(12-11-2017, 01:07 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: We're 11-17-1 (.397) over the last 2 seasons, so we're kinda going through the 90's again WITH Merv.

We all know any coach here will have a giant Mike Brown shaped anchor around his neck, but Marvin Lewis found a way to make it work, so it must not be rocket science.

Merv just couldn't get his teams to perform in crunch time.

This. It's not like we were complete shit under Marv. Small scouting department, delusional selfish owner and all. Marv made it work... At 1:00 anyway. Making the playoffs five years in row despite consistent ass-kickings in Primetime and (usually) two losses a year to perennial AFC north monster Pittsburgh is nothing to scoff at. But those failures under pressure have everything to do with gameday coaching, and nothing to do with the front office. 

Although it's inexcusable that Mike kept Marvin on this long

(12-11-2017, 03:29 AM)Utts Wrote: Glad to see this seems to be the prevailing opinion on the subject. I hope drunks at PBS don’t treat him like garbage in his last home game.

Agreed. It's not Marvins fault ownership has never held him accountable. 

(12-11-2017, 02:24 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: Agreed. It's not Marvins fault ownership has never held him accountable. 

Yeah I view him as more a symptom of the problem rather than the root cause.

(12-11-2017, 02:22 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: This. It's not like we were complete shit under Marv. Small scouting department, delusional selfish owner and all. Marv made it work... At 1:00 anyway. Making the playoffs five years in row despite consistent ass-kickings in Primetime and (usually) two losses a year to perennial AFC north monster Pittsburgh is nothing to scoff at. But those failures under pressure have everything to do with gameday coaching, and nothing to do with the front office. 

Although it's inexcusable that Mike kept Marvin on this long

IF you worked for an employer who you knew was cheap and took shortcuts that other companys in your field too...it would wear you down too.

(12-11-2017, 01:15 AM)Pat5775 Wrote: I feel like something similar happened with the John Ross draft choice... Maybe the pacman extension as well

Me too....I said this in another thread.

Has then been an owner in any sport with such a futile list of accomplishments as Mikey Boy?

A bare faced liar from the start (firing Sam) he has fleeced this city of hundreds of millions of dollars
which can never be recouped. The city could have built a domed type stadium and had an untold
amount of events drawing countless dollars - but Scrooge McDickhead insisted on an outdoor stadium.

Screw Mike Brown - he's a liar and a thief and has produced NOTHING in 27+ years except higher taxes.

I honestly don't think I'll ever forget that Steelers playoff meltdown.

It was just a mere playoff game but ripped my damn heart right out of my body.

That was just as bad as watching the team in the 90s.

It took embarrassment to a whole new level.

What's worse?? No talent no wins... or losing epically with talent?

The ONLY THING that will change this franchise will be the day the old geezer starts pushing daisies and feeding magots ..
They were sort of on to a decent run for a while, but couldn't sustain it and it's exactly how sewage works. Shit always flows downhill and contaminates everything under it. 
I'm in no way convinced that the rest of the family will do one damned bit better after the son of p is gone and no coaching change will make any of that magically go away. 
Now it is possible the family will hire a GM, but there's been nothing done or said that would indicate that they plan to even do that much. They've all gotten fabulously wealthy by essentially doing nothing but being bottom feeders. 
I really have no reason to still care about this team, but I've followed them my entire life and have seen nothing to tell me they plan to change anything. The league provides them with enough money that they don't have to care if the team wins or loses. 
I'm convinced that the whole family sold out long ago. They're paid as caretakers and really nothing more. It's like getting willed an entire fleet of super high performance automobiles and one by one running them all till the wheels literally fall off then abandoning them by the side of the road, taking a taxi home then starting over with the next car..absolutely no maintenance done by anyone and just in case they ever start running out of cars the league gives them at least 7 new cars every year and pays for all the gas.. 
I'm convinced that at some point in time the ownership cut some deal and agreed to be the team the big market teams could always beat come crunch time. There's never been a plan since to actually produce an actual post season winner. They're ok with letting them get to the playoffs, but that's the highest they're ever going to get because of this nefarious arrangement..

I watched just about every game during that decade if you lived thru that decade as a fan you are pretty much a fan for life. I was all for the Marvin move then and he changed things around the Bengals a great deal I will always be grateful for that. That being said Marvin has taken us as far as he is able we have plateaued and our progress has come to a screeching halt. In order to advance further we need an Offensive minded coach that believes in building all aspects of the team Offense Defense and Special Teams. We need an aggressive coach and playing style on both sides of the ball. Enough of the bend don't break D and the check down O. We need to push the ball down the field in this passing league to keep pace with the other teams and not give up 400 to 500 yards a game. Most of all we need fresh blood at coach someone that will coach with passion and not just settle for mediocre play. It is time to move on from Marvin and I think it is time for Marvin to move on from the Bengals. He can retire a few years then come back into coaching or hook up with another team right away. I wish him success as long as he aint playing against my Bengals team.

