I was checking out some fantasy football videos on NFL.com and the question someone asked was, Is Andy Dalton a viable 2nd QB in a 2 QB league. I expected a resounding No.

But the answer was "absolutely, look at all the weapons around Dalton."

AJ Green, Marvin Jones is back, Sanu, Eifert, Jeremy Hill and Bernard were all mentioned. Then there is Burkhead, Hewitt and Little off the bench, none of whom were mentioned.

Is any other QB surrounded by more? If so, who and what do they have?


Thoughts

BTW, I didn't draft Dalton, but I did snag Jeremy Hill early, Bengals D in the middle rounds and I got Marvin Jones with the very last pick.

(09-10-2015, 01:32 AM)BengalChris Wrote: I was checking out some fantasy football videos on NFL.com and the question someone asked was, Is Andy Dalton a viable 2nd QB in a 2 QB league. I expected a resounding No.

But the answer was "absolutely, look at all the weapons around Dalton."

AJ Green, Marvin Jones is back, Sanu, Eifert, Jeremy Hill and Bernard were all mentioned. Then there is Burkhead, Hewitt and Little off the bench, none of whom were mentioned.

Is any other QB surrounded by more? If so, who and what do they have?


Thoughts

BTW, I didn't draft Dalton, but I did snag Jeremy Hill early, Bengals D in the middle rounds and I got Marvin Jones with the very last pick.

The Bengals have some good weapons this year. Green and Hill will make a big impact (barring injuries) and we have a lot of players with potential to be great. It's too bad we couldn't have this loaded of a roster in the past.

Dalton's total TDs (passing, rushing, receiving) the last three years:
2012: 31
2013: 35
2014: 34

While he turns the ball over quiet a bit in real life, touchdowns (even in non-standard scoring leagues) trumps all in fantasy, and those are decent enough numbers, especially as a QB2. I could see Dalton throwing 35 touchdowns this year (2 more than his career high of 2013 and rushing for another 2-4). Knocking on the door of 40 total touchdowns is solid enough in that format.

(09-10-2015, 01:32 AM)BengalChris Wrote: I was checking out some fantasy football videos on NFL.com and the question someone asked was, Is Andy Dalton a viable 2nd QB in a 2 QB league. I expected a resounding No.

But the answer was "absolutely, look at all the weapons around Dalton."

AJ Green, Marvin Jones is back, Sanu, Eifert, Jeremy Hill and Bernard were all mentioned. Then there is Burkhead, Hewitt and Little off the bench, none of whom were mentioned.

Is any other QB surrounded by more? If so, who and what do they have?


Thoughts

BTW, I didn't draft Dalton, but I did snag Jeremy Hill early, Bengals D in the middle rounds and I got Marvin Jones with the very last pick.

Bengals fan since i was born in 73 and i have to honestly say that i would not trade the set of weapons Andy has for any other set in the NFL. When i say set i mean you cant pick this wr from this team and rb from another. Please Andy be Direct Tv Andy and not Prime Time Andy with cable. Best roster in the league its all up to that guy throwing the ball.

(09-10-2015, 01:48 AM)jowczarski Wrote: Dalton's total TDs (passing, rushing, receiving) the last three years:
2012: 31
2013: 35
2014: 34

While he turns the ball over quiet a bit in real life, touchdowns (even in non-standard scoring leagues) trumps all in fantasy, and those are decent enough numbers, especially as a QB2. I could see Dalton throwing 35 touchdowns this year (2 more than his career high of 2013 and rushing for another 2-4). Knocking on the door of 40 total touchdowns is solid enough in that format.

I think your 2014 number is about 10 off.

(09-10-2015, 01:53 AM)TKUHL Wrote: Bengals fan since i was born in 73 and i have to honestly say that i would not trade the set of weapons Andy has for any other set in the NFL. When i say set i mean you cant pick this wr from this team and rb from another. Please Andy be Direct Tv Andy and not Prime Time Andy with cable. Best roster in the league its all up to that guy throwing the ball.

lol the Bengals don't have the best weapons in the league... I like the Bengals, but that's just crazy talk.

(09-10-2015, 02:01 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: lol the Bengals don't have the best weapons in the league... I like the Bengals, but that's just crazy talk.

Who has better and what do they have? Let's lay it all on the table here.

(09-10-2015, 02:05 AM)BengalChris Wrote: Who has better and what do they have? Let's lay it all on the table here.

In all fairness the Bears had Jay Cutler (who isn't great, but is much better than people admit) surrounded by Matt Forte, Alshon Jeffrey, Brandon Marshall, and Martellus Bennett and the offense was ranked in the 20s and they went 5-11.  With that crew on paper I would have expected much more.

HMm, I guess my comment is more about "weapons on paper versus production" than what Dalton has compared to others.

(09-10-2015, 02:05 AM)BengalChris Wrote: Who has better and what do they have? Let's lay it all on the table here.

