(03-08-2018, 06:39 AM)jarrod.gower76 Wrote: This is a flyer pick up at best...The hope for this guy to rekindle performance from two years ago on the cheap is fine, but this honestly is nothing for fans to get excited about.  Free Agency is coming and we will see what the Brown family cooks up with the cap position we have.  We have all seen this chapter of the book before but god I am hoping by some miracle they prove me wrong...

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This isn't a flyer pick up. They dropped over 3m on him. That's 3m off the cap. Which makes him a significant if not big signing by their definition. Hobs is about to remind us that this means we now are down to 14M in cap space due to this signing. My only question is once again were they bidding against themselves? Like they tend to do Andre Smith? We may never know. We know with Smith because he has sat out with no interest for long periods of time on multiple occasions. The only reason he got the shot in Minny is because of Zimmer. When they say we can't afford a OT or OC in free agency, maybe they could have used that extra 3m.

Like people say. Would you have traded Andre Smith (3.5M) and Minter (4.5M) an 8m cap hit, to help afford Whit who they offered 10m to, but wasn't willing to pay 13M?

Unless you guys think there was a rush to get this guy signed. I don't see an urgency to sign any player outside of the Oline right now. Unless it's for the vet minimum. So this is nothing against Baker. We all know the "type" of player they like, and that will never change. He fit's the label. They've shown not to care about their perception (see comments under announcements of his signings).

Personally I'd wait to spend any money until I know if I can get some Oline help. Maybe they know what we are slow to learn. They aren't going to be able to afford any legit Oline help in free agency. I think that's the message with them wiling to give 3 year contracts to 30yr old Safety's and now paying 3m for 30yr old Dt's. The writing is on the wall.

(03-08-2018, 11:03 AM)jj22 Wrote: This isn't a flyer pick up. They dropped over 3m on him. That's 3m off the cap. Which makes him a significant if not big signing by their definition. My only question is once again was they bidding against themselves? Like they tend to do Andre Smith? We may never know. We know with Smith because he has sat out with no interest for long periods of time on multiple occasions. The only reason he got the shot in Minny is because of Zimmer. When they say we can't afford a OT or OC in free agency, maybe they could have used that extra 3m.

Unless you guys think there was a rush to get this guy signed. I don't see an urgency to sign any player outside of the Oline right now. Unless it's for the vet minimum.

Personally I'd wait to spend any money until I know if I can get some Oline help. Maybe they know what we are slow to learn. They aren't going to be able to afford any legit Oline help in free agency.

We need O-line help and we have already signed an O-lineman.

But we need help at other positions also.  So right now we are looking for anyone who can help at any position.

(03-08-2018, 11:07 AM)fredtoast Wrote: We need O-line help and we have already signed an O-lineman.

But we need help at other positions also.  So right now we are looking for anyone who can help at any position.

This is exactly their thinking rather we like it or not. They've signed O-line help folks. And once they re-sign Bodine the center spot will be solidified. Anything else is just wishful thinking. The same wishful thinking that disappoints us every offseason.

(03-08-2018, 11:03 AM)jj22 Wrote: This isn't a flyer pick up. They dropped over 3m on him. That's 3m off the cap. Which makes him a significant if not big signing by their definition. Hobs is about to remind us that this means we now are down to 14M in cap space due to this signing. My only question is once again were they bidding against themselves? Like they tend to do Andre Smith? We may never know. We know with Smith because he has sat out with no interest for long periods of time on multiple occasions. The only reason he got the shot in Minny is because of Zimmer. When they say we can't afford a OT or OC in free agency, maybe they could have used that extra 3m.

Like people say. Would you have traded Andre Smith (3.5M) and Minter (4.5M) an 8m cap hit, to help afford Whit who they offered 10m to, but wasn't willing to pay 13M?

Unless you guys think there was a rush to get this guy signed. I don't see an urgency to sign any player outside of the Oline right now. Unless it's for the vet minimum. So this is nothing against Baker. We all know the "type" of player they like, and that will never change. He fit's the label. They've shown not to care about their perception (see comments under announcements of his signings).

Personally I'd wait to spend any money until I know if I can get some Oline help. Maybe they know what we are slow to learn. They aren't going to be able to afford any legit Oline help in free agency. I think that's the message with them wiling to give 3 year contracts to 30yr old Safety's and now paying 3m for 30yr old Dt's. The writing is on the wall.

Agreed. While $3 mill may not seem like much for NFL contracts, Mike Brown doesn't throw a contract that big to fringe roster players. Baker will make this team barring some injury or incident.

