Big Ben in crunch time – hard counts, defenders react, Ben now knows he has man coverage or Zone, signals to his receivers & team what to do now pre snap, then aggressively carves the Defense for another Last second clutch win. Walks off the Field for an interview.

Repeat next game.

Contrast this to what the Bengals appear to be doing in Crunch time which is call a play and run the play. Far less aggressive than Big Ben in crunch time. Lacking the Confidence and communication needed to let our QB get reads on what the Defense is about to do and then adjusting pre snap to attack the Defense. The Bengals seem to be in the hoping we can run out the Clock before they beat us mind frame in Crunch time while Big Ben and other Great QBs are hard counting Defenses & aggressively looking for Tells from those Defenses to allow them to audible Crunch time attacks.

Big Ben did this again last night against the Ravens and Luck has little to do with the Steelers success. They are outsmarting their opponents and have Crunch time down to a Science.

The Bengals seem to call plays while keeping an eye on the game clock hoping for a first down or two. Call it and run it more often than not, many times right into the Teeth of what the Defense is doing.

We make them use their Timeouts when we are on Offense in Crunch time as we 3 and out our way to another loss.

Ben, Rodgers, Peyton and Brady get pre snap reads on the Defenses in Crunch time and this gives them the Confidence to be Aggressive with audibles that Expose the Defense in the most important seconds of the game. Antonio Brown knows right where to be based on these reads & audibles and they take the Candy from the Baby.

In Crunch Time, our Coaches are calling plays to "execute" while their QBs are reading & PLAYING the Defenses.

Then we say again that we were only so many seconds away from running out the Clock and surpassing the Steelers. We will get them next time but we won't because they have The Crunch Time Formula.

(12-11-2017, 01:28 PM)depthchart Wrote: Big Ben in crunch time – hard counts, defenders react, Ben now knows he has man coverage or Zone, signals to his receivers & team what to do now pre snap, then aggressively carves the Defense for another Last second clutch win. Walks off the Field for an interview.

Repeat next game.

Contrast this to what the Bengals appear to be doing in Crunch time which is call a play and run the play. Far less aggressive than Big Ben in crunch time. Lacking the Confidence and communication needed to let our QB get reads on what the Defense is about to do and then adjusting pre snap to attack the Defense. The Bengals seem to be in the hoping we can run out the Clock before they beat us mind frame in Crunch time while Big Ben and other Great QBs are hard counting Defenses & aggressively looking for Tells from those Defenses to allow them to audible Crunch time attacks.

Big Ben did this again last night against the Ravens and Luck has little to do with the Steelers success. They are outsmarting their opponents and have Crunch time down to a Science.

The Bengals seem to call plays while keeping an eye on the game clock hoping for a first down or two. Call it and run it more often than not, many times right into the Teeth of what the Defense is doing.

We make them use their Timeouts when we are on Offense in Crunch time as we 3 and out our way to another loss.

Ben, Rodgers, Peyton and Brady get pre snap reads on the Defenses in Crunch time and this gives them the Confidence to be Aggressive with audibles that Expose the Defense in the most important seconds of the game. Antonio Brown knows right where to be based on these reads & audibles and they take the Candy from the Baby.

In Crunch Time, our Coaches are calling plays to "execute" while their QBs are reading & PLAYING the Defenses.

Then we say again that we were only so many seconds away from running out the Clock and surpassing the Steelers. We will get them next time but we won't because they have The Crunch Time Formula.

Interesting observation.  I recall in 2015, when Hue Jackson was our OC, we allowed the QB to make such reads, and tore defenses a new one.  Reports all over the league were that Dalton was getting very good at pre-snap reads, etc.  Now, as you noted, we don't do that.  I wonder what the difference is?  New receivers?  Line issues? QB regression?  Bad coaching?

(12-11-2017, 01:36 PM)Wyche Wrote: Interesting observation.  I recall in 2015, when Hue Jackson was our OC, we allowed the QB to make such reads, and tore defenses a new one.  Reports all over the league were that Dalton was getting very good at pre-snap reads, etc.  Now, as you noted, we don't do that.  I wonder what the difference is?  New receivers?  Line issues? QB regression?  Bad coaching?

Just a theory, but maybe Marv is very controlling when it comes to the offense?

It seems Hue was the only one with a backbone and therefore had more control of his own offense than Marv typically allows.

Every other OC only allowed minimal control at the line...even Brat with Palmer.

Ravens screwed up the defense last night. They were up by 2 scores and played Prevent - played not to lose. We should be masters at detecting that by now.

(12-11-2017, 01:40 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Just a theory, but maybe Marv is very controlling when it comes to the offense?

It seems Hue was the only one with a backbone and therefore had more control of his own offense than Marv typically allows.

Every other OC only allowed minimal control at the line...even Brat with Palmer.