Denver
Detroit
Green Bay
Pittsburgh
Tampa Bay
Washington
Dallas
Indy
Chicago

(09-10-2015, 02:13 AM)Nately120 Wrote: In all fairness the Bears had Jay Cutler (who isn't great, but is much better than people admit) surrounded by Matt Forte, Alshon Jeffrey, Brandon Marshall, and Martellus Bennett and the offense was ranked in the 20s and they went 5-11.  With that crew on paper I would have expected much more.

HMm, I guess my comment is more about "weapons on paper versus production" than what Dalton has compared to others.

Marshall is gone and #1 pick Kevin White is done for the year.

Are these better weapons than what the Bengals have put there?

I won my fantasy championship with Dalton as my QB all year. Ironically, I sat him for Mark Sanchez for my two playoff games ....

(true story)

(09-10-2015, 02:30 AM)BengalChris Wrote: Marshall is gone and #1 pick Kevin White is done for the year.

Are these better weapons than what the Bengals have put there?

We have a lot of unproven talent. The only talent that has shown that they are top tier in the NFL is Green. Hill had a great rookie season, but I can show you RBs that had just as good rookie seasons, and then dropped off a cliff. Sanu, Jones, Eifert, Bernard, Hewitt, and Hill still have a lot to prove in the NFL. There is much much more proven talent out there.

(09-10-2015, 02:15 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Denver
Detroit
Green Bay
Pittsburgh
Tampa Bay
Washington
Dallas
Indy
Chicago

Pittsburgh - Possibly better weapons, Bell, Brown and Bryant are excellent.
Indy - Another possible one. Hilton, Johnson, Gore and Fleener are up there.
Denver - Another possibility of better weapons.

Each of the above, have better QBs and guys like Manning make receivers look good.

I don't see the rest of these.
Green Bay - Jordy Nelson is out for year. Randal Cobb, Adams and Lacy aren't better than AJ Green, Jones, Sanu and Hill.
Tampa Bay - Evans is great, but I don't see how the rest of their weapons match up, particularly for a rookie QB who's raw.
Washington - Must be a joke.
Dallas - Dez Bryant and Witten, then who else matches up?
Chicago - Marshall was traded, Kevin White is done for the year.

I was looking for a earnest discussion.

(09-10-2015, 02:47 AM)BengalChris Wrote: Pittsburgh - Possibly better weapons, Bell, Brown and Bryant are excellent.
Indy - Another possible one. Hilton, Johnson, Gore and Fleener are up there.
Denver - Another possibility of better weapons.

Each of the above, have better QBs and guys like Manning make receivers look good.

I don't see the rest of these.
Green Bay - Jordy Nelson is out for year. Randal Cobb, Adams and Lacy aren't better than AJ Green, Jones, Sanu and Hill.
Tampa Bay - Evans is great, but I don't see how the rest of their weapons match up, particularly for a rookie QB who's raw.
Washington - Must be a joke.
Dallas - Dez Bryant and Witten, then who else matches up?
Chicago - Marshall was traded, Kevin White is done for the year.

I was looking for a earnest discussion.

Randal Cobb(had almost 1300 yards and 13 TD last season), Adams, James Jones , and Lacy is very comparable to our weapons.
Evans, and Jackson are both great receivers (both had 1000 yard seasons last year). Doug Martin had a 1450 yards 11 TD season not too long ago.
DeSawn Jackson (averaged 1250 yards the last two seasons), and Pierre Garcon (had a 1300 yard season in 2013) are both great receivers. Alford Morris had a 1600 rushing 13 TD season not too long ago.
Dez Bryant and Witten are better than our receivers and Terrance Williams shows as much potential as Jones. They will have the OL to be able to have any RB do well.
Alshon Jefferys, Eddie Royal, Bennett, Forte is just as good as what we have if not better. Plus White will be playing this year.

Maybe you should do some research on other teams. Or maybe you should actually look at what our players have done.

(09-10-2015, 01:32 AM)BengalChris Wrote:  
AJ Green - no argument here but he has to eliminate some mistakes
Marvin Jones - had one very good season, has to remain healthy to prove his value
Sanu - solid performer as a #3
Eifert - hasn't really proven any of the hype as of yet. Like Jones, must stay healthy  
Jeremy Hill - no argument, looks to achieve elite status
Bernard - good player, but has yet to live up to James Brooks comparisons
Burkhead, - great role player, but he is a role player
Hewitt - tough kid who likes to hit, makes him an elite H-Back
Little - solid-ish preseason, hasn't proven anything

Plus, a lot of these are only as good as Dalton and our Oline helps make them. Dalton has to take "that" step before we anoint them him or his weapons as top tier. Bodie has to perform better if we want Hill to earn his living between the tackles.

I want to agree with you, but most of these guys are ?s, as are some of the guys mentioned on other teams. We need to save this conversation for week 8 or 9, if not the end of the season.

