(08-19-2015, 12:30 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: Well, I'm an Andy supporter, but he has always looked good in camp. He is a pretty smart QB and smart QBs always look good in camp.

The problem with Andy are his in game decisions under pressure, so we really won't know much till then.

The Giants game was a good buffer for what could be, but then again as Fred detailed in one depressing post, the Giants don't have the best defense.

At year 5, expect more of the same. Some days Andy will look like Drew Brees, other days he will look like Blake Bortles.

At the same time, I have a glimmer of hope that things will be different this year. Andy seems more mature to me, on the field and in the pressers.

Hopefully he took the next step and finally reaches his potential. Someday Andy will be a great QB in the league (instead of just good) but its hard to say which team that will be for.

My hope is that with a healthy supporting cast AD will look more like Brees than Bortles the majority of the time.  True his numbers were down quite a bit last year, but a lot of that had to do with things outside of his control (injuries mainly).

Oddly enough I was expecting a locker room video of Andy "throwing the long ball. ". Nudge, nudge. Wink, wink. Say no more, say no more.

That's what all the cool kids call it these days.

He's looking good in the locker room, too. Amirite??

Maybe they can suit Andy up in one of those red jerseys on game days.

Tiger Woods looks great on the range these days, but he can't take it to the course. I could care less what Andy looks like in camp, because his problem is between his ears. Can he "take it to the course" when they switch to live ammo?? Maybe ... I'm not saying he can't, but let's wait and see if he can establish some consistency and turn his bad days into so-so days instead of worst QB rating in 20-years days.

(08-19-2015, 10:41 PM)Utts Wrote: Tiger Woods looks great on the range these days, but he can't take it to the course. I could care less what Andy looks like in camp, because his problem is between his ears. Can he "take it to the course" when they switch to live ammo?? Maybe ... I'm not saying he can't, but let's wait and see if he can establish some consistency and turn his bad days into so-so days instead of worst QB rating in 20-years days.

Difference is that Tiger has the tools all-along, but it is strictly between his ears.

Having a better throwing motion, deep ball, velocity, etc., will help between the ears because he'll be more confident.  

You could argue that he'll still fold, but, with an improved game and healthy weapons, you have to believe that he'll have his mind right and have confidence to lead us to the NFL Promised Land.

(08-19-2015, 11:00 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: You could argue that he'll still fold, but, with an improved game and healthy weapons, you have to believe that he'll have his mind right and have confidence to lead us to the NFL Promised Land.

Why does anyone "have to believe that"? 

Considering his record and stats in playoff games, wouldn't it make more logical sense to not believe that until proven otherwise?

There's nothing that he can do in practice, preseason, or regular season games to change that.  While practice may help him accomplish that, to say that he's a better QB based on performance in training camp and 1 preseason games is a ridiculous stance, IMO.  

(08-19-2015, 11:00 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Difference is that Tiger has the tools all-along, but it is strictly between his ears.

Having a better throwing motion, deep ball, velocity, etc., will help between the ears because he'll be more confident.  

You could argue that he'll still fold, but, with an improved game and healthy weapons, you have to believe that he'll have his mind right and have confidence to lead us to the NFL Promised Land.

He can have it 'between his ears' each and every practice.  
I will believe a bit more when he shows something more in prime time and playoff games.
THAT is when I will become an excited Bengals fan.

(08-19-2015, 11:00 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Difference is that Tiger has the tools all-along, but it is strictly between his ears.

Having a better throwing motion, deep ball, velocity, etc., will help between the ears because he'll be more confident.  

You could argue that he'll still fold, but, with an improved game and healthy weapons, you have to believe that he'll have his mind right and have confidence to lead us to the NFL Promised Land.

What a weird stance. You'd rather have the guy with limited abilities because he has room to improve?  I'll take the talented guy with issues all day over the guy that not only has talent issues but also mental.

(08-19-2015, 11:18 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Why does anyone "have to believe that"? 

Considering his record and stats in playoff games, wouldn't it make more logical sense to not believe that until proven otherwise?

There's nothing that he can do in practice, preseason, or regular season games to change that.  While practice may help him accomplish that, to say that he's a better QB based on performance in training camp and 1 preseason games is a ridiculous stance, IMO.  

Because with better personal skills, along with a healthy and better team around him, he'd feel more confident to get the job done and his mind would be more focused knowing that he has his weapons out there to do work.

When you have a guy that you know will run a good route, make the catch, and possibly make a big play, you feel better and more confident than if you're throwing to the kid who got picked last at recess everyday and couldn't catch a cold.  While that may be taking it to the extreme, the principle is still the same.

(08-19-2015, 11:39 PM)Harmening Wrote: He can have it 'between his ears' each and every practice.  
I will believe a bit more when he shows something more in prime time and playoff games.
THAT is when I will become an excited Bengals fan.

Hold on to your britches because it's coming!  

I'll be at both PrimeTime home games to watch him get over that hump 

(08-19-2015, 11:58 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Because with better personal skills, along with a healthy and better team around him, he'd feel more confident to get the job done and his mind would be more focused knowing that he has his weapons out there to do work.

