All the hate on MJ baffles me. Yes, he is not as good a rusher as he once was. But, he is still strong against the run (something the team struggles with), and he is still highly effective when moved inside. Sorry, I just do not see him going anywhere.... (actually, not sorry, I like MJ)

(05-01-2018, 08:04 AM)Sled21 Wrote: All the hate on MJ baffles me. Yes, he is not as good a rusher as he once was. But, he is still strong against the run (something the team struggles with), and he is still highly effective when moved inside. Sorry, I just do not see him going anywhere.... (actually, not sorry, I like MJ)

To me it's a numbers game. We will see what happens in camp, but he is simply the most likely to be cut of the line in my eyes as long as Willis has continued to develop.

(05-01-2018, 08:04 AM)Sled21 Wrote: All the hate on MJ baffles me. Yes, he is not as good a rusher as he once was. But, he is still strong against the run (something the team struggles with), and he is still highly effective when moved inside. Sorry, I just do not see him going anywhere.... (actually, not sorry, I like MJ)

For some reason certain players get more hate than they deserve.  Robert Geathers, Kyle Cook, Domata Peko.

People even hated on Peko when he was consistently among the league leaders in tackles among interior linemen and Mike "God" Zimmer was saying he was among the best NTs he ever coached.  People claimed that Peko starting for us was proof that "Mike Brown did not care about winning" then when he becomes a free agent the Broncos not only sign him they pay him more than the Bengals were.

That being said MJ is not the player he once was.  I am hoping that one of the young guys can develop into a top level players and replace him, or that two different players take his snaps from inside and outside.  Unlike many people here I have not seen it yet. but I also know MJ is getting older instead of better, so it is possible his play may be declining from year to year.

(05-01-2018, 08:18 AM)Au165 Wrote:  as long as Willis has continued to develop.

This is the key to me.

Some people claim that Willis looked great last year.  In the few games I got to see he did nothing special and his full season production based on stats was not very impressive.

However, as you all know, I am the guy who never judges a player too harshly based on his rookie season.  So if Willis has continued to develop and MJ has slipped another notch due to age it is possible that MJ could be gone.

Like I said before many times the contract extensions are not done until training camp.  So maybe the coaches will want to see Willis and MJ on the field before they make any decisions.

Hubbard looks like a more natural replacement for MJ than Willis, but I don't know if he will be ready his rookie year.

(05-01-2018, 08:57 AM)fredtoast Wrote: For some reason certain players get more hate than they deserve.  Robert Geathers, Kyle Cook, Domata Peko.

People even hated on Peko when he was consistently among the league leaders in tackles among interior linemen and Mike "God" Zimmer was saying he was among the best NTs he ever coached.  People claimed that Peko starting for us was proof that "Mike Brown did not care about winning" then when he becomes a free agent the Broncos not only sign him they pay him more than the Bengals were.

That being said MJ is not the player he once was.  I am hoping that one of the young guys can develop into a top level players and replace him, or that two different players take his snaps from inside and outside.  Unlike many people here I have not seen it yet. but I also know MJ is getting older instead of better, so it is possible his play may be declining from year to year.

Yep, everyone gets old, and sooner or later in the NFL someone is going to take your job. If the new kids can outplay Johnson, so be it, it's time for him to go, but there is no reason for all the "He sucks" types talk. He's been a very good player for us, and still is. I suspect he has a year or two left in him in the rotation....

(04-30-2018, 10:25 PM)jfkbengals Wrote: Disagree that Hubbard is MJ's replacement, at least currently.  Hubbard is taking the roster spot vacated by Chris Smith...

MJ did well sliding to DT.  Short term?  He's  apt to remain.  Hubbard COULD drop a little weight and be a LB/DE swing guy. He was an All State FS in HS.  Not thinking he can bulk up to be a DE/DT.

Rey is NOT great but is rather durable and versatile.   We CAN let him go. Will we?  Well.. maybe if we need to. Hewitt and Iloka ain't going anywhere, we don't have a replacement. LaFell? Might be gone next Year.  i'm SURE the Bengals PRIORITY is " get better" ,so,  to save SOME $....they will need to be sure they have a replacement.   I said SURE.   Not " maybe that 7th rd guy does good....."

after a couple preseason games.... we get a few good clues.

If Hubbard is a real badass and plays until his late 30's I wonder if they will call him "that old muther".


And if so, will he give his poor doggy a bone?

(05-01-2018, 04:50 PM)fredtoast Wrote: If Hubbard is a real badass and plays until his late 30's I wonder if they will call him "that old muther".


