(04-04-2018, 12:55 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: I think Mixon being our bell cow, along with a better all-around offensive unit, will put the defense in better situations and make it a lot easier to keep them resting on the sideline.

People always complain about Mike Brown being too loyal and not shaking things up enough, so now we finally get five new coaches in here that look to be pretty solid improvements and  some people are still bitching.

People baffle me.

It's not so much as Mike not shaking things up and being too loyal, as it is his patience. He does take his time to make changes that are obvious to fans, sports analyst, housewifes etc. Sure he made changes this year but its been a long time comin and Marvin is still the head coach. Not sure how that dosent baffle you.

(04-04-2018, 02:01 AM)TKUHL Wrote: It's not so much as Mike not shaking things up and being too loyal, as it is his patience. He does take his time to make changes that are obvious to fans, sports analyst, housewifes etc. Sure he made changes this year but its been a long time comin and Marvin is still the head coach. Not sure how that dosent baffle you.

I disagree.

I'm pretty sure that he just felt comfortable and was fine with making money and is too cheap to have made the upgrades in the coaching staff until now.

Now, I feel like it's a combination of his bottom line starting to slip, finally realizing that he doesn't have the football mind of his old man, and just wanting to go all-in to win.  

(04-04-2018, 03:11 AM)BFritz21 Wrote: I disagree.

I'm pretty sure that he just felt comfortable and was fine with making money and is too cheap to have made the upgrades in the coaching staff until now.

Now, I feel like it's a combination of his bottom line starting to slip, finally realizing that he doesn't have the football mind of his old man, and just wanting to go all-in to win.  

you are joking ...............right????

(04-02-2018, 02:20 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: As long as he isn't fond of Chuck Brenshan impressions like Guenther occasionally was, I'll be quite happy with Austin.

This.  I have always thought the Bengals invested a great deal of resources in the secondary (especially the CB position) and wasted it playing off-coverage or zone.  A lot of lesser talent CBs could do what is often asked of our CBs, so why waste so many first round picks on them?  

If the Bengals had a more aggressive scheme, I think our secondary would have a lot more opportunities to jump routes and create turnovers.  They are simply asked to cover for too long.  I am not saying to blitz every down, but it seems as though we are one of the least frequent blitzing teams in the NFL and we see opposing QBs pat the ball, pat the ball, check it down for an easy first down.  

Maybe they haven't had the personnel to do more blitz packages, but I really liked what I saw in our safeties the few times they blitzed.  Maybe this is a place Shaq Griffin could also contribute.  He may not be the biggest guy, but he sure has a nose for the QB coming off the edge.  

Regardless, my hope for Austin is that he plays aggressive and doesn't allow opposing QBs to get comfortable.  I can't imagine that playing such a conservative scheme fires up the players in a way to get the most out of them.  They are paid professionals, yes, but they are also human beings and would probably play better if they enjoyed what they were doing.  

(04-02-2018, 02:29 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Unless my memory is failing me, the Ravens won that Super Bowl

They lost...they just forgot to switch the score back after the power outage.  

(04-02-2018, 02:52 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Guenthars worst season here was his fourth and had the #16 scoring defense.

Mike Zimmers worst season here was his thgird and we had the #24 scoring defense.

Guenthar is a damn good DC.  Don't know why so many people don't like him.  There is a good reason he was the first choice at DC for both Mike Zimmer and Jon Gruden.

We will see how he does with the Raider's defense.  Some of it might have been due to talent.  Look at how his defense suffered without Burfict.  He doesn't have him in Oakland (er, Vegas).

(04-04-2018, 08:05 AM)SHRacerX Wrote:   I can't imagine that playing such a conservative scheme fires up the players in a way to get the most out of them.  They are paid professionals, yes, but they are also human beings and would probably play better if they enjoyed what they were doing.  

It amazes me how some people here claim they can read the minds of the players and know how happy they are playing a certain scheme and how it effects their motivation.

What I believe is that DBs like is making picks and over the four years Guenthar was or DC the bengals were NUMBER ONE in the league in interceptions.

I also think DBs also like shutting down opponents passing games and while Guenthar was our DC the Bengals were NUMBER ONE in the league in pass efficiency rating allowed.

(04-04-2018, 04:16 AM)RASCAL Wrote: you are joking ...............right????

Which part do you disagree with and why?

(04-04-2018, 09:19 AM)fredtoast Wrote: It amazes me how some people here claim they can read the minds of the players and know how happy they are playing a certain scheme and how it effects their motivation.

What I believe is that DBs like is making picks and over the four years Guenthar was or DC the bengals were NUMBER ONE in the league in interceptions.

I also think DBs also like shutting down opponents passing games and while Guenthar was our DC the Bengals were NUMBER ONE in the league in pass efficiency rating allowed.

It amazes me how some people here act as though they can interpret everything from a statistic.  How did the defense fare in comparison to the rest of the league when they weren't working with a high-scoring offense?  When teams have to pass and they are behind, that leads to more INTs.  Even you should be able to understand that. 

And my point wasn't just to the mindset of the DBs (sure, they like getting picks) but think about the energy of the defense as a whole.  How many times have we called them flat?  How many times have we seen everything on the line and the opponent comes out swinging and forces mistakes and big plays and how many times do we just die as slow death.  You, again who admitted to not watching many of the games, can see the energy (or lack thereof) on the players.  

And I feel that has happened on both sides of the ball.  

(04-02-2018, 02:52 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Guenthars worst season here was his fourth and had the #16 scoring defense.