Well, it may be more than a theory, according to what Bill Lazor had to say earlier in the season.....and going off of the past.

I remember toward the end of the 3rd quarter yesterday the Bengals were backed up against the goal line. On the first two downs they attempted to throw the ball deep...twice. Marvin Lewis too aggressive?

(12-11-2017, 01:36 PM)Wyche Wrote: Interesting observation.  I recall in 2015, when Hue Jackson was our OC, we allowed the QB to make such reads, and tore defenses a new one.  Reports all over the league were that Dalton was getting very good at pre-snap reads, etc.  Now, as you noted, we don't do that.  I wonder what the difference is?  New receivers?  Line issues? QB regression?  Bad coaching?

It is like being in a War type Battle from a Strategy standpoint.

You need Real Time read and react Decision making ability.

The QB has to be The General on the Field with the Authority to read & react on the Fly and be able to effectively Communicate that to his players in Real Time.

The Bengals seem to have a Sideline General that sends in a Play to execute. Players then run that play right into the Teeth of the Defense. Then the Sideline General gets to say that the players Failed to "execute" in Crunch Time.

Meanwhile, Big Ben is hard counting etc to get a READ on the Defense, then audibles if man or Zone, then Antonio Brown & others do exactly what is needed to attack that Defense with the game on the line.

Ben is TOTALLY CONFIDENT because he is getting an Edge in Real Time. It has become easy for him and it doesn't take a Rocket Scientist to see why.

The Bengals must adopt this attack with Confidence in Crunch Time approach because we get pre snap reads then audible or we will never Sniff a Super Bowl.

To me this is All Coaching. Delegation of Power to an On Field General. Mastering what Big Ben and other Great QBs have Mastered even if it takes some time and Pain along the way to get there.

They mentioned 4 Walk Off Field Goal recent wins by the Steelers. (versus Packers, Colts, Bengals & Ravens I believe they said)

No accident here. Not LUCK.

The On Field General Big Ben, read the Defenses and reacted to take what they gave them, in real Time, pre-snap.

Took the Candy from the Babies.

(12-11-2017, 01:47 PM)Synric Wrote: I remember toward the end of the 3rd quarter yesterday the Bengals were backed up against the goal line. On the first two downs they attempted to throw the ball deep...twice. Marvin Lewis too aggressive?

The question is:  Did Andy have the ability to assess the Defense and audible to something better or not during those 2 pass plays ?

                                     -OR-

         Were they running those plays no matter what ? (even if the Coverage/Defense seemed to counter those type of plays pre-snap)



  Can Andy audible to AJ to react say to man or Zone coverage the way Big Ben and Antonio Brown are doing?  


  Or are we just running plays more often than not ?  (especially in Crunch Time)

(12-11-2017, 02:13 PM)depthchart Wrote: The question is:  Did Andy have the ability to assess the Defense and audible to something better or not during those 2 pass plays ?

                                     -OR-

         Were they running those plays no matter what ? (even if the Coverage/Defense seemed to counter those type of plays pre-snap)



  Can Andy audible to AJ to react say to man or Zone coverage the way Big Ben and Antonio Brown are doing?  


  Or are we just running plays more often than not ?  (especially in Crunch Time)

The defense the Bears ran were giving them alot of looks 1 on 1 man against AJ Green.

Well to me it looked like Andy was off today and AJ was half assing alot of his routes. In fact it looked like most of thr team was not really giving it alot of passion...Outside of Evans who was getting irritated over getting beat regularly.

Last week against the Steelers after thr game I mentioned in another thread it looked like Andy had alot more control over the offense than he has had all year. Of course he was checking in and out of runs because they were running well.

(12-11-2017, 02:19 PM)Synric Wrote: The defense the Bears ran were giving them alot of looks 1 on 1 man against AJ Green.

Well to me it looked like Andy was off today and AJ was half assing alot of his routes. In fact it looked like most of thr team was not really giving it alot of passion...Outside of Evans who was getting irritated over getting beat regularly.

Last week against the Steelers after thr game I mentioned in another thread it looked like Andy had alot more control over the offense than he has had all year. Of course he was checking in and out of runs because they were running well.

That Ravens game last night was Text Book Big Ben in Charge and making adjustments on the Fly.

Down 9 points in the 4th quarter.

Read the Defense and react to what they are giving to win by 1 point. His teammates like Antonio reacting with him.

Communication between players. Changing plays at the Line.

Tomlin and the Offensive Coordinator are not the Master Minds of these Wins. They are Wise enough to defer to Ben who is on the Field.

They may suggest an initial play but Ben is taking it from there in Crunch Time.

As you imply, I think Andy has some simpler, more limited reads that he can check to at times but it seems it is nothing like what Ben is doing.