(09-10-2015, 02:30 AM)BengalChris Wrote: Marshall is gone and #1 pick Kevin White is done for the year.

Are these better weapons than what the Bengals have put there?

I'm aware of this.  I'm just saying how an offense can have a nice setup on paper and still fall flat.  Most NFL teams that aren't stuck in QB hell actually have a decent set of players on the field.

(09-10-2015, 03:01 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Randal Cobb(had almost 1300 yards and 13 TD last season), Adams, James Jones , and Lacy is very comparable to our weapons.
Evans, and Jackson are both great receivers (both had 1000 yard seasons last year). Doug Martin had a 1450 yards 11 TD season not too long ago.
DeSawn Jackson (averaged 1250 yards the last two seasons), and Pierre Garcon (had a 1300 yard season in 2013) are both great receivers. Alford Morris had a 1600 rushing 13 TD season not too long ago.
Dez Bryant and Witten are better than our receivers and Terrance Williams shows as much potential as Jones. They will have the OL to be able to have any RB do well.
Alshon Jefferys, Eddie Royal, Bennett, Forte is just as good as what we have if not better. Plus White will be playing this year.

Maybe you should do some research on other teams. Or maybe you should actually look at what our players have done.

You seem to think that I've stated the Bengals have the best talent. I thought it would make a good discussion to compare to others and if anyone has better and what do they have.

Of course, when one wants to protect AD's image so that when he fails there can be something, anything to deflect the blame away from Dalton, then I understand what you are saying.


So, you would trade Green, Jones, Sanu and Hill for Garcon, Morris and Jackson? Or Green, Jones, Sanu and Hill for Evans, Jackson and Martin? I doubt it. I can't even name the #3 receivers from those teams.

(09-10-2015, 04:56 AM)BengalChris Wrote: You seem to think that I've stated the Bengals have the best talent. I thought it would make a good discussion to compare to others and if anyone has better and what do they have.

Of course, when one wants to protect AD's image so that when he fails there can be something, anything to deflect the blame away from Dalton, then I understand what you are saying.


So, you would trade Green, Jones, Sanu and Hill for Garcon, Morris and Jackson? Or Green, Jones, Sanu and Hill for Evans, Jackson and Martin? I doubt it. I can't even name the #3 receivers from those teams.

I would defiantly consider it. Green (1426 yards 11 TDs) is better than any of those receivers, but Jones, and Sanu are no where close to Garcon(1346 yards 5 TDs)/D. Jackson (1332 yards 9 TDs)/Evans (1051 yards 12 TDs) /V. Jackson (1384 yards 8 TDs). Hill is very comparable to any of those RBs. In fact both of those RBs had a better rookie season than Hill.

We have a great #1 receiver, and the rest of our receivers are all unproven. Jones has been very injury prone, but he had one good season with 712 yards and 10 TDs. Sanu hasn't impressed me at all. He had 790 yards with 5 TDs while playing a decent amount of games as the #1, and the rest as the #2. Sanu also had the worst drop % in the league (with at least 50 receptions). Hill had a good rookie season, but he had a fumble issue. Both Morris (1613 yards 13 TDs) and Martin (1454 yards 11 TDs) had better rookie seasons than Hill (1124 yards 9 TDs), so we will have to see if Hill lives up to his rookie expectations.

Giving up Green would be the only reason I would have to consider it. He's a great receiver, but let's not act like he's leaps and bounds better than most of the receivers that I named.

(09-10-2015, 05:12 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: I would defiantly consider it. Green (1426 yards 11 TDs) is better than any of those receivers, but Jones, and Sanu are no where close to Garcon(1346 yards 5 TDs)/D. Jackson (1332 yards 9 TDs)/Evans (1051 yards 12 TDs) /V. Jackson (1384 yards 8 TDs). Hill is very comparable to any of those RBs. In fact both of those RBs had a better rookie season than Hill.

We have a great #1 receiver, and the rest of our receivers are all unproven. Jones has been very injury prone, but he had one good season with 712 yards and 10 TDs. Sanu hasn't impressed me at all. He had 790 yards with 5 TDs while playing a decent amount of games as the #1, and the rest as the #2. Sanu also had the worst drop % in the league (with at least 50 receptions). Hill had a good rookie season, but he had a fumble issue. Both Morris (1613 yards 13 TDs) and Martin (1454 yards 11 TDs) had better rookie seasons than Hill (1124 yards 9 TDs), so we will have to see if Hill lives up to his rookie expectations.

Giving up Green would be the only reason I would have to consider it. He's a great receiver, but let's not act like he's leaps and bounds better than most of the receivers that I named.

But still, the Bengals have put together one of the best set of offensive weapons around. Is it a top 5 set? Top 10 set?

(09-10-2015, 05:31 AM)BengalChris Wrote: But still, the Bengals have put together one of the best set of offensive weapons around. Is it a top 5 set? Top 10 set?

definitely not in the top 5 (as of right now), but I would say top 10 yes.