Ross has a huge uphill battle to be relevant. History suggests he's an injury waiting to happen, a reputation he doesn't seem to be on track to dispel and he has a bad reputation with his head coach already, right or wrong.

Odds are not in his favor. Personally, he seems like Eifert 2.0 in most ways. Talented guy who can't physically stand up to the NFL game. I expect he won't last long with the hits our recievers take. Personal opinion.

(01-25-2018, 07:11 AM)grampahol Wrote: He's got a new season to try to get his career back on track, a new position coach and it'll be Lazor's first full season to get a fresh start with him. The question is whether Marvin is willing to use his talent or will he forever view him as a draft pick he didn't want?
Part of me likes the prospect of having the speed ,but another part also sees a guy kind of sulking and wanting to blame someone else for a reason for last season. Because I don't know for sure I'm going to wait and see how he develops or not. I don't have super high hopes, but I do think there's still quite a bit of real potential in him with a new season and hopefully injury free .

Ross is one hell of a classy human being, he will not be sulking or laying blame on anyone but himself.

If anything holds him back it is injury.

I will say it right here, if Ross can stay healthy he will be a gamechanger and can be one of the most explosive weapons in the NFL.

Right there with a Tyreke Hill type of player. Hell he reminded me of Antonio Brown at Washington. Great in open space, great hands,
runs great routes, crazy quickness, changes directions extremely fast and is faster than AB and a deep ball threat.

Can Ross Block? Think that could be another reason he cant get on the field?

(01-25-2018, 12:57 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Interesting comment, considering it was very well known that he is an excellent route runner prior to the draft.

I'm holding out hope that they were strengthening his shoulder to get him ready for hits in the NFL and not Marvin reacting to the draft pick he didn't want.

To me, GM's should take coach input into consideration during FA/Draft, but they should always be upgrading positions as they can and see fit. Coaches responsibility is to take what your given and make due. Honestly, coaches shouldn't be scouts in the sense that we use them as scouts, they should take what the scouts find and either agree/disagree/offer opinions. That's not to say that they can't watch college games and send research requests to the scouts if they see someone that they think is being over looked. Basically, Scouts need to Scout and Coaches need to Coach, each side needs to be able to trust the other.

Yeah, it is like we were all talking about a different player last year. I don't believe Ross just went from being an excellent
route runner to a poor one and i still remember fluff pieces from Hobspin speaking of how impressed coaches and players
were with his route running and quick cuts in practice. WJ3 was the only CB who could stay with him and look at what he
is becoming.

Hoping you are right and it was just trying to get that shoulder ready for NFL hits. Now he has an entire Offseason to get
it ready.

Also agree on your thoughts on the Scouts and Coaches.

(01-25-2018, 03:11 PM)bambino5130 Wrote: Can Ross Block? Think that could be another reason he cant get on the field?

That isn't his job, his job is to get open, make big plays and take coverage away from AJ.

You know what we drafted him for i thought. Atleast that is what i thought we were missing with our other Receivers.

Still remember the Colts game when we brought him from the outside to blocking on the edge of the O-line as a TE...

Have to be able to use your players to their strengths. Ross is a willing blocker but this has never been his strength.

Know what you have before you draft the guy. If we wanted a blocking WR in the first we wouldn't of taken Ross.

Ross made a few comments early on in training camp last year that were concerning. Can't remember the exact comments but I remember taking away from them a guy who doesn't have much self-confidence in his abilities. Add to that the Bengals burying him after the fumble, along with Marvin publicly blasting him for his effort a few games later, and I can definitely see the mental part of the game being too much for him last year. Hopefully Ross can dig his way out of it, but until Marvin gets over whatever it is he has against the kid, I'm not holding my breath.

Well coaches said its up to ross... If he puts the work in he has the talent to be around a long time

(01-25-2018, 03:25 PM)Lionel Hutz Wrote: Ross made a few comments early on in training camp last year that were concerning.  Can't remember the exact comments but I remember taking away from them a guy who doesn't have much self-confidence in his abilities.  Add to that the Bengals burying him after the fumble, along with Marvin publicly blasting him for his effort a few games later, and I can definitely see the mental part of the game being too much for him last year. Hopefully Ross can dig his way out of it, but until Marvin gets over whatever it is he has against the kid, I'm not holding my breath.

