty/cheapshot play again then I am glad he will be a Bengal for 3 more years. Just hope he doesnt resort back to that kind of play which will only hurt the team.

I'll say I've never been a huge fan, but I find myself pulling for him now. I also say that I fully believe he's at a cross roads in his career right now. When he comes back he's got to be 1,000% focused on playing by the new NFL rules ! And he absolutely can not even think about any after whistle stuff !

He's either gonna keep his nose clean and be a super good LBer, or he's gonna flop big time. I'm hoping he's matured and "gets it". He could well be one of the better ones to play the game. It's up to him

(09-09-2017, 04:28 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: I'll say I've never been a huge fan, but I find myself pulling for him now. I also say that I fully believe he's at a cross roads in his career right now. When he comes back he's got to be 1,000% focused on playing by the new NFL rules ! And he absolutely can not even think about any after whistle stuff !

He's either gonna keep his nose clean and be a super good LBer, or he's gonna flop big time. I'm hoping he's matured and "gets it". He could well be one of the better ones to play the game. It's up to him

I'm a huge Burfict fan. However, I sometimes find myself thinking how fast and reactive this game is. I'n a blink of an eye, if you don't react with instinct, you get burnt. If you don't have or develope good instincts fast? Your not around very long. With how critical these rules are becoming, in order for Burfict to be the player they need him to be, the talent that makes him great might diminish because he's always got to think twice about what to do. Sport is slowly turning in to two-hand touch or flag football. Wait.... Flag football already exists in Cincinnati.

I just wish it was 5 years. Well done Bengals!

(09-09-2017, 05:02 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: I'm a huge Burfict fan. However, I sometimes find myself thinking how fast and reactive this game is. I'n a blink of an eye, if you don't react with instinct, you get burnt. If you don't have or develope good instincts fast? Your not around very long. With how critical these rules are becoming, in order for Burfict to be the player they need him to be, the talent that makes him great might diminish because he's always got to think twice about what to do. Sport is slowly turning in to two-hand touch or flag football. Wait.... Flag football already exists in Cincinnati.

Yep! It's happening in college too.

I've seen numerous guys get ejected these past 2 weeks for targeting.

It's a game of split seconds and reactions. Like I said, I think Burfict will eventually be banned for hits. Not that he's intentionally dirty...but the game is so fast that he's bound to collide with a guy wrong and get banned.

@Vas Deferense – Thanks!

@ochocincos - hat's your confidence level the Bengals would be able and willing to win a bidding war for Eifert assuming tag isn't in discussion and he's shown better durability and continued good performance? My concern is that they would lose out in such a scenario based on past scenarios with Marvin Jones, Whitworth, and some other strong players they thought they'd be able to keep.

Well, you’re talking about an interesting scenario. If he plays 13 games at a Pro Bowl level. Tag. 10 games at a Pro Bowl level – but depending on the kind of injury, if he finishes the year and plays in the playoffs…maybe transition tag.

If he plays 6-8 games and his back is all messed up and he’s kinda brilliant but kinda pedestrian…I could see him hitting the market. And at that point, they’d make an offer at what they feel is a fair “market” value. But in that case, I can almost guarantee you he’ll find something elsewhere.

@TheLeonardLeap - but don't the Bengals then have to keep that much cap space open when they cut down to 53 men? So even if Burfict misses 1/3rd of the season as has become the norm, that money that was saved isn't going towards improving the team that year because it's too late to realize it/spend it. They can't spend their cap space with the expectation that he won't play 16 games, right?

This is true. You sign a contract expecting to pay that out. If he’s suspended, that money goes to NFL charities anyway. If he’s injured…he just doesn’t get that money.

@Luvnit2 – rollover money

to be honest, I have no idea where that money goes from guys who either miss games with roster bonuses, or if they fail to meet a workout clause. It’s not paid out. I can find out if it gets tossed back into the pot later. There’s a lot of weird accounting that goes on after a season.

@TheLeonardLeap - Plus as much as Burfict elevates the defense when he is on the field, I just have a hard time thinking in long terms about him. Between the knee, concussions, and suspension, what's the real odds that the Burfict who's play makes a noticeable difference is still around in 3-4 years? Much like Eifert, everything about his career thus far screams short career, and I don't know how smart it is to build your team around someone like that. Talent can only help you when it's on the field.

It is just a three-year deal, til his 30th birthday. The Bengals have always felt guys can play to that age, if not just beyond. The microfracture shouldn’t be a concern anymore, really. He’s played long enough now past that. The concussion thing is legit though, I think. I mean he was evaluated for one in Washington. I think they see him transitioning to MLB in base and nickel when he loses a step, because it won’t hurt you as much there.

(09-08-2017, 06:00 PM)jowczarski Wrote: @BonnieBengal - That last hit did not warrant a five game suspension or a three game suspension. They are trying to punish him for the past.

This is true. He was cited for continuing to violate the league’s safety rules as a repeat offender. That’s what happens when you repeatedly offend.

Yeah but my point is they are picking hits that aren't even dirty now to do it.   The hit they suspended him for was a clean hit.  If they keep doing that, they can eventually kick him out of the league for violations of the conduct policy using clean hits to do it.  They have decided to get rid of him, IMO.

Lol

Our poor fans are so desperate for a winner, they become hilariously moronic.

(09-07-2017, 09:02 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: Well... I'm happy... But I'm also torn. 

The microscope Burfict is under is massive. He's likely going to be suspended again (and next time for a LONG time), whether he deserves it or not. The NFL has the power to suspend this guy whenever they want, and I believe they'll once again make an example of Burfict by suspending him as soon as an opposing player gets a bad bruise (i.e. Burfict hits them "too hard"). Can we count on Burfict to consistently be there for us? Realistically speaking, probably not.

He's an undeniable elite talent. But if he's going to miss several games each year due to suspension (again, whether he deserves it or not)... Is he worth it?? Time will tell.

From a pure talent standpoint, this is a no-brainer. From a longterm, reliability standpoint? I'm not so confident. It truly sucks, but it is what it is.

Pretty have the exact same feelings now... Although my "elite talent" comment may have been a misnomer 

I forgot how team friendly his deal is though. In theory, it should make parting ways with him easier... In theory