(02-13-2018, 04:18 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: Marvin is highly respected around the league as well. So is Mike Brown. Sounds like "around the league" don't know shit about much of anything. 

Ha ha :andy:

(02-13-2018, 04:18 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: Marvin is highly respected around the league as well. So is Mike Brown. Sounds like "around the league" don't know shit about much of anything. 

(02-13-2018, 03:14 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Of course that is always, working for the weekend.

Loverboy - 1981 - Get Lucky album. 

(02-13-2018, 04:18 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: Marvin is highly respected around the league as well. So is Mike Brown. Sounds like "around the league" don't know shit about much of anything. 

...but they still know more than us hence why they are in the league and we aren't. No matter how much people want to arm chair every decision if we actually knew what we were talking about we wouldn't be here we'd be there. Over simplification of situations and context of decisions doesn't work in the real world like it does around here.

(02-13-2018, 03:14 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Do not know why I was thinking it was the 15th today.

Guess am ready for this week to be over with already.

Does that mean you forgot Valentine's Day?  You still have time.

(02-13-2018, 04:18 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: Marvin is highly respected around the league as well. So is Mike Brown. Sounds like "around the league" don't know shit about much of anything. 

Not sure Mike is well respected as an owner.  Maybe as a business man making profits, but not as football mind.

One reason Marvin is well respected is because other teams know what a handicap he is under working for Mike Browm.

(02-13-2018, 05:33 PM)Au165 Wrote: ...but they still know more than us hence why they are in the league and we aren't. No matter how much people want to arm chair every decision if we actually knew what we were talking about we wouldn't be here we'd be there. Over simplification of situations and context of decisions doesn't work in the real world like it does around here.

You know what?  I don't buy this whole NFL as rocket science theme.  There are many guys who have had long NFL careers who needed help getting through High School.

Yes, it's specialized knowledge.  But don't even try to tell me it takes a genius to understand it.  I do not consider Marvin to be all that smart, quite honestly.

And I also don't buy that well respected around the league crap either.  The Steelers, for instance, have been laughing at him for sixteen years.

And PA, stubborn, arrogant incompetent that he is, he can take a flying **** at a rolling donut, imo.  (Brownie points to anyone who know this reference.)

At least half of this dynamic duo is somebody else's problem now.

(02-13-2018, 06:00 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Not sure Mike is well respected as an owner.  Maybe as a business man making profits, but not as football mind.

One reason Marvin is well respected is because other teams no what a handicap he is under working for Mike Browm.

I wouldn't place all the blame on Mike. Marvin has sh*t the bed plenty of times on his own. Mike has nothing to do with game time performance and game management. Marvin is a failure at game management.

(02-13-2018, 11:44 AM)Wyche Wrote: For all the grief I gave him....at one time, he was a good coach, and had innovative ideas.  The problem is, imo, he let the game pass him by as he became stuck in his ways and became a detriment here.  To me, the problem really came to a head with the Bodine situation.  Our run game has been stagnant for the better part of a decade, and we find out he was the run game coordinator.  The Ogbuehi mess was just adding insult to injury.  Maybe a reboot in Dallas will open his eyes and do him some good.

In spite of the "positive comments" from around the league, I personally don't think Alexander is/was very good at coaching up low to mid-level players and mostly that's the kind of linemen the Bengals draft. Whit and Zeitler were two who didn't really need much coaching and the FO let them go $$$. Apparently Bovine , Ogeebogee, and Fissure (medical issues notwithstanding) were beyond the capabilities of PA. We'll know soon enough what they are worth.

(02-13-2018, 06:48 PM)sandwedge Wrote: I wouldn't place all the blame on Mike. Marvin has sh*t the bed plenty of times on his own. Mike has nothing to do with game time performance and game management. Marvin is a failure at game management.

But how many games can you really point to that the Bengals lost because of coaching decisions?  For example I hear a lot of people complain about how Marvin is too conservative with a lead, yet he has never lost a game because he was too conservative with a lead.

If you look at the won lost record of NFL coaches almost every one of them goes up and down based on how much talent they have.  It is not like good coaches forget how to coach for a year or two and then start remembering again.

Working under Mike Brown has been a big handicap fro Marvin.  His record would have been much better if he had an owner that was mroe willing to bring in some talent when needed.

(02-13-2018, 07:17 PM)fredtoast Wrote: But how many games can you really point to that the Bengals lost because of coaching decisions?  For example I hear a lot of people complain about how Marvin is too conservative with a lead, yet he has never lost a game because he was too conservative with a lead.

If you look at the won lost record of NFL coaches almost every one of them goes up and down based on how much talent they have.  It is not like good coaches forget how to coach for a year or two and then start remembering again.

Working under Mike Brown has been a big handicap fro Marvin.  His record would have been much better if he had an owner that was mroe willing to bring in some talent when needed.