(12-11-2017, 10:52 PM)grampahol Wrote: The ONLY THING that will change this franchise will be the day the old geezer starts pushing daisies and feeding magots ..

What is wrong with you? 

I just don't understand why anyone at this point. can excuse Marvin's poor coaching. Don't you find it ironic the day after Marvin's last extension Carson demanded to be traded or was retiring. The first 10 years Marvin refused to take a free play when the defense jumped offsides. The QB would be instructed to take a knee most high school coaches are not that ignorant. We have seen Marvin constantly regardless of talent treat a 1 point lead like it's 50. Not to mention all the stupid penalties we have at the most inappropriate times . Carson wasn't even allowed to call audibles or even call a timeout. Not to mention second half collapses. Playing inferior to talent longer than he should. Yes from 1992 to 1999 the front office was a absolute dumpster fire. I think at least half the NFL coaches in the league would love to have our roster compared to theirs. Marvin isn't putting talent in proper position to succeed.

(12-11-2017, 12:43 AM)Pat5775 Wrote: You may be right but who really knows? Those other coaches had very little talent to work with. 

And it comes down to who makes the decision on who to draft.

(12-11-2017, 06:54 PM)Rattler Wrote: Has then been an owner in any sport with such a futile list of accomplishments as Mikey Boy?

I don't know; one could make the argument that Donald Sterling is worse, or so I've heard.

I forget sometimes that a lot of you guys weren’t here for the 90’s. Most of you just came around during the Lewis/Palmer/dalton years. So as I think of this it does educate me on why so many of you want a change when this is the only thing you know.

All I can say is be careful what you wish for....... yes we need a change but the same rational was used when everyone complained about Sam Wyche.

(12-11-2017, 08:51 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: I honestly don't think I'll ever forget that Steelers playoff meltdown.

It was just a mere playoff game but ripped my damn heart right out of my body.

That was just as bad as watching the team in the 90s.

It took embarrassment to a whole new level.

What's worse??  No talent no wins...  or losing epically with talent?

Closest I've come to shedding tears over a football game. Like my Dad used to say, the Bengals snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

(12-12-2017, 12:48 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: I forget sometimes that a lot of you guys weren’t here for the 90’s.   Most of you just came around during the Lewis/Palmer/dalton years.     So as I think of this it does educate me on why so many of you want a change when this is the only thing you know.    

All I can say is be careful what you wish for.......   yes we need a change but the same rational was used when everyone complained about Sam Wyche.

This is kinda silly. I was around for the 90's and want Marv out. Wyche was seconds away from a championship. Marv is 0-7 in the playoffs and basically .500 as a HC.

What do we have to fear? Going 6-10? We're already doing that. 2 years in a row now. Are we not going to win a playoff game for 15 years? Already done that.

It's mind-boggling the support Marv is getting lately. It's as if people are traumatized and not thinking clearly.

(12-12-2017, 02:02 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: This is kinda silly. I was around for the 90's and want Marv out. Wyche was seconds away from a championship. Marv is 0-7 in the playoffs and basically .500 as a HC.

What do we have to fear? Going 6-10? We're already doing that. 2 years in a row now. Are we not going to win a playoff game for 15 years? Already done that.

It's mind-boggling the support Marv is getting lately. It's as if people are traumatized and not thinking clearly.

It's like battered-wife syndrome. 

I was around for the 90's as well and I'm more than ready to move on from Marv.

(12-12-2017, 02:28 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: It's like battered-wife syndrome. 

I was around for the 90's as well and I'm more than ready to move on from Marv.

I liked the comparison someone on here made recently. They said that the 90's are like the previous girlfriend that beat you and stole your money, while the Marvin era is like the crappy mediocre girlfriend that doesn't beat you, but doesn't do anything for you either.

Some don't want to leave the mediocre GF because they're afraid the next GF will beat them again.

Or something like that.

(12-12-2017, 12:48 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: I forget sometimes that a lot of you guys weren’t here for the 90’s.   Most of you just came around during the Lewis/Palmer/dalton years.     So as I think of this it does educate me on why so many of you want a change when this is the only thing you know.    

All I can say is be careful what you wish for.......   yes we need a change but the same rational was used when everyone complained about Sam Wyche.

Wow! Great post.

I think we can blame Marvin for the 0-7 in the playoffs.

But...these past 2 years? We've LOST a lot of quality free agents and the drafted guys haven't adequately replaced them. The blame goes on whoever is doing the drafting and scouting. And possibly the structure of the scouting department with so few scouts.

(12-12-2017, 12:48 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: I forget sometimes that a lot of you guys weren’t here for the 90’s.   Most of you just came around during the Lewis/Palmer/dalton years.     So as I think of this it does educate me on why so many of you want a change when this is the only thing you know.    

All I can say is be careful what you wish for.......   yes we need a change but the same rational was used when everyone complained about Sam Wyche.

In fairness, it's not like wanting a change after 15 years is exactly a knee jerk reaction or just change for the sake of change.

At this point, I think it's better for everyone involved to go in a different direction and try something new.