(01-04-2018, 05:01 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: People are stretching to find reasons for hope. It's pretty typical for Bengals fans, as the FO rarely provides real reasons for hope, so people make up happy narratives in their heads.

Here's the hard truth:

1. There has been no major change. No power shift. There is no proof that Marv suddenly has unprecedented control, and tbh, haven't people been saying "Marvin has control" for many years now? This is getting sad.

2. We aren't really making sweeping changes to the coaching staff. It looks like Paul Alexander FINALLY did enough bad things in consecutive seasons to get the pink slip. Guenther wants out. From everything I've read, we'll take him back with open arms if he doesn't land that lateral move. Many things seem off about that, but whatev.

Anything else? No?

3. Don't fall for the FA talk...AGAIN. Marvin said the same stuff a couple years back and we wound up bringing back Michael Johnson and signing a washed up AJ Hawk. This talk always seems to happen before season ticket renewal letters are sent out. Hmm...

------------------------

The Mike Brown Bengals rely on HOPE to sell tickets/merch. We need to stop hoping and take a "prove it" stance.

All of the demonstrable evidence concludes that Brown is inept and that Lewis is mediocre, yet the HOPE and DESIRE that they can somehow overcome their own inadequacies is enough to fuel optimism within the masses. 

(01-04-2018, 05:23 PM)Dark-Net-Axon Wrote: All of the demonstrable evidence concludes that Brown is inept and that Lewis is mediocre, yet the HOPE and DESIRE that they can somehow overcome their own inadequacies is enough to fuel optimism within the masses. 

Something like that.  

People want to believe.

(01-04-2018, 05:01 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: 3. Don't fall for the FA talk...AGAIN. Marvin said the same stuff a couple years back and we wound up bringing back Michael Johnson and signing a washed up AJ Hawk. This talk always seems to happen before season ticket renewal letters are sent out. Hmm...

------------------------

The Mike Brown Bengals rely on HOPE to sell tickets/merch. We need to stop hoping and take a "prove it" stance.

(01-04-2018, 05:11 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Completely correct on 3 Shake, not holding my breath on FA.

I'm not betting my last dollar on it, but was he giggling when he said it last time?

Has he ever sounded this serious when he said it?  He sounds like he's in the final step before desperation/giving up, where he's just thinking "no more BS.......  time to buckle down and get it done."

(01-04-2018, 05:50 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: I'm not betting my last dollar on it, but was he giggling when he said it last time?

Has he ever sounded this serious when he said it?  He sounds like he's in the final step before desperation/giving up, where he's just thinking "no more BS.......  time to buckle down and get it done."

Id bet a few dollars marvin has more control in free agency now.

(01-04-2018, 05:50 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: I'm not betting my last dollar on it, but was he giggling when he said it last time?

Has he ever sounded this serious when he said it?  He sounds like he's in the final step before desperation/giving up, where he's just thinking "no more BS.......  time to buckle down and get it done."

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2015/2/19/8073347/bengals-head-coach-marvin-lewis-insists-that-change-is-coming
https://www.cincyjungle.com/2015/1/21/7869339/marvin-lewis-hints-that-change-is-coming

Quote:This organization is charging hard with change, with Mike Brown playing the role of General Custer. Marvin Lewis is the voice and face of an organization that wants us to believe that things are going to be different.

"Oh yeah, (Mike Brown) is the one leading the charge," Lewis said last month. "He doesn't want to hear, 'We will be better when we get these guys back.' No, we need to get better. He knows we need to get better. He's pushing people to identify players that will make us a better football team in free agency."

"It's a different feel than where we have been," Lewis said. "It's not a status quo. There has not been a status quo conversation or 'Oh, we'll be OK, we'll just get these guys back.' No, no, no, that's bull. We got to be better."

(01-04-2018, 05:18 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Where did you read that? Not questioning you, I just wasn't aware there was in-fighting.

As Joelist says here, the Marv/Lazor presser. We are reading into it but it makes more sense to me when i read some of
the comments that PA didn't like the adjustments Lazor was asking to be made. Speaking of having all the coaches being
able to give their opinions and getting over it and being a family.