(03-08-2018, 11:41 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Agreed. While $3 mill may not seem like much for NFL contracts, Mike Brown doesn't throw a contract that big to fringe roster players. Baker will make this team barring some injury or incident.

The contract is nnot guaranteed 

(03-08-2018, 11:44 AM)fredtoast Wrote: The contract is nnot guaranteed 

I wouldn't expect it to be all guaranteed, but I haven't seen anything on how much is? If you've seen those details, can you share?

Regardless, I can't recall someone being signed within at least the past 5 years for $3+ million that wasn't kept for at least a season.

We know that. But I'd too like to know if none of it was guaranteed. That would mean something.....

(03-07-2018, 09:46 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Completely agree with you here.

Low-balling Whit was the big one, but hey, we might of made the Playoffs if we brought back Whit and PA would still be here.

PA still being here is a shuttering thought.

Chris Baker is genuinely excited about putting on the orange and black so that makes me excited about having him in Cincy.

Hope you have a career year or 3 in Cincy, Chris.

Who Dey.

(03-08-2018, 11:48 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I wouldn't expect it to be all guaranteed, but I haven't seen anything on how much is? If you've seen those details, can you share?

Regardless, I can't recall someone being signed within at least the past 5 years for $3+ million that wasn't kept for at least a season.

I guess that is what bothers me. I really don't know anything about this guy, other than what I have read here. My question is, are we just grabbing people off the heap pile for the sake of saying we are trying or should we wait till teams start cutting players that don't have a history of being malcontents? 

(03-08-2018, 12:45 PM)sandwedge Wrote: I guess that is what bothers me. I really don't know anything about this guy, other than what I have read here. My question is, are we just grabbing people off the heap pile for the sake of saying we are trying or should we wait till teams start cutting players that don't have a history of being malcontents? 

Burney and Haslett were in DC when Baker was there, so they are familiar with him. He was productive in DC for two years before he went to TB last year.

(03-08-2018, 11:48 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I wouldn't expect it to be all guaranteed, but I haven't seen anything on how much is? If you've seen those details, can you share?

Regardless, I can't recall someone being signed within at least the past 5 years for $3+ million that wasn't kept for at least a season.

Yep, if the contract is heavily laden with incentives to get to 3 mil, then it's a pretty good thought.  If it's not, it's just more lipstick on a pig.

Do not hate the move at all unless his bad attitude follows him here. If so I hope he is cut quick.

Believe this means there is a better chance at an OL being taken in first.

USA Today mocked Edmunds to us and would be fine if that happened as well.

On record many times stating he is the only defensive player I want over OL in first.

But back on point, welcome aboard Mr Baker and wish you well in Stripes.

(03-07-2018, 01:15 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Well if they do sign Baker then I guess the nose tackle Vea is off the table. Unless for some reason they do not sign Geno Atkins to a new contract.

Depends. Has Vea been injured recently?

Our approach recently with DL, WR and OL was to bring in a vet while we drafted later picks to develop or high injury picks to rehab. the vets (LaFell, MJ, Andre, Winston, etc) would give the team time to develop the young guys or rehab the injury. This could be along the same lines. Look for us to take a late or horribly handicapped player to play behind Baker, who then either gets very slowly developed or just shuffled down the roster.

(03-08-2018, 12:45 PM)sandwedge Wrote: I guess that is what bothers me. I really don't know anything about this guy, other than what I have read here. My question is, are we just grabbing people off the heap pile for the sake of saying we are trying or should we wait till teams start cutting players that don't have a history of being malcontents? 

Yes

We signed reject OT Hart, who actually somehow managed to grade out worse than Ogbuehi. Clearly there is little intent of upgrading the spot in FA.

With Baker, Mikey Brown can now claim he's filled two needed spots in free agency. Sadly though, both are out of another team's dumpster. Typical Mikey Brown.

Yes, but it's season ticket sales time on the website . I'm almost expecting them to send kids door to door, knocking on doors and saying , "You don't wanna buy any Bengals season tickets do ya?" 
By the way, that was my go-to sales approach as a kid trying rather unsuccessfully to sell Christmas cards door to door in the dead of summer . That was way back when they used to have all those ads in the back of kids magazines.. Gee kids! Sell a gazillion cards and win a mini-bike! I probably knocked on a few million doors back then and didn't sell a single card.. 
The Mike Brown approach to winning the super bowl.. 
"You don't wanna win the Super Bowl do ya?" 

(03-08-2018, 01:15 PM)BengalChris Wrote: Yes

We signed reject OT Hart, who actually somehow managed to grade out worse than Ogbuehi. Clearly there is little intent of upgrading the spot in FA.

With Baker, Mikey Brown can now claim he's filled two needed spots in free agency. Sadly though, both are out of another team's dumpster. Typical Mikey Brown.