(12-11-2017, 01:36 PM)Wyche Wrote: Interesting observation.  I recall in 2015, when Hue Jackson was our OC, we allowed the QB to make such reads, and tore defenses a new one.  Reports all over the league were that Dalton was getting very good at pre-snap reads, etc.  Now, as you noted, we don't do that.  I wonder what the difference is?  New receivers?  Line issues? QB regression?  Bad coaching?

Hue was too cute with his playcalling.  I'm pumped about the change to Zampese because he's going to be more likely to keep it simple and hand the ball to Hill, which is really what this team needs to establish a winning formula for years to come.

Woah, sorry about that...I was having a flashback to 3 years ago.  I'm ok now.

(12-11-2017, 03:03 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Hue was too cute with his playcalling.  I'm pumped about the change to Zampese because he's going to be more likely to keep it simple and hand the ball to Hill, which is really what this team needs to establish a winning formula for years to come.

Woah, sorry about that...I was having a flashback to 3 years ago.  I'm ok now.

LOL.....I hear ya.  FWIW, I loved Hue's "cuteness".  Sure, it burned us a time or two, but I'll take that river boat gambler any day of the week, and five times on Sunday over conservation.

We will never in our life times see Dalton do that

(12-11-2017, 02:55 PM)depthchart Wrote: That Ravens game last night was Text Book Big Ben in Charge and making adjustments on the Fly.

Down 9 points in the 4th quarter.

Read the Defense and react to what they are giving to win by 1 point. His teammates like Antonio reacting with him.

Communication between players. Changing plays at the Line.

Tomlin and the Offensive Coordinator are not the Master Minds of these Wins. They are Wise enough to defer to Ben who is on the Field.

They may suggest an initial play but Ben is taking it from there in Crunch Time.

As you imply, I think Andy has some simpler, more limited reads that he can check to at times but it seems it is nothing like what Ben is doing.

That was a knock on Lazor in Miami. He didn't let Tannehill have alot of control over the offense.

(12-11-2017, 01:40 PM)Interceptor Wrote: Ravens screwed up the defense last night. They were up by 2 scores and played Prevent - played not to lose. We should be masters at detecting that by now.

Hmm. I didn't watch last night, but when I looked at my phone in the 3rd quarter, Ben had a normal looking amount of yardage. I was blown away when I checked later and saw that he finished 44 of 66 for over 500 yards. Guess prevent would explain the sudden surge.

(12-11-2017, 01:42 PM)Wyche Wrote: Well, it may be more than a theory, according to what Bill Lazor had to say earlier in the season.....and going off of the past.

True true. Man I really hope we get an offensive minded coach next. Or at least a gutsy coach like Ron Rivera.

(12-11-2017, 04:08 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Hmm. I didn't watch last night, but when I looked at my phone in the 3rd quarter, Ben had a normal looking amount of yardage. I was blown away when I checked later and saw that he finished 44 of 66 for over 500 yards. Guess prevent would explain the sudden surge.


True true. Man I really hope we get an offensive minded coach next. Or at least a gutsy coach like Ron Rivera.

The Ravens were mixing things up, however, Ben would recognize whether Zone or man to man coverage, then communicate with Antonio Brown pre snap and then Brown would either set himself right in the soft spots of the Zones or take on his one on one coverage deep, middle or short. Other receivers, backs etc also joining in and knowing what to do.

Ben & Brown were totally on the same page and simply knew what the coverage was pre snap.  Ben would hard count or find other clues as to coverage. Then changed into the right play for it.

Real time communication and execution.

Steelers O line seems to wear out the opposing team's pass rush as the game goes on. Bell banging against them may have something to do with that as well. Late in games this year, it just seems like Rothlesberger has his way late, including against the Bengals

(12-11-2017, 04:50 PM)depthchart Wrote: The Ravens were mixing things up, however, Ben would recognize whether Zone or man to man coverage, then communicate with Antonio Brown pre snap and then Brown would either set himself right in the soft spots of the Zones or take on his one on one coverage deep, middle or short. Other receivers, backs etc also joining in and knowing what to do.

Ben & Brown were totally on the same page and simply knew what the coverage was pre snap.  Ben would hard count or find other clues as to coverage. Then changed into the right play for it.

Real time communication and execution.

I think every QB should be able to have that kind of control, as long as he knows the offense well...which Dalton always has supposedly.

Crunch time for the Bengals is Marvin with his tail between his legs with Mikey Boy asleep on the sofa in the
luxury box his father left him...asleep at the switch for 27+ years.

(12-11-2017, 05:36 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I think every QB should be able to have that kind of control, as long as he knows the offense well...which Dalton always has supposedly.

Dalton needs to be like John Moxon and just call what play he wants. Screw Coach Kilmer!
(Varsity Blues, anyone?)