Sounds to me like PA and Lazor were butting heads and somehow Lazor won out with Marv's help.

This makes sense to me as PA has always been one stubborn sumbitch...

(01-04-2018, 05:23 PM)Joelist Wrote: Hi Shake!

We're getting it from the transcript of the Marvin-Lazor joint presser. Granted there is a bit of reading in involved but Lazor has comments that only really make sense if he was the one who pushed through the blocking scheme change. That is also where the comments were made that lead us to think there was a behind the scenes dispute going on.

Precisely.

PA has never been a coach to adjust his line midseason either. Boling actually was quoted last year that PA doesn't
even coach up his guys midseason.

(01-04-2018, 05:52 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Id bet a few dollars marvin has more control in free agency now.

That's what it sounds like, and we've heard before that Marvin has more control, but this sounds like the BS is over and Marvin is getting control to bring in players to be a winner, which plays into more about my thoughts of him looking more serious because he knows that it's on him now, so he can't just giggle at serious questions.

But I know better than to bank on it right now...... I see better than I hear.

(01-04-2018, 06:02 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: https://www.cincyjungle.com/2015/2/19/8073347/bengals-head-coach-marvin-lewis-insists-that-change-is-coming
https://www.cincyjungle.com/2015/1/21/7869339/marvin-lewis-hints-that-change-is-coming

Exactly........  and that's what I said when I started the thread: this has a different feel to it.

(01-04-2018, 05:01 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: People are stretching to find reasons for hope. It's pretty typical for Bengals fans, as the FO rarely provides real reasons for hope, so people make up happy narratives in their heads.

I've been guilty of it myself.

Here's the hard truth:

1. There has been no major change. No power shift. There is no proof that Marv suddenly has unprecedented control, and tbh, haven't people been saying "Marvin has control" for many years now? This is getting sad.

2. We aren't really making sweeping changes to the coaching staff. It looks like Paul Alexander FINALLY did enough bad things in consecutive seasons to get the pink slip. Guenther wants out. From everything I've read, we'll take him back with open arms if he doesn't land that lateral move. Many things seem off about that, but whatev.

Anything else? No?

3. Don't fall for the FA talk...AGAIN. Marvin said the same stuff a couple years back and we wound up bringing back Michael Johnson and signing a washed up AJ Hawk. This talk always seems to happen before season ticket renewal letters are sent out. Hmm...

------------------------

The Mike Brown Bengals rely on HOPE to sell tickets/merch. We need to stop hoping and take a "prove it" stance.

The fans are as predictable as Mike Brown. We just ended a horrible season (again) and some are ALREADY reaching for a reason to believe. We both know once some time has passed (like a bad breakup with a gf/bf) and the draft happens people will be predicting a 10-6 record or better because Lazor will have time to build up a great offense...and any other bullshit you can think of. 

In all honesty the stupidity is as annoying as Mike Brown and his lazy decisions!

(01-04-2018, 07:12 PM)GodFather Wrote: The fans are as predictable as Mike Brown. We just ended a horrible season (again) and some are ALREADY reaching for a reason to believe. We both know once some time has passed (like a bad breakup with a gf/bf) and the draft happens people will be predicting a 10-6 record or better because Lazor will have time to build up a great offense...and any other bullshit you can think of. 

In all honesty the stupidity is as annoying as Mike Brown and his lazy decisions!

Hey man, shut it, PA is gone, big damn step.

Bad enough Marv is still here but your bitching is annoying and so was that shit yesterday when you posted
that Bullshit about PA not being gone. That was low.

Low i tell yah.

Nothing wrong with the OP being excited about the Press Conference. But misery loves company so many will try to shine it in a poor light.

As to me; there were some things that Marvin said that I liked and I will not doubt they will happen.

Sorry, but I'm not excited...at least not yet. I've said before and I still say this team needed to completely clean house, and bring in all new coaches, new philosophy, new culture. The Mikey and Marv show has been running the same way for 15 years...fifteen years! Think all you've been through in that time period. 