I think we need to define what exactly conservative is. Could mean a lot of different things to people. Speaking for myself, Marvin has never really put a team away that was down. Sure there has been probably one or two over Cleveland, but that's Cleveland. I believe Marvin even said way back in the beginning, he prefers the defense to win the game in the 4th quarter.
 His game management is horrid IMO. Stupid TOs, bad challenges and too chicken shit to be aggressive on defense. You listen to him during his press conferences and he will say, "we can't be beat by the big play".  What the difference between them scoring on 1 big play or just dinking and dunking down the field because you are play 10 yds off the ball? 
Offensively, you can bet the first 2 plays called when we are sitting on a lead is going to be runs and then followed up by a pass that is 4 yards shy of a 1st down. Why, is he afraid of turnovers? Every team we play knows this. It's on game film. The big flaw in this is, we can't run the ball or we haven't in about 3 years. So if you're not successful running the ball, why try to pound a square peg into a round hole?
Not saying this happens every game but quite a few. 
But you are right, it can't be easy working MB. I know I couldn't. He can not adapt to things when they change.

(02-13-2018, 08:49 PM)sandwedge Wrote: I think we need to define what exactly conservative is. Could mean a lot of different things to people. Speaking for myself, Marvin has never really put a team away that was down. Sure there has been probably one or two over Cleveland, but that's Cleveland. I believe Marvin even said way back in the beginning, he prefers the defense to win the game in the 4th quarter.
 His game management is horrid IMO. Stupid TOs, bad challenges and too chicken shit to be aggressive on defense. You listen to him during his press conferences and he will say, "we can't be beat by the big play".  What the difference between them scoring on 1 big play or just dinking and dunking down the field because you are play 10 yds off the ball? 
Offensively, you can bet the first 2 plays called when we are sitting on a lead is going to be runs and then followed up by a pass that is 4 yards shy of a 1st down. Why, is he afraid of turnovers? Every team we play knows this. It's on game film. The big flaw in this is, we can't run the ball or we haven't in about 3 years. So if you're not successful running the ball, why try to pound a square peg into a round hole?
Not saying this happens every game but quite a few. 
But you are right, it can't be easy working MB. I know I couldn't. He can not adapt to things when they change.

I have been wanting to know the answer to this question also. You can look at our bend but dont break the last few years with Guenther and it was successful if you just look at the pure numbers with PPG. Every time we faced a team that had a reasonable offense though we would get beat. They would know what to do. Just run a delay and have the running back cut back to the opposite side and all of our defense would over pursue for big gains or just have their TE block and release and no one would cover him. 

It drives me insane. In 2015 we finished 2nd in Defensive PPG but we faced a ton of bad offenses that year. 2016 we finished 8th but got shredded by the better teams on the schedule..

(02-13-2018, 05:52 PM)McC Wrote: Does that mean you forgot Valentine's Day?  You still have time.

Haha 

No nor did i forget that it is the beginning of Lent.  Do not know what I was thinking. 
     

(02-14-2018, 02:20 AM)Go Cards Wrote: Haha 

No nor did i forget that it is the beginning of Lent.  Do not know what I was thinking. 
     

I prefer forgetting any holiday especially those that require me to go buy some crap for someone I've been arguing with over stupid stuff.. 
Happy VD honey..now STFU.. LOL

(02-13-2018, 03:14 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Do not know why I was thinking it was the 15th today.

Guess am ready for this week to be over with already.

You forgot Valentine's Day?   :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart:

(02-13-2018, 06:00 PM)fredtoast Wrote: One reason Marvin is well respected is because other teams know what a handicap he is under working for Mike Browm.

I think every football person should respect Marv.  That takes real talent to earn $5 million a year, be a .500 coach, have zero playoff wins, and stay as HC for 15 years.  That takes talent.  

(02-13-2018, 06:01 PM)McC Wrote: You know what?  I don't buy this whole NFL as rocket science theme.  There are many guys who have had long NFL careers who needed help getting through High School.

Yes, it's specialized knowledge.  But don't even try to tell me it takes a genius to understand it.  I do not consider Marvin to be all that smart, quite honestly.

And I also don't buy that well respected around the league crap either.  The Steelers, for instance, have been laughing at him for sixteen years.

And PA, stubborn, arrogant incompetent that he is, he can take a flying **** at a rolling donut, imo.  (Brownie points to anyone who know this reference.)

At least half of this dynamic duo is somebody else's problem now.

It's not about rocket science it's about the ignorance of 99% of fans. Most fans have no real clue how things work from actual play design and responsibilities, to scouting, and even cap management. You can hate the coaches results but the constant smug comments by fans here about how obvious every decision or move is gets so annoying when people honestly have no clue.

(02-13-2018, 03:26 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: What would we get in that trade? Doubt much, a 5th rounder?

I like Ferguson, doubt he lasts to the 4th round.

 AJM played 5 games 3 seasons ago.... went 2-3 with arguably one of the best bengals rosters in the last 2 decades.


How much would you trade for him to get him on your team?

(02-14-2018, 09:50 AM)Au165 Wrote: It's not about rocket science it's about the ignorance of 99% of fans. Most fans have no real clue how things work from actual play design and responsibilities, to scouting, and even cap management. You can hate the coaches results but the constant smug comments by fans here about how obvious every decision or move is gets so annoying when people honestly have no clue.

Sounds exactly how the Bengals treat us as fans, wouldn't you say?

(02-14-2018, 11:29 AM)Hoofhearted Wrote: Sounds exactly how the Bengals treat us as fans, wouldn't you say?

Not at all. I think most the people, including the team personnel, know the in's and out's of being a fan haha.