https://www.bengals.com/news/hobson-s-choice-bengaldom-takes-in-massive-change

It may be a new dey but Goebbels still going with the same nonsense.  That guy makes me sick.

(02-11-2019, 12:25 PM)McC Wrote: https://www.bengals.com/news/hobson-s-choice-bengaldom-takes-in-massive-change

It may be a new dey but Goebbels still going with the same nonsense.  That guy makes me sick.

Such as?

(02-11-2019, 12:25 PM)McC Wrote: https://www.bengals.com/news/hobson-s-choice-bengaldom-takes-in-massive-change

It may be a new dey but Goebbels still going with the same nonsense.  That guy makes me sick.

So which answer made you "sick"

Answer number one..."He made that clear in his opening address that he wants to build through the draft, but there are always exceptions and I could see them making an exception this March and going out early to get a UFA to free up the draft.  .  .  I said last month the 11th pick has got to be a tackle. Offense or defense. The bigger the better with this pick. Houston D-tackle Ed Oliver doesn’t have the kind of size I’d like to see at that spot, so give me Williams, the Alabama O-tackle."


Answer #2.....Bengals will not open up QB competition.


Answer #3....." I can see them dabbling in free agency on the offensive line because they need tackles. But the bottom line for this club to win is that these last two draft classes are filled with players that need to take that big leap between their first and second years and second and third years, such as John Ross, Jordan Willis, Billy Price, Malik Jefferson, Darius Phillips, etc. That’s one of the answers before free agency. They need those two to evolve like the '16 draft (William Jackson, Tyler Boyd, Nick Vigil, Clayton Fejedelem), which has been very solid."


Answer #4...….See #3


Answer #5 (Should we be concerned that assistants never had success at Miami?)…..Hobs says no.


Answer #6...………"New uniforms? They’ve got bigger fish to fry, but stay tuned. In 2019, you never know.


Answe #7 (a)……."You make a great point about Lewis’ first free-agent class. He got two great cultural leaders in that one (defensive tackle John Thornton and tight end Reggie Kelly) as well as a Pro Bowl cornerback in Tory James. Nice. I think Taylor has to be thinking leadership, among other things.  I think Taylor is going to cultivate veterans that are already here as well as possibly look elsewhere.


Answer #7 (b)…….I don’t think the draft process changes much with the hiring of Taylor. A key member of the search committee runs the draft and I would imagine Due Tobin, director of player personnel, is pretty much on the same page with Taylor. So drafting a linebacker No. 1 would be out of the box if you look at the last 10 drafts or so with Tobin running the room.  .  .  They sure need one, but they also need both kinds of tackles and I think one of the first-round principles in this draft room has been size. Good big guys (certainly long rangy corners) are the rarest of players. Keep me down for tackle. They went for speed once with John Ross and they’re still trying to find a place for him, although I think he’ll be a big-time contributor in the new offense."


Answer #8...…... (Should we sign Tre Flowers?)...…."I don’t know if there’s enough for him and A.J. Green. I think that’s a principle that’s going to hold. The mega money is going to extensions and probably not new deals."


Answer #9...….."You may not be excited about the names that were announced on the offensive staff Thursday, but you should be excited about the proven systems they helped make successful. Callahan, offensive line coaches Jim Turner and Ben Martin and tight ends coaches James Casey have worked and played in schemes that produced recent Super Bowl championships in Denver and Green Bay, as well as the Rams’ NFL title from last month. If you ask me, those are great models for a team getting a jump on the 2020s."






Seems like the only propaganda he is spinning is the justification of the coaches that have been hired for Taylors staff.  The rest of it looks like straightforward honest answers to me.


So which part did you think was nonsense?

How many team homepages are ever going to be at all critical of the team? You act like he's an independent reporter...

The funny thing is, I live about an hour from Pittsburgh, and they usually have someone from the Away team on the radio...and they had Butch Hobson on. Butch is apparently his nickname.

He was pretty unbiased in his assessment of the Bengals. While I can't remember specifics of what he said, I remember feeling that he was pretty accurate and I was kind of shocked that it's the same guy that writes the articles on Bengals.com.

...Yea not sure what the complaint here is about.

(02-11-2019, 12:53 PM)fredtoast Wrote: So which answer made you "sick"

Answer number one..."He made that clear in his opening address that he wants to build through the draft, but there are always exceptions and I could see them making an exception this March and going out early to get a UFA to free up the draft.  .  .  I said last month the 11th pick has got to be a tackle. Offense or defense. The bigger the better with this pick. Houston D-tackle Ed Oliver doesn’t have the kind of size I’d like to see at that spot, so give me Williams, the Alabama O-tackle."


Answer #2.....Bengals will not open up QB competition.


Answer #3....." I can see them dabbling in free agency on the offensive line because they need tackles. But the bottom line for this club to win is that these last two draft classes are filled with players that need to take that big leap between their first and second years and second and third years, such as John Ross, Jordan Willis, Billy Price, Malik Jefferson, Darius Phillips, etc. That’s one of the answers before free agency. They need those two to evolve like the '16 draft (William Jackson, Tyler Boyd, Nick Vigil, Clayton Fejedelem), which has been very solid."


Answer #4...….See #3


Answer #5 (Should we be concerned that assistants never had success at Miami?)…..Hobs says no.


Answer #6...………"New uniforms? They’ve got bigger fish to fry, but stay tuned. In 2019, you never know.


Answe #7 (a)……."You make a great point about Lewis’ first free-agent class. He got two great cultural leaders in that one (defensive tackle John Thornton and tight end Reggie Kelly) as well as a Pro Bowl cornerback in Tory James. Nice. I think Taylor has to be thinking leadership, among other things.  I think Taylor is going to cultivate veterans that are already here as well as possibly look elsewhere.


