(11-13-2017, 05:55 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: He's struggled against edge rushers in atleast 3 games. Guess what he's going to see nearly every week in the NFL? Yeah...edge rushers.

Struggled is a strong word. He's had bad reps but in no case did he really "struggle". He really had the one bad rep vs UGA and bullied Chubb NCST outside of one rep and he's one of, if not the top EDGE in the class. And against Miami, yeah no one looked great but he really only had the one truly bad play. 
Boston College didn't even put Landry on him more than a few times and he handled him. 
He's still very good. 

(11-13-2017, 05:56 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Yeah their whole line looked bad...but Miami's defensive line is NFL caliber.

The whole team was out of sorts. Miami punched ND in the face and ND shriveled. 
A large part of the issue was the right side and center. Now don't get me wrong, both McGlinchey and Nelson both had their shitty plays but they also had some very good blocks. 
Neither was exceptionally better than the other and the praise of Nelson while tearing McGlinchey down vs Miami is what I'm trying to highlight. 

Oh...I do think he's a good prospect too still and he's a great run blocker...but we're used to having Whitworth not giving up any pressures for games at a time. McGlinchey is going to give up sacks as a rookie and maybe a decent amount. He'll be better than Ced though.

Actually I've read he projects out to be more of a RT in the pros.

(11-13-2017, 06:03 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Oh...I do think he's a good prospect too still and he's a great run blocker...but we're used to having Whitworth not giving up any pressures for games at a time. McGlinchey is going to give up sacks as a rookie and maybe a decent amount. He'll be better than Ced though.

Actually I've read he projects out to be more of a RT in the pros.

I don't think that means anything any more. 
NFL teams have edge rushers on both sides now. 

(11-13-2017, 05:55 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: He's struggled against edge rushers in atleast 3 games. Guess what he's going to see nearly every week in the NFL? Yeah...edge rushers.

Which three games? And who were the edge rushers?
In one of my previous comments, I had a quote from Walter Football saying the only two games that have been bad were Georgia and Miami.
It was also stated McGlinchey held his own against future NFL edge rushers Hardold Landry (Boston College) and Duke Ejiofor (Wake Forest).

I am not kidding when I say EVERY draft pick should be spent on the Oline.

Maybe 2-3 starters come out of that, and I am good.

(11-13-2017, 06:05 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Which three games? And who were the edge rushers?
In one of my previous comments, I had a quote from Walter Football saying the only two games that have been bad were Georgia and Miami.
It was also stated McGlinchey held his own against future NFL edge rushers Hardold Landry (Boston College) and Duke Ejiofor (Wake Forest).

He had one bad rep vs Bradley Chubb from NCST. Who is the top pure DE in the draft right now. 
But otherwise mostly bullied Chubb. 

Boston College purposefully kept Landry away from McGlinchey 

(11-13-2017, 06:05 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Which three games? And who were the edge rushers?
In one of my previous comments, I had a quote from Walter Football saying the only two games that have been bad were Georgia and Miami.
It was also stated McGlinchey held his own against future NFL edge rushers Hardold Landry (Boston College) and Duke Ejiofor (Wake Forest).

10/31/17 - Notre Dame redshirt senior LT Mike McGlinchey (6-7, 312, 5.27, #68) had an up-and-down performance against N.C. State senior pass rusher Bradley Chubb (6-3, 275, 4.84, #9), a projected top-10 pick in the 2018 NFL Draft. Along with Quenton Nelson at left guard, McGlinchey was dominant in the run game, but his struggles with edge speed in pass protection showed on more than a few occasions. Entering the season, scouts had concerns about his ability to stay on the blindside in the NFL, and his performances against the top defenses on the schedule (Georgia and N.C. State) back up those concerns. - Dane Brugler, NFLDraftScout.com

(11-13-2017, 06:07 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: 10/31/17 - Notre Dame redshirt senior LT Mike McGlinchey (6-7, 312, 5.27, #68) had an up-and-down performance against N.C. State senior pass rusher Bradley Chubb (6-3, 275, 4.84, #9), a projected top-10 pick in the 2018 NFL Draft. Along with Quenton Nelson at left guard, McGlinchey was dominant in the run game, but his struggles with edge speed in pass protection showed on more than a few occasions. Entering the season, scouts had concerns about his ability to stay on the blindside in the NFL, and his performances against the top defenses on the schedule (Georgia and N.C. State) back up those concerns. - Dane Brugler, NFLDraftScout.com

In what world does "Up and down performance against Bradley Chubb" equal "struggled"? To me, up-and-down means some good, some bad. Struggled implies bad in general.
My definition of "up and down performance" is in line with what Royle said that Chubb beat him bad on one rep, but otherwise kept him in check.

