The Howard pick would have been more about his long term value with Eifert being a free agent also Brate isn’t exactly a stiff in Tampa and who knows how he could have produced here with Eifert now out for the year. I’m not sleeping on Ross and I hope he comes back healthy I’m simply saying he had a significant injury history that we chose to overlook. Just something to pay attention to over the next 3 years. I’m sure we will closely monitor the careers of Ross, HowRd and Hooker

(10-12-2017, 10:50 PM)Deanlj69 Wrote: The Howard pick would have been more about his long term value with Eifert being a free agent also Brate isn’t exactly a stiff in Tampa and who knows how he could have produced here with Eifert now out for the year. I’m not sleeping on Ross and I hope he comes back healthy I’m simply saying he had a significant injury history that we chose to overlook. Just something to pay attention to over the next 3 years. I’m sure we will closely monitor the careers of Ross, HowRd and Hooker

Brate isn't an upgrade over Kroft. He had a good game against a bad giants defense that boosts his stats up. /The Pats D is suspect as well.

(10-12-2017, 01:11 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: 1 drop in his career.

Just 

Whaddayaknow? Must be some kind of Vulcan mind trick that I seem to remember more.  I'm not questioning your answer as you very well could be right. 
Then again I seem to remember being young and good looking. What the hell happened?  Now I'm old and ugly.  

(10-13-2017, 08:32 AM)grampahol Wrote: Whaddayaknow? Must be some kind of Vulcan mind trick that I seem to remember more.  I'm not questioning your answer as you very well could be right. 
Then again I seem to remember being young and good looking. What the hell happened?  Now I'm old and ugly.  

Different sources count drops differently. Some are more generous and some are more critical. Much like how a team counts player tackles differently than the NFL.

That said, I think the problem is less dropping and more he simply doesn't catch passes cleanly. If I recall correctly, his only career TD came when he was wide open and he still triple-caught it. He also can't get reliable separation, so it seems like a lot of his catches are contested.

(10-12-2017, 12:31 AM)Synric Wrote: Andy Dalton is one of very QBs to throw for 3000+ yards 20+ TDs in hist first 3 years. He's one of what very few QBs to take his team to the playoffs 5 times in a row.


You seem to call him a mediocre QB alot lol. Just saying pot kettle man.

Oh shit

(10-13-2017, 01:56 AM)Lawless_1 Wrote: Brate isn't an upgrade over Kroft. He had a good game against a bad giants defense that boosts his stats up. /The Pats D is suspect as well.

Come on man - Brate had 660 receiving yards last season which was his 3rd year in the NFL.

In 5 starts this year, Kroft has 139 yards receiving.

(10-13-2017, 10:22 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Come on man - Brate had 660 receiving yards last season which was his 3rd year in the NFL.

In 5 starts this year, Kroft has 139 yards receiving.

I think it's easy to write Kroft off because he's never been given a chance to shine in the passing game. 

He's started 3 games and played in 5. In his first 2 games this year he had 1 target because Eifert was still out there. In the last 3 games he has 16 targets and 13 receptions that's more targets and receptions than both his first 2 years. 

2015 Kroft had Eifert starting over him and getting the lions share and for good reason but 2016 is another case of how poorly Zampese used his players.

(10-12-2017, 10:50 PM)Deanlj69 Wrote: The Howard pick would have been more about his long term value with Eifert being a free agent also Brate isn’t exactly a stiff in Tampa and who knows how he could have produced here with Eifert now out for the year. I’m not sleeping on Ross and I hope he comes back healthy I’m simply saying he had a significant injury history that we chose to overlook. Just something to pay attention to over the next 3 years. I’m sure we will closely monitor the careers of Ross, HowRd and Hooker

I don't believe the Bengals overlooked anything. His injury history was well-known. According to Marvin, John Ross "jumped through the hoops and passed our medical," so they considered him clear of his previous injuries and only had to recover from his shoulder surgery. Maybe the problem is more with the Bengals medical staff, but we'll have to wait and see how much John Ross plays over the next 1-2 years before we call him a bust. It's only been 5 games. Mike Williams has also not played this year yet, but I don't see people labeling him a bust yet. Corey Davis has only played in two games and is hurt again, but I don't see people labeling him a bust yet either.