And if so, will he give his poor doggy a bone?

Remember ack when Dunlap MJ and Atkins were young they were the Fisher Price package?

With Price And Fisher on the OL im hoping the new Fisher Price has as much success as the old one

(05-01-2018, 08:04 AM)Sled21 Wrote: All the hate on MJ baffles me. Yes, he is not as good a rusher as he once was. But, he is still strong against the run (something the team struggles with), and he is still highly effective when moved inside. Sorry, I just do not see him going anywhere.... (actually, not sorry, I like MJ)

dude was and is overated

(04-30-2018, 04:26 PM)kevin Wrote: Bengals said this after signing Buffalo Bills Left Tackle and Linebacker and Eifert.   Team said these moves meant they had no money to keep Bodine, Hill or Pacman. Team said they could address Bodine gone early in draft, which they did.  Team also said after draft they can cut one or two players to get under the salary cap, which they will.  I can think or a couple of higher paid Bengals that team is getting kind of frustrated with who would get team under the cap, plus it seems like their replacements added to team last 2 months.  So coaches and players are having practices today on Monday after the draft. The additions have been made, but salary cap demands that now subtractions be made of one or two higher paid veterans.  One player will have fans on here screaming if cut, but his situations put him in with players team can't count on in games. Anyway, veteran cuts are coming to be followed by fans angry on this site. They must get back under the cap.  They did get Buffalo's Left Tackle and Linebacker, but the price tag forces somebody out the door. After last 2 losing seasons, the team said changes were a coming.  Team said they would make cuts to get under cap probably soon after the draft, and draft is now over.

Cuts necessary ONLY if Mikey  insists on "rolling over" ~$10M to his family bank account. Otherwise, the franchise does not need to make cuts. Although I would approve of certain cuts.

(05-01-2018, 09:04 AM)fredtoast Wrote: This is the key to me.

Some people claim that Willis looked great last year.  In the few games I got to see he did nothing special and his full season production based on stats was not very impressive.

However, as you all know, I am the guy who never judges a player too harshly based on his rookie season.  So if Willis has continued to develop and MJ has slipped another notch due to age it is possible that MJ could be gone.

Like I said before many times the contract extensions are not done until training camp.  So maybe the coaches will want to see Willis and MJ on the field before they make any decisions.

Hubbard looks like a more natural replacement for MJ than Willis, but I don't know if he will be ready his rookie year.

(05-01-2018, 04:41 PM)redwood Wrote: MJ did well sliding to DT.  Short term?  He's  apt to remain.  Hubbard COULD drop a little weight and be a LB/DE swing guy. He was an All State FS in HS.  Not thinking he can bulk up to be a DE/DT.

Rey is NOT great but is rather durable and versatile.   We CAN let him go. Will we?  Well.. maybe if we need to. Hewitt and Iloka ain't going anywhere, we don't have a replacement. LaFell? Might be gone next Year.  i'm SURE the Bengals PRIORITY is " get better" ,so,  to save SOME $....they will need to be sure they have a replacement.   I said SURE.   Not " maybe that 7th rd guy does good....."

after a couple preseason games.... we get a few good clues.

Here's the thing.  If MJ is slipping into role player status, that guy that sees some downs at one spot and some downs at another, are y'all comfortable with still paying him starting DE salary?  Let's just let camp and preseason play out.  MJ was looking mighty tired toward the end of the year, last season.

(05-01-2018, 08:03 PM)Derrick Wrote: Cuts necessary ONLY if Mikey  insists on "rolling over" ~$10M to his family bank account.

Actually Mike Browns rolls it over into the next years cap, unlike some other owners.

That is why we were able to epend above the league salary cap in '16.

Seems to me that the players that people want cut are solid but are not impact guys. Mj has never really been a high sack guy. Rey is a back up nothing more and Lafell has games where he disappears. I would like to see what some of the young guys can do given a chance rather than hang on to the ageing vets.

(05-01-2018, 08:04 AM)Sled21 Wrote: All the hate on MJ baffles me. Yes, he is not as good a rusher as he once was. But, he is still strong against the run (something the team struggles with), and he is still highly effective when moved inside. Sorry, I just do not see him going anywhere.... (actually, not sorry, I like MJ)

Is it hate for MJ though? I seriously doubt, you will find a better man in the locker room than MJ. I think the problem is, he's aging and he seemed to slow down some lastyear. Time does catch up with all us. I wouldn't cut him till we see what we have in TC or OTA.

I think fans are just looking for change, hoping the change improves the team. I think vets may keep young studs like I believe Malone, for example, from the field. I just hope to see Ross this year flying down sideline making catches.