When you have a guy that you know will run a good route, make the catch, and possibly make a big play, you feel better and more confident than if you're throwing to the kid who got picked last at recess everyday and couldn't catch a cold.  While that may be taking it to the extreme, the principle is still the same.

Maybe.

I'm more certain that there will be a long list of excuses for him if he doesn't get it done than I am of his ability to get it done. 

This is the NFL, there are going to be injuries, drops, bad play calling, etc...

It seems that the argument here is that so long as everything else is 100% perfect, Andy is good enough to get the job done.

(08-20-2015, 12:16 AM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Maybe.

I'm more certain that there will be a long list of excuses for him if he doesn't get it done than I am of his ability to get it done. 

This is the NFL, there are going to be injuries, drops, bad play calling, etc...

It seems that the argument here is that so long as everything else is 100% perfect, Andy is good enough to get the job done.

How could this guy ever be considered good?

first 5 playoff games have 1 TD to 6 INTs
only have over 50% completion percentage once in those playoff games
never have over 200 yards in any of those playoff games
two of those playoff games he has a passer rating of 10, and 18.2

(08-20-2015, 12:16 AM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Maybe.

I'm more certain that there will be a long list of excuses for him if he doesn't get it done than I am of his ability to get it done. 

This is the NFL, there are going to be injuries, drops, bad play calling, etc...

It seems that the argument here is that so long as everything else is 100% perfect, Andy is good enough to get the job done.

I don't think it has to be 100%, but how about 75% or 80%?

Last year, it was, what, AJ, Hill, Marvin, Eifert, and Gresham?  That leaves us with Sanu?  So he was missing 80 or 85% of his common targets?  If you want to throw in Gio, that's still somewhere around 70% of his usual targets.  (I realize Hill isn't a common target, but he's more important to the offense than any one of those other guys on their own.)

It's hard to win when you have those odds against you.

(08-20-2015, 12:52 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: How could this guy ever be considered good?

first 5 playoff games have 1 TD to 6 INTs
only have over 50% completion percentage once in those playoff games
never have over 200 yards in any of those playoff games
two of those playoff games he has a passer rating of 10, and 18.2

The offense has averaged 9 points per game in his 4 games, yet I continually hear more blame on the defense than on the offense.

Apparently we'll have a great chance at winning if we can hold another playoff team to a TD or less.  

(08-20-2015, 12:54 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: I don't think it has to be 100%, but how about 75% or 80%?

Last year, it was, what, AJ, Hill, Marvin, Eifert, and Gresham?  That leaves us with Sanu?  So he was missing 80 or 85% of his common targets?  If you want to throw in Gio, that's still somewhere around 70% of his usual targets.  (I realize Hill isn't a common target, but he's more important to the offense than any one of those other guys on their own.)

It's hard to win when you have those odds against you.

Yes, the injuries to Green, Eifert, and MLJ definitely had an impact on the Indy game last year....but that team got smoked in Indy last year with Green and Andy played every bit as bad. 

If Andy had a history of playing well in the playoffs and had one bad game you could say he deserves the benefit of the doubt. 

I don't believe he deserves that much benefit of the doubt considering his overall record and performance in the playoffs. 

Throw out last year's numbers and it doesn't make him look any better overall.  

(08-20-2015, 12:55 AM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: The offense has averaged 9 points per game in his 4 games, yet I continually hear more blame on the defense than on the offense.

Apparently we'll have a great chance at winning if we can hold another playoff team to a TD or less.  

Oh, no I was talking about Joe Flacco. The funny thing is that he won 3 of those 5 games when he had those kind of stats.

(08-20-2015, 12:58 AM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Yes, the injuries to Green, Eifert, and MLJ definitely had an impact on the Indy game last year....but that team got smoked in Indy last year with Green and Andy played every bit as bad. 

If Andy had a history of playing well in the playoffs and had one bad game you could say he deserves the benefit of the doubt. 

I don't believe he deserves that much benefit of the doubt considering his overall record and performance in the playoffs. 

Throw out last year's numbers and it doesn't make him look any better overall.  

Actually Dalton didn't have Green the first time we played the Colts last year.

The problem with Andy in primetime slash playoff game is we throw the ball more than we run it. He is not a great Qb and I feel that this team sometimes puts to much on his plate. Needless to say I don't think what he does now in training camp  will help that much if we abandoned  the running game once again in January. 
2014
35 Pass attempts to 21 rush attempts
2013
51 pass attempts to 25 rush attempts
2012
30 pass attempts to 16 rush attempts
2011
42  Pass attempts to 19 rush attempts

(08-20-2015, 01:03 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Oh, no I was talking about Joe Flacco. The funny thing is that he won 3 of those 5 games when he had those kind of stats.

So we should stick with Dalton because Flacco can win 3 out of 5 with similar crappy numbers?

Excellent take.  

(08-20-2015, 01:08 AM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: So we should stick with Dalton because Flacco can win 3 out of 5 with similar crappy numbers?

Excellent take.  

or maybe what I got out of that is it's a team sport, and one player doesn't actually effect the outcome of the game if everyone actually plays as good as what their supposed to.