Are you remembering the comments about him not being as fast with pads on and that he wasn't going to blow by DBs in the NFL? I wouldn't be concerned with those comments or view them as not being confident. Just being humble and wanted to temper fans expectations, is how I took those.

(01-25-2018, 03:14 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yeah, it is like we were all talking about a different player last year. I don't believe Ross just went from being an excellent
route runner to a poor one and i still remember fluff pieces from Hobspin speaking of how impressed coaches and players
were with his route running and quick cuts in practice. WJ3 was the only CB who could stay with him and look at what he
is becoming.

Hoping you are right and it was just trying to get that shoulder ready for NFL hits. Now he has an entire Offseason to get
it ready.

Also agree on your thoughts on the Scouts and Coaches.

In my earlier comment, I said he needed a strength program. Last summer he couldn't lift or condition that much because he was recovering. I think he will be ready for this next season. 

(01-25-2018, 03:11 PM)bambino5130 Wrote: Can Ross Block? Think that could be another reason he cant get on the field?

I honestly don't believe AJ is that good of blocker either. He does it, but more times than not, he is getting away with holding a lot too.
Ross will never be a big blocker, but all he has to do is get in a defenders way. 

(01-25-2018, 03:48 PM)sandwedge Wrote: Are you remembering the comments about him not being as fast with pads on and that he wasn't going to blow by DBs in the NFL? I wouldn't be concerned with those comments or view them as not being confident. Just being humble and wanted to temper fans expectations, is how I took those.

That is how i took it as well, normal classy John Ross.

He doesn't lack confidence in his abilities, why would he?

He was the best redzone threat in college and the fastest player on the field.

Still remember him toasting Adoree Jackson worse than i have ever seen a good Corner get toasted.

(01-25-2018, 03:50 PM)sandwedge Wrote: In my earlier comment, I said he needed a strength program. Last summer he couldn't lift or condition that much because he was recovering. I think he will be ready for this next season. 

This will definately help, great point.

(01-25-2018, 03:53 PM)sandwedge Wrote: I honestly don't believe AJ is that good of blocker either. He does it, but more times than not, he is getting away with holding a lot too.
Ross will never be a big blocker, but all he has to do is get in a defenders way. 

All of our WR's were poor in run blocking last year it seemed.

So the argument of Ross being a poor run blocker doesn't seem to hold water either.

Career back on track? His career hasn't even started.

I think people are making way too big of an issue regarding Ross. He'll be fine once he gets healthy.

(01-25-2018, 07:11 AM)grampahol Wrote: He's got a new season to try to get his career back on track, a new position coach and it'll be Lazor's first full season to get a fresh start with him. The question is whether Marvin is willing to use his talent or will he forever view him as a draft pick he didn't want?
Part of me likes the prospect of having the speed ,but another part also sees a guy kind of sulking and wanting to blame someone else for a reason for last season. Because I don't know for sure I'm going to wait and see how he develops or not. I don't have super high hopes, but I do think there's still quite a bit of real potential in him with a new season and hopefully injury free .

On the Bengals? Hell yes!

Even if he sucks for the next 3 years he'll be given new chances year after year. Why? Because Mike Brown feels sorry for him just like he feels sorry for Ogbuehi, Bodine, Fisher and Adam Jones, and earlier with Still, Hunt, Akili Smith, Nugent (when he couldn't do it anymore), etc, etc.

Marvin kept playing Ogbuehi, Bodine and Fisher even though everyone knew they sucked. Just watch we'll see two of these 3 starting on the 2018 OL.

Is it a stretch to to say I knew Marvin was coming back just because of the was the whole Ross situation was handled. There didn't seem to be any desperate attempt by Marvin to get this kid on the field, almost as if he knew his job was safe all along.