After 15 years, up until a few days ago, the status quo of this team has been the same. Now the next day, all of a sudden, everything is completely different??

When you do the same thing, the same way, for 15 years, that's pretty much who you are. The X's and O's may change a bit, but Marv's culture stays the same. 

It's going to take a little more than a couple new coaches and a fuzzy presser for me to get excited.   I mean, what did anyone expect him to say? "yeah, we've had some very disappointing seasons, so Mike and I decided the best approach was to do nothing".
Has Mike Brown given a press conference on this yet? He's the one I really want to hear from, so he can clarify how things are going to be so different this time.

I like Marv, but I still say, if there was any team that needed to go in the proverbial 'new direction', it was the Bengals.

What's that definition of insanity again?

(01-04-2018, 07:51 PM)BMK Wrote: Sorry, but I'm not excited. I've said before and I still say this team needed to completely clean house, and bring in all new coaches, new philosophy, new culture. The Mikey and Marv show has been running the same way for 15 years...fifteen years! Think all you've been through in that time period. 

After 15 years, up until last week, the status quo of this team has been the same. Now this week, all of a sudden, everything is completely different??

When you do the same thing, the same way, for 15 years, that's pretty much who you are. The X's and O's may change a bit, but Marv's culture stays the same. 

It's going to take a little more than a couple new coaches and a fuzzy presser for me to get excited. Now, I have no choice but to just hope for the best....as usual. 

I like Marv, but I still say, if there was any team that needed to go in the proverbial 'new direction', it was the Bengals.

What's that definition of insanity again?

That's what we're saying, though, that this looks like a new direction and a new culture.

I know not to put all my eggs in one basket, but it sounds like Marvin made some demands in his contract negotiations and he knows that it's time to make it happen.

(01-04-2018, 07:51 PM)BMK Wrote: Sorry, but I'm not excited...at least not yet.  I've said before and I still say this team needed to completely clean house, and bring in all new coaches, new philosophy, new culture. The Mikey and Marv show has been running the same way for 15 years...fifteen years! Think all you've been through in that time period. 

After 15 years, up until a few days ago, the status quo of this team has been the same. Now the next day, all of a sudden, everything is completely different??

When you do the same thing, the same way, for 15 years, that's pretty much who you are. The X's and O's may change a bit, but Marv's culture stays the same. 

It's going to take a little more than a couple new coaches and a fuzzy presser for me to get excited.   I mean, what did anyone expect him to say? "yeah, we've had some very disappointing seasons, so Mike and I decided the best approach was to do nothing".
Has Mike Brown given a press conference on this yet? He's the one I really want to hear from, so he can clarify how things are going to be so different this time.

I like Marv, but I still say, if there was any team that needed to go in the proverbial 'new direction', it was the Bengals.

What's that definition of insanity again?

All completely understandable. But if they were truly insane they would of brought the O-line coach back who has been
here for 24 years, was the assistant HC and is pretty much Mikey's adopted son. Moving on from this inept sumbitch shows
me something. Need to see more moves though for sure. A new DC and a new LB coach at the very least.

(01-04-2018, 07:55 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: That's what we're saying, though, that this looks like a new direction and a new culture.

I know not to put all my eggs in one basket, but it sounds like Marvin made some demands in his contract negotiations and he knows that it's time to make it happen.

Did hear something about MB didn't want to go all rebuild cause he wants to win a SB before he dies and he thinks Marv is
the best chance at doing it right now. Don't understand this with Marv's 0-7 Playoff record but hey, maybe he is letting Marv
finally pick his coaches now. Del Rio and a new LB coach and i will start to really believe.

Don't want Paulie G and Haslett back cannot say this enough.

Well...

Marvin better give some lip service and sell the whole "new direction" vibe.

Being 31st in the league in attendance he's certainly not going with the usual complacent route.

Paul Alexander was so horrible that showing him the door gives us a sliver of hope.

Also the thought of getting an upgrade to Paulie G (fingers crossed) might too.