(10-12-2017, 01:11 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: 1 drop in his career.

Just 1.

Are you sure Truck? I seem to recall multiple drops in the playoff game against Houston when Gruden decided to not throw to AJ.

(10-12-2017, 01:52 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: I don't really get this has OJ howard really impressed anyone ?

He's had more production than Ross while being a TE2, has been healthy, and Eifert has barely played so the opportunity would have been here for Howard to get playing time.
That's the point of the thread.

(10-13-2017, 11:59 AM)sandwedge Wrote: Are you sure Truck? I seem to recall multiple drops in the playoff game against Houston when Gruden decided to not throw to AJ.

Uzomah not Gresham. I don't know if that stat is completely accurate, because I seem to remember multiple drops in just one game. Even still, he's only got 28 receptions in his whole career.

(10-13-2017, 12:16 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Uzomah not Gresham. I don't know if that stat is completely accurate, because I seem to remember multiple drops in just one game. Even still, he's only got 28 receptions in his whole career.

This was like 2012, our second playoff game against Houston. CJ wasn't on the team. 

(10-13-2017, 12:18 PM)sandwedge Wrote: This was like 2012, our second playoff game against Houston. CJ wasn't on the team. 

Truck is talking about Uzomah not Gresham.

(10-13-2017, 12:19 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Truck is talking about Uzomah not Gresham.

My mistake then. I thought it was Gresham. Have a good day sir!

(10-13-2017, 11:59 AM)sandwedge Wrote: Are you sure Truck? I seem to recall multiple drops in the playoff game against Houston when Gruden decided to not throw to AJ.

(10-13-2017, 12:19 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Truck is talking about Uzomah not Gresham.

Many thanks, BS :andy:

In reality, he had 2 drops in the Pittsburgh game last year, but only got credited with 1. Thus, for his career, he has just 1 drop.

(10-12-2017, 01:07 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Agreed. If a WR and TE both pan out...the WR impacts the game more.

With all that said...our offense DESPERATELY needs Speed.

For damn sure, not too impressed with Urban this year in getting Core or Malone ready to play in case
Ross couldn't go honestly. And i have always thought Urban was a fine coach, but these guys both have
the speed we need and Malone can go up for the ball very well to cushion his inexperience.

Give one of these guys a shot if Ross cannot play.

(10-13-2017, 12:36 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Many thanks, BS :andy:

In reality, he had 2 drops in the Pittsburgh game last year, but only got credited with 1. Thus, for his career, he has just 1 drop.

Didn't he have one in the Jets game too? I remember it being kind of a low throw, so it's not all on him. I know that's being nit picky. I like Kroft better than Uzi, but I don't think Uzi is that bad of a TE.

(10-13-2017, 10:46 AM)Synric Wrote: I think it's easy to write Kroft off because he's never been given a chance to shine in the passing game. 

He's started 3 games and played in 5. In his first 2 games this year he had 1 target because Eifert was still out there. In the last 3 games he has 16 targets and 13 receptions that's more targets and receptions than both his first 2 years. 

2015 Kroft had Eifert starting over him and getting the lions share and for good reason but 2016 is another case of how poorly Zampese used his players.

Yep. Small sample size, but over 16 games, Kroft would be on pace for 69 catches, 715 yards and 11 TDs. Based on those 3 starts.

(10-13-2017, 12:57 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Didn't he have one in the Jets game too? I remember it being kind of a low throw, so it's not all on him. I know that's being nit picky. I like Kroft better than Uzi, but I don't think Uzi is that bad of a TE.

Yeah, the didn't credit him with it.

Remember that play vividly; it was literally at his shins/ankles.

(10-13-2017, 10:22 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Come on man - Brate had 660 receiving yards last season which was his 3rd year in the NFL.

In 5 starts this year, Kroft has 139 yards receiving.

Look at the defenses Brate faced this season. The Giants and Patriots are 2 of the worst in the NFL. 139 yards is ok because he was not used for 2 games. If you take the 3 games and stretch that out over 16 games that comes out to 741.3 which beats Brates numbers from last season. Kroft is just as good.

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