(01-25-2018, 11:51 PM)TKUHL Wrote: Is it a stretch to to say I knew Marvin was coming back just because of the was the whole Ross situation was handled. There didn't seem to be any desperate attempt by Marvin to get this kid on the field, almost as if he knew his job was safe all along.

Forcing a guy on the field who has at least one bad knee, two bad shoulders, conditioning issues, playbook familiarity issues, and who looked fairly not good when he was featured on the field actually seems like something a guy who knows he has no risk of losing his job would do.

I really hope Ross gets it together, because I watched the Bears draft Kevin White #7 overall and the guy has injure-stunk his way to a grand total of 193 yards and 0 touches in 3 years.

Pulling for Ross in big way even though was upset when he was drafted.

Just thought we had much bigger needs at time. But now the needs are so glaring that they are sure to be addressed this offseason.

Ross could be a huge boon for Bengals if he can as well. Would love to have two great WR's.

(01-26-2018, 12:41 AM)Go Cards Wrote: Pulling for Ross in big way even though was upset when he was drafted.

Just thought we had much bigger needs at time. But now the needs are so glaring that they are sure to be addressed this offseason.

Ross could be a huge boon for Bengals if he can as well. Would love to have two great WR's.

I though the needs were pretty glaring last draft, I wouldn't hold your breath. There is nothing "Sure to be addressed" with the way this franchise operates. The new coaches and if true less MB interference does give me some hope.

(01-26-2018, 01:04 AM)TKUHL Wrote: I though the needs were pretty glaring last draft, I wouldn't hold your breath. There is nothing "Sure to be addressed" with the way this franchise operates. The new coaches and if true less MB interference does give me some hope.

Probably true 

just hoping the change is real. 

I actually called John Ross getting drafted like 7 days before the draft in my group last year. I was excited to add the fastest guy in the NFL.

Training camp came and I got to go on the first day, and I went up to get his autograph first,but everybody was pushing each other and barging through to get his autograph. I was kind of close and he wasn't much taller then me and I'm 5'7 . He had to be 5'9 at most that's being generous.

I did not know he was that short lol that's the only thing that concerns me,and he might be best in the slot with his size like a Andrew Hawkins type of guy.

As for Marvin and Ross, Ross was trying to get healthy in preseason and I knew he wouldn't play game 1 . But when they got veteran lafell ,and Malone and core had all the reps ,I think Marvin was fine with what we had and just didn't trust Ross at all. And he's like that with alot of rookies unless you climb the depth chart.i don't blame Ross at all ,I think that's just Marvin Lewis for you.

(01-25-2018, 07:11 AM)grampahol Wrote: He's got a new season to try to get his career back on track, a new position coach and it'll be Lazor's first full season to get a fresh start with him. The question is whether Marvin is willing to use his talent or will he forever view him as a draft pick he didn't want?
Part of me likes the prospect of having the speed ,but another part also sees a guy kind of sulking and wanting to blame someone else for a reason for last season. Because I don't know for sure I'm going to wait and see how he develops or not. I don't have super high hopes, but I do think there's still quite a bit of real potential in him with a new season and hopefully injury free .

I had high hopes for him when I was certain Marv was gone...not so much now.  Don't have much hope for anything regarding this team, to be honest....

Ross is so much more than just speed.  He should have been the best thing to happen to AJ Green since he has been a Bengal, but Marv the douchebag just had to be Marv.  That is why I still won't expect much of him since the incredibly below average Brandon Lafell is "such a pro, blah, blah, blah".  The same goes for the likes of Willis and Lawson behind the useless MJ.  Heck, even the seventh rounder Fej was an upgrade over Shawn Williams but he only played because of injuries.

Redmond and Westerman sat behind the worst guard and center in the league....same ol, same ol. 

With Marv still in charge this team will continue to be an exercise in no-talent individuals where Marv just tries to "not lose" games while we see teams like Jacksonville put up a 40 burger on the road against the steelers.  Does anyone think the Bengals wouldn't go in to a shell of they actually scored 21 first half points there?  

He isn't going to suddenly change his stripes and be aggressive.