When this team actually fills some needs with decent FAs then I'll get excited.

(01-04-2018, 06:17 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: As Joelist says here, the Marv/Lazor presser. We are reading into it but it makes more sense to me when i read some of
the comments that PA didn't like the adjustments Lazor was asking to be made. Speaking of having all the coaches being
able to give their opinions and getting over it and being a family.

Sounds to me like PA and Lazor were butting heads and somehow Lazor won out with Marv's help.

This makes sense to me as PA has always been one stubborn sumbitch...

Seems he outgrew his britches (those cheeseburgers) and let that "assistant Head Coach" title go to his head.

(01-04-2018, 09:16 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Seems he outgrew his britches (those cheeseburgers) and let that "assistant Head Coach" title go to his head.

Man a picture of Mike Brown as Mr. Lahey and Paul Alexander as Randy would've been epic!

(01-04-2018, 08:13 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: All completely understandable. But if they were truly insane they would of brought the O-line coach back who has been
here for 24 years, was the assistant HC and is pretty much Mikey's adopted son. Moving on from this inept sumbitch shows
me something. Need to see more moves though for sure. A new DC and a new LB coach at the very least.


Did hear something about MB didn't want to go all rebuild cause he wants to win a SB before he dies and he thinks Marv is
the best chance at doing it right now. Don't understand this with Marv's 0-7 Playoff record but hey, maybe he is letting Marv
finally pick his coaches now. Del Rio and a new LB coach and i will start to really believe.

Don't want Paulie G and Haslett back cannot say this enough.

If Jack Del Rio were to become DC, that changes everything. It would change the way I view MB, ML and the whole organization.  It would be a little out of character for them and they would finally be putting their money where their mouth is. That would show me an actual commitment to win, which is all I ask for.

(01-04-2018, 09:54 PM)BMK Wrote: If Jack Del Rio were to become DC, that changes everything.  It would change the way I view MB, ML and the whole organization.  It would be a little out of character for them and they would finally be putting their money where their mouth is. That would show me an actual commitment to win, which is all I ask for.

Same here brother.

I'm not sure if OP is serious or on drugs.

(01-04-2018, 08:13 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Did hear something about MB didn't want to go all rebuild cause he wants to win a SB before he dies and he thinks Marv is
the best chance at doing it right now. Don't understand this with Marv's 0-7 Playoff record but hey, maybe he is letting Marv
finally pick his coaches now. Del Rio and a new LB coach and i will start to really believe.

Don't want Paulie G and Haslett back cannot say this enough.

A new line coach was a big step, and Marv's 0-7 playoff record is bad but maybe Mike thinks that starting completely over with a new coach would set things back for years, which is why he's letting Marvin (hopefully) call more shots now.

We have the pieces and another thing is maybe Mike's finally realizing that assistant coaches do matter and there's a lot more that goes into a team than just putting players on the field.

(01-04-2018, 09:54 PM)BMK Wrote: If Jack Del Rio were to become DC, that changes everything.  It would change the way I view MB, ML and the whole organization.  It would be a little out of character for them and they would finally be putting their money where their mouth is. That would show me an actual commitment to win, which is all I ask for.

Only thing it would change in the way I view Marvin is that he finally grew a set of balls and said "do this or I'm not coming back.  Go all-in to win or there's no point in me being here."

Del Rio would make sense since he was Marvin's linebacker coach when Marvin had the amazing 2000 defense and he might be licking his chops at a backing core with Burfict, Jewell (or whoever we draft), and whoever else we draft or sign (or if we go with a guy on the team like Vigil), and not to mention Geno eating offenses alive.

It would definitely change the way I view MB and just make me think "the old man finally gets it, and he's also willing to spend some money to win."

(01-04-2018, 10:37 PM)CornerBlitz Wrote: I'm not sure if OP is serious or on drugs.

Seems like some people agree with me and some people are in the "wait and see mode," with not many people dismissing my post as irrational or stupid, so which part suggests that I'm on drugs?

Educate us all with your unlimited knowledge because there's a lot of people in this thread who would also like to know.