I don't pay much (well, any) attention to player's salary, but it seems to me the most likely candidates to be cut don't make enough money to make it worthwhile.

(05-01-2018, 08:03 PM)Derrick Wrote: Cuts necessary ONLY if Mikey  insists on "rolling over" ~$10M to his family bank account. Otherwise, the franchise does not need to make cuts. Although I would approve of certain cuts.

You do realize he can't do that, right???

I found Bengals. com article by Geoff Hobson of March 17th, 2018 of headline BENGALS TAKE A STEP BACK AFTER 6 BUSY DAYS. This story can be Googled up and easily found. In this news story it says Bengals went over their free agent budget by 10 Million dollars. It says that resigning Eifert, Lasor bringing in Matt Barkley that the Bengals had no idea they could get Left Tackle Cordy Glenn or Middle Linebacker Preston Brown. As of March 17th it said " Bengals will deal with the 10 Million later ". It says Bengals now tight on free agency money will probably not keep Bodine, Hill and probably not Pacman Jones. It says Bengals have to go into draft looking at Center. On the 10 Million more they spent on free agency than they planned. a very short paragraph stands out. " Try early May. The Bengals figure to jettison some contracts, but it's doubtful they would do it before the draft. "

There is also this from Ian Rapoport @RapSheet. " If #Bengals Vontaze Burfict loses his appeal on a 4-game suspension, the guarantees in his 3 year, 33M contract will void. That's nearly 11.3 M. Which means the Bengals can move on if they want to " This was dated March 16th and Hobson was dated March 17th. This is in a story by Patrick Judis in SB NATION. Cincy Jungle of March 16th of headline, " Should Bengals Move On From Vontaze Burfict After 3rd Suspension In 3 Years ?

On April 2nd CBS Sports has headline, "Bengals Shoot Down Vontaze Burfict Trade Rumors."

So I go back to Hobson March 17th saying Bengals figure to jettison some contracts in May due to spending 10 Million more in free agency than they planned. I have to wonder if Bengals now getting back 11.3 Million on Burfict contact changes the " jettison " of other contracts.

Now you can't just use the modern catch phrase on everything, " Fake News ", because since March 16th and March 17th, most of these things came to pass. Bodine, Hill are gone. Pacman Jones not trying to be signed. Center was addressed early in draft. So is Hobson saying Bengals to jettison contracts in May also accurate?

I have to feel the " jettison of contracts " could still happen in May as Hobson said in March. According to Hobson Bengals say they have 10 Million in free agent over spending to deal with. Now if Burfict suspension means much of Burfict contract is void and Bengals get back 11.3 Million of his contract, that could be the 10 Million right there. So maybe the suspension makes it so the jettison of contracts no longer needed. I'm thinking this mean Burfict stays but at 11.3 Million less, but it's way too legal and inside front office stuff. Did Hobson factor in the contracts of Bodine, Hill and Pacman if not on team ? The Pacman contract and a huge saving in the Burfict contact due to suspension clauses could wipe out the 10 Mil maybe, but it is for high paid lawyers to figure out.

You put it all together, and I still come back with players getting cut in May to get the 10 Million back is very possible in the original Hobson story. I guess we find out in May. Just don't be surprised if " Bengals jettison contracts in May ", as Hobson said March 17th. I feel either way that Bengals have been making changes and will have a better team in 2018, so for that, GO BENGALS.

I MUST NOW ADD that I just saw someone on this site posted Bengals not picking up 5th year option on Ogbuehi who was First Round pick of recent years. If that is true, then Hobson in March was correct on Bengals To Jettison Contracts In May.

Quote:Now if Burfict suspension means much of Burfict contract is void and Bengals get back 11.3 Million of his contract, that could be the 10 Million right there.

That Vontaze..... he's a team player......

(05-01-2018, 08:40 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Here's the thing.  If MJ is slipping into role player status, that guy that sees some downs at one spot and some downs at another, are y'all comfortable with still paying him starting DE salary?  Let's just let camp and preseason play out.  MJ was looking mighty tired toward the end of the year, last season.

I see other teams get players to take massive pay cuts when they under perform their contract, yet the Bengals either keep them and in rare cases cut them. Hate MB all you want, but he is loyal. 

Too loyal in my opinion and I would have a few agents on speed dial right now discussing pay cuts if they want to remain a Bengal.

AS for MJ, I appreciate the fact he is very good against the run while others only judge a DE by sacks, but I do think he is now overpaid, but should not be cut, he should be asked to take a pay cut.