I think you're a little hard on McGlinchey because you really want a Whitworth-caliber OT (which you aren't going to be able to find this year or next year) and have this false sense that a player isn't worth a top 10 pick if they have a flaw. We're all going to have to come to the reality that Whitworth was a rarity and we probably won't see another OT like him in a Bengals uniform in a long time, especially being that dominant OTs coming out of college have become even more rare than before.

McGlinchey may not be BPA where the Bengals pick, but by no means would it be a terrible selection. He'd still be a big upgrade over Ogbuehi and should have a solid career in the NFL.

If a team keeps saying year after year of not taking Player X because he's "not worth that pick" and instead keep drafting pure BPA, the team could end up being in constant mediocre limbo by having some really good positions but also very weak positions.

(11-13-2017, 06:16 PM)ochocincos Wrote: In what world does "Up and down performance against Bradley Chubb" equal "struggled"? To me, up-and-down means some good, some bad. Struggled implies bad in general.
My definition of "up and down performance" is in line with what Royle said that Chubb beat him bad on one rep, but otherwise kept him in check.

I think you're a little hard on McGlinchey because you really want a Whitworth-caliber OT (which you aren't going to be able to find this year or next year) and have this false sense that a player isn't worth a top 10 pick if they have a flaw. We're all going to have to come to the reality that Whitworth was a rarity and we probably won't see another OT like him in a Bengals uniform in a long time, especially being that dominant OTs coming out of college have become even more rare than before.

McGlinchey may not be BPA where the Bengals pick, but by no means would it be a terrible selection. He'd still be a big upgrade over Ogbuehi and should have a solid career in the NFL.

If a team keeps saying year after year of not taking Player X because he's "not worth that pick" and instead keep drafting pure BPA, the team could end up being in constant mediocre limbo by having some really good positions but also very weak positions.

Oh...I'd be ok with us drafting him...but chances are as a rookie he's going to come in and give up sacks. Expectations management really.

(11-13-2017, 06:25 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Oh...I'd be ok with us drafting him...but chances are as a rookie he's going to come in and give up sacks. Expectations management really.

Not sure who would have such expectations, as that's not realistic at all.
Hell, people were writing off Jared Goff after half a season of play last year, now look at him.
Besides, if McGlinchey did struggle against Bradley Chubb, is that THAT big of a deal? Chubb has 10 sacks already this year along with 10 last year and is considered a potential top 5 pick. He's that good.
Even in the NFL, McGlinchey wouldn't go up against Chubb's talent every week.

Some people have very unrealistic expectations of rookies, especially top 5-10 picks. There isn't always some great separation in talent between a top 10 pick and a late first round pick.

(11-13-2017, 06:32 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Not sure who would have such expectations, as that's not realistic at all.
Hell, people were writing off Jared Goff after half a season of play last year, now look at him.
Besides, if McGlinchey did struggle against Bradley Chubb, is that THAT big of a deal? Chubb has 10 sacks already this year along with 10 last year and is considered a potential top 5 pick. He's that good.
Even in the NFL, McGlinchey wouldn't go up against Chubb's talent every week.

Some people have very unrealistic expectations of rookies, especially top 5-10 picks. There isn't always some great separation in talent between a top 10 pick and a late first round pick.

In all honesty, the way this draft is shaping up, picking 10-32 isn't looking that different tbh. 
You might get a "steal" because the NFL is weird about positions being drafted in certain spots but other than that...

(11-13-2017, 04:46 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: Nelson isn't going in the second round. He's probably a top 20 pick.