Given that the only players that can be signed right now are cut players, aren't they all "out of another team's dumpster"?

(03-08-2018, 01:12 PM)Benton Wrote: Depends. Has Vea been injured recently?

Our approach recently with DL, WR and OL was to bring in a vet while we drafted later picks to develop or high injury picks to rehab. the vets (LaFell, MJ, Andre, Winston, etc) would give the team time to develop the young guys or rehab the injury. This could be along the same lines. Look for us to take a late or horribly handicapped player to play behind Baker, who then either gets very slowly developed or just shuffled down the roster.

Vea will be long gone before we pick at #12.....

(03-08-2018, 01:15 PM)BengalChris Wrote: Yes

We signed reject OT Hart, who actually somehow managed to grade out worse than Ogbuehi. Clearly there is little intent of upgrading the spot in FA.

With Baker, Mikey Brown can now claim he's filled two needed spots in free agency. Sadly though, both are out of another team's dumpster. Typical Mikey Brown.

This is also where my pessimism kinda kicks in. We've heard that they have to "get better" at it, but I guess I just don't see it just yet.

Quote:“We need to be better at what we do,” Lewis said. “We’re going to have changes in our staff. We’re going to have to gain some better players. We’re going to have to augment some of what we do. We’re going to have to do a better job of adding some guys from other clubs.”

Instead, the team and front office tend to favor veterans who have played for the Bengals (or staff) in the past to continue to lead the way. Add the fact it's guy who has effort and character concerns, I feel like I've seen this song and dance before.

At some point they have to focus their free agent acquisitions on guys who will be quality, productive players instead of the likes of over-rated veterans like Chris Baker, Andre Smith, Bobby Hart, Kevin Minter, AJ Hawk, etc…, etc… because they are trying to preserve their comp picks.


But I am willing to see how FA goes before I go all bat-shit crazy. It just doesn't seem that way right now.

(03-08-2018, 05:01 AM)Shady Wrote: If there's one at 12 or we trade down. Not sure there's one at 12. McGlinchey? 

People can feel what they feel, but I agree this is showing some effort. Baker can be very disruptive. He seems like a great human being. He does get a little crazy on the field, but Burney and Haslett want him here for some reason. They coached him in DC, I guess. I watched hi highlight real from 2016 (I think), and the dude looked frighteningly good at times. I'd still draft Vita Vea, though. Vea's athleticism puts him at a totally different level. If he's there at 12, you shut up and take him. He's special.  Edmunds or Roquan wouldn't be bad either.

McGlinchey is the only tackle worth the 12th pick, but I've been reading that this draft is way more heavy with Guard talent. The latest CBS mock has us taking a Guard at 12 (Isaiah Wynn) and a Tackle in the 2nd round (Brian O'Neill). Vea should be considered, but I'm not sure he's a must-grab. CBS has him going at 17. If I knew we'd get serious in FA with the o-line, sure get Vea...but I'm assuming we'll mainly use the draft to fix things, so I want o-line, o-line, o-line.

No shiny prospect is going to change my mind on that.

(03-08-2018, 05:11 AM)CanadianBengal Wrote: Sorry but a below average player with a bad attitude isn't what this team needs. Baker doesn't really contribute to building a winning culture in the locker room. I'd prefer less 3-5 mil contract guys and put that money to 1-2 meaningful contracts. This just seems like typical Bengals taking a flyer on sub-par players. 

1. This is reading an awful lot into one incident in Tampa. Did he have a bad reputation in Washington? He spent 5 years there, so I doubt he was very cancerous.

2. $3 million isn't a lot, and FA hasn't even begun. As jaded as I am, I don't think they're done with FA. I don't see any $8-10 million dollar-ish signings coming unfortunately, but it wouldn't surprise me to see another signing for $3-4 million and maybe some cheap reclamation signings sprinkled in. We'll see.

3. I don't think he's a sub-par player. He's an upgrade from Phat Sims and definitely an average player at least, with potential to be impactful. He showed that in Washington. That's why the Bucs signed him to a contract for 3 years, $15.75 million just last year. You don't get a contract like that for being a bum.

(03-08-2018, 10:26 AM)Hoofhearted Wrote: Yeah, I thought I was a pessimist. I guess I am an optimist compared to some lol

Lol same here. This thread has me feeling like Denny 2.0. 

(03-08-2018, 11:41 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Agreed. While $3 mill may not seem like much for NFL contracts, Mike Brown doesn't throw a contract that big to fringe roster players. Baker will make this team barring some injury or incident.

Agreed. This guy is our starting DT the moment he signs.