Mike Zimmers worst season here was his thgird and we had the #24 scoring defense.

Guenthar is a damn good DC.  Don't know why so many people don't like him.  There is a good reason he was the first choice at DC for both Mike Zimmer and Jon Gruden.

And on top of it the Bengals did everything they could to retain him. They wanted him here for this upcoming season. Its more telling that he wanted out...

Cool maybe we can get the eagles water boy. Then maybe we have a shot.

(04-02-2018, 12:27 PM)jj22 Wrote: Only one of those could possibly be brag worthy Kaep, (you know the QB who can't get a job) had his squad on the ropes as well. His DB"s did have a good postseason up to that game tho. The other two.....

He got schooled by the hated Steelers. His db's couldn't stop Big Ben at all when it mattered.

Not good.

I'm banking on his fresh eyes and our (aging) talent to keep the D afloat. Austin wasn't my first choice. But I'm going to keep an open mind.

Big Ben had a terrible game against the seahawks, and that is considered to be one of the worst officiated super bowls of all time, most of the calls seemingly going against the seahawks. Kaep was killing teams at that point, he had not been "figured out yet." The Cardinals-Steelers game was definitely not a fine defensive effort, but that might be my favorite super bowl, even though the steelers won.

(04-04-2018, 10:58 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: It amazes me how some people here act as though they can interpret everything from a statistic.  How did the defense fare in comparison to the rest of the league when they weren't working with a high-scoring offense?  When teams have to pass and they are behind, that leads to more INTs.  Even you should be able to understand that. 

Actually I don't understand what you are saying at all.

Are you claiming that the only reason the Bengals finished number one in interceptions is because they had the number one most high powered offense in the league from '14 through '17?

(04-04-2018, 10:58 AM)SHRacerX Wrote:   How many times have we seen everything on the line and the opponent comes out swinging and forces mistakes and big plays and how many times do we just die as slow death. 

Not even sure what this means.

How can you claim that interceptions are not "big plays" by the defense?

The 4 years that Guenthar was our DC our defense forced more turnovers than our opponents and our defense had just as many sacks as our opponents.

(04-04-2018, 11:32 AM)GodFather Wrote: And on top of it the Bengals did everything they could to retain him. They wanted him here for this upcoming season. Its more telling that he wanted out...

He did want out, but I'm thinking that was more to do with realizing he'd never get a HC position here (Marvin was NEVER leaving!) and he stayed specifically for that opportunity. Turned down going with Zimmer, and his good friend Gruden holding out hope Marvin was going to be gone soon. Remember when Zimmer left how "high" Ownership was on him.  Even said (or it was reported) they believe he was the "next Zimmer".

I do believe there was a sense he was the next head coach.

But he didn't want to wait until 2030.

(04-04-2018, 05:05 PM)jj22 Wrote: He did want out, but I'm thinking that was more to do with realizing he'd never get a HC position here (Marvin was NEVER leaving!) and he stayed specifically for that opportunity. Turned down going with Zimmer, and his good friend Gruden holding out hope Marvin was going to be gone soon. Remember when Zimmer left how "high" Ownership was on him.  Even said (or it was reported) they believe he was the "next Zimmer".

I do believe there was a sense he was the next head coach.

But he didn't want to wait until 2030.

so he chose to go to a team with a coach who signed a 10 year contract? 

Then get some head coach opportunities. Yes. All eyes will be on the Raiders assistants if they have a good year. He was losing HC candidate steam here. He was an up and coming coach until the last couple years. Then crickets. No one was looking at Bengals assistants any longer.

(04-04-2018, 04:55 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Not even sure what this means.

How can you claim that interceptions are not "big plays" by the defense?

The 4 years that Guenthar was our DC our defense forced more turnovers than our opponents and our defense had just as many sacks as our opponents.

Just keep dancing away from it and cherry pick what you think makes your point.  Still waiting for how they did compared to the rest of the league when their offense wasn't scoring.  

(04-04-2018, 08:08 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: We will see how he does with the Raider's defense.  Some of it might have been due to talent.  Look at how his defense suffered without Burfict.  He doesn't have him in Oakland (er, Vegas).

Agreed. I believe a lot of the success Guenther experienced with us was due mainly to talent. But Fred makes a good point, Guenther has received a lot of intense criticism from Bengal fans when the defense was playing well. He is over-hated, but at the same time overrated IMO. We can do better, and I think (hope) we did with the Austin hire. Time will tell, but I think Guenthers time in Oakland will be short lived. 

(04-05-2018, 08:27 AM)Pat5775 Wrote: Agreed. I believe a lot of the success Guenther experienced with us was due mainly to talent. But Fred makes a good point, Guenther has received a lot of intense criticism from Bengal fans when the defense was playing well. He is over-hated, but at the same time overrated IMO. We can do better, and I think (hope) we did with the Austin hire. Time will tell, but I think Guenthers time in Oakland will be short lived. 

I didn't hate on Guenther.  My "hate" was on the overall scheme, which is approved on by the head coach.  

I see Guenther as what many new coaches (and players) do in terms of having success early and once the league figures them out, they struggle.  They don't have the ability to adapt.  

I like the guy and wish him success in Oakland/Vegas, but if you are going to measure what the guy was by throwing stats together from a time when he had a very high-powered offense on the other side of the ball, and a guy that I see as the best LB in the league, then I feel it is only fair to compare his success (or lack therof) when he didn't have either of those.