An interior OL is never guaranteed where he's going.  Ya, he could go top 20.......but he could also go in the 2nd round. 

(11-13-2017, 06:05 PM)bambino5130 Wrote: I am not kidding when I say EVERY draft pick should be spent on the Oline.

Maybe 2-3 starters come out of that, and I am good.

I would NOT be opposed to this plan either.


and to follow that up.......every year after, I would draft AT LEAST one OL within the first three rounds of every draft. 

(11-13-2017, 06:49 PM)BengalHawk62 Wrote: I would NOT be opposed to this plan either.


and to follow that up.......every year after, I would draft AT LEAST one OL within the first three rounds of every draft. 

Unfortunately the Bengals don't seem to value Centers and Guards. But yes...winning teams are built with good lines.

So what's the deal with either Westerman or Redmond. At 3-6, maybe we are approaching evaluation mode.

(11-13-2017, 10:51 PM)Goalpost Wrote: So what's the deal with either Westerman or Redmond.  At 3-6, maybe we are approaching evaluation mode.

Yeah...Hopkins is epically bad. I'd think they'd give either a shot. But they haven't yet.

If those guys don't see the field this year...give up on them.

(11-13-2017, 12:10 PM)Au165 Wrote: You don't judge a guy by one games, it's about a body of work. I can pull up bad games for almost every prospect in the last 10 years. I'm not saying this is the pick, but the body of work has to be viewed as a whole.

His body as a whole. Pff has a grade of 55 last 2 years on him.

(11-13-2017, 04:08 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: I stopped reading when you said trade down for a WR.

Who would u take if mcglichey or Nelson are gone? We need that extra second round pick

(11-13-2017, 04:33 PM)BengalHawk62 Wrote: The announcers were saying he's going to go in the first somewhere.  I guess his game tape is off the charts. 


But....if we could get Rankins in 1 and Q. Nelson, the guard from ND in 2......and then that C from tOSU in 3......I'd be a pretty happy camper.

Price might go in1, Nelson is a top 10 lock(compared as better than yanda) Rankin is a second rounder.

(11-13-2017, 06:44 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: In all honesty, the way this draft is shaping up, picking 10-32 isn't looking that different tbh. 
You might get a "steal" because the NFL is weird about positions being drafted in certain spots but other than that...

I felt that way about last year's draft honestly after the top 5-6 picks.

(11-14-2017, 02:13 AM)Jpoore Wrote: His body as a whole. Pff has a grade of 55 last 2 years on him.
Who would u take if mcglichey or Nelson are gone? We need that extra second round pick
Price might go in1, Nelson is a top 10 lock(compared as better than yanda) Rankin is a second rounder.

If we are to believe Marvin's comments from the John Ross article I posted last week, there wasn't anyone interested in trading up to 9 last year.
The same could happen in 2018. You cannot guarantee a trade partner.
If you can't find a willing trade partner (or you sit back and wait for someone to call you to trade like the Bengals probably did), you take who you consider your top player at that slot regardless if some people consider it a "reach" or not.

(11-14-2017, 10:29 AM)ochocincos Wrote: If we are to believe Marvin's comments from the John Ross article I posted last week, there wasn't anyone interested in trading up to 9 last year.
The same could happen in 2018. You cannot guarantee a trade partner.
If you can't find a willing trade partner (or you sit back and wait for someone to call you to trade like the Bengals probably did), you take who you consider your top player at that slot regardless if some people consider it a "reach" or not.

No one would trade up to 9. But there were trades at 10, 12, and 14.

I find it hard to believe that the Chiefs didn't call us about 9 if they traded for 10.

The trade up to 10 costed this: Buffalo traded their first-round selection (10th) to Kansas City in exchange for Kansas City's first- and third-round selections (27th and 91st), as well as their first-round selection in 2018.[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_NFL_Draft#cite_note-2017TradeTracker-8][/url]

Rueben Foster went at 31...so we could have taken him at 27. Ryan Ramczyk a Tackle from Wisconsin went at 32. Cam Robinson at 34. Forrest Lamp a G went at 38. All of those guys could have been in play at 27.

Ramczyk grades out at 80.1 right now...or as the #12 tackle in football.