Answer #7 (b)…….I don’t think the draft process changes much with the hiring of Taylor. A key member of the search committee runs the draft and I would imagine Due Tobin, director of player personnel, is pretty much on the same page with Taylor. So drafting a linebacker No. 1 would be out of the box if you look at the last 10 drafts or so with Tobin running the room.  .  .  They sure need one, but they also need both kinds of tackles and I think one of the first-round principles in this draft room has been size. Good big guys (certainly long rangy corners) are the rarest of players. Keep me down for tackle. They went for speed once with John Ross and they’re still trying to find a place for him, although I think he’ll be a big-time contributor in the new offense."


Answer #8...…... (Should we sign Tre Flowers?)...…."I don’t know if there’s enough for him and A.J. Green. I think that’s a principle that’s going to hold. The mega money is going to extensions and probably not new deals."


Answer #9...….."You may not be excited about the names that were announced on the offensive staff Thursday, but you should be excited about the proven systems they helped make successful. Callahan, offensive line coaches Jim Turner and Ben Martin and tight ends coaches James Casey have worked and played in schemes that produced recent Super Bowl championships in Denver and Green Bay, as well as the Rams’ NFL title from last month. If you ask me, those are great models for a team getting a jump on the 2020s."






Seems like the only propaganda he is spinning is the justification of the coaches that have been hired for Taylors staff.  The rest of it looks like straightforward honest answers to me.


So which part did you think was nonsense?

I think those getting upset about the spin are those that expected/hoped the team would change its mindset on free agency now that Marvin's gone, but it sounds like it hasn't. I think people wanted to hear that the Bengals would start going for top-tier FAs rather than reserve their money for extensions.

Personally, I'm not surprised, as this is the same FO as when Marvin was here. Expect guys who have connections to the coach(es) in some way and/or those who are considered more B-tier players to plug in as short-term starters until draft picks come (along).

(02-11-2019, 01:56 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I think those getting upset about the spin are those that expected/hoped the team would change its mindset on free agency now that Marvin's gone, but it sounds like it hasn't. I think people wanted to hear that the Bengals would start going for top-tier FAs rather than reserve their money for extensions.

Personally, I'm not surprised, as this is the same FO as when Marvin was here. Expect guys who have connections to the coach(es) in some way and/or those who are considered more B-tier players to plug in as short-term starters until draft picks come (along).

I doubt Marvin was anti-free agency. It is a front office thing.

That said, IF we don't sign 2-3 starters...we're not going to compete for a playoff spot this year. Maybe that's ok?

The whole don't sign unrestricted free agents because you lose compensatory picks is IMO the worst part of our strategy.

JON: Even before the change at head coach, you had to wonder if they’d adjust their free-agent approach given what has to be done on the offensive line and at linebacker. One of the Bengals’ hard and fast principles is to stay away from unrestricted free agents so they don’t lose compensatory draft picks for the UFAs they lose. The Bengals and Zac Taylor spent plenty of time talking before he signed, so you have to feel he knows the club’s philosophical approach to free agency and is all in. He made that clear in his opening address that he wants to build through the draft, but there are always exceptions and I could see them making an exception this March and going out early to get a UFA to free up the draft.

(02-11-2019, 02:00 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The whole don't sign unrestricted free agents because you lose compensatory picks is IMO the worst part of our strategy.

JON: Even before the change at head coach, you had to wonder if they’d adjust their free-agent approach given what has to be done on the offensive line and at linebacker. One of the Bengals’ hard and fast principles is to stay away from unrestricted free agents so they don’t lose compensatory draft picks for the UFAs they lose. The Bengals and Zac Taylor spent plenty of time talking before he signed, so you have to feel he knows the club’s philosophical approach to free agency and is all in. He made that clear in his opening address that he wants to build through the draft, but there are always exceptions and I could see them making an exception this March and going out early to get a UFA to free up the draft.

So he basically says he can see them breaking away from that here to open the draft up...What's the issue? We were never going to be the big money spenders year in and out. The teams that have won with some FA's have done so sparingly when it's a one off to make a run. The teams that are constantly players in FA simply don't win. That isn't spin that is just looking at the numbers. 

I think realistically a Tackle and a LB like Cory Littleton are a realistic haul in FA along with some depth and resigns of our own guys (Dennard, Brown, etc.)

(02-11-2019, 02:06 PM)Au165 Wrote: So he basically says he can see them breaking away from that here to open the draft up...What's the issue? We were never going to be the big money spenders year in and out. The teams that have won with some FA's have done so sparingly when it's a one off to make a run. The teams that are constantly players in FA simply don't win. That isn't spin that is just looking at the numbers. 

I think realistically a Tackle and a LB like Cory Littleton are a realistic haul in FA along with some depth and resigns of our own guys (Dennard, Brown, etc.)

The compensatory pick strategy is my issue. It's been dumb.

We tout compensatory picks like they have a ton of value and the list has been posted and we haven't landed any talent over the years.

(02-11-2019, 02:10 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The compensatory pick strategy is my issue. It's been dumb.

We tout compensatory picks like they have a ton of value and the list has been posted and we haven't landed any talent over the years.

They have more value now that you can trade them if we do in fact use them as a currency. Also to be fair...he said we may buck that trend and sign FA's anyways. It looks more to me like he is hedging his bets on both sides to pretend like he is right either way.

(02-11-2019, 01:56 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I think those getting upset about the spin are those that expected/hoped the team would change its mindset on free agency now that Marvin's gone, but it sounds like it hasn't. I think people wanted to hear that the Bengals would start going for top-tier FAs rather than reserve their money for extensions.

Personally, I'm not surprised, as this is the same FO as when Marvin was here. Expect guys who have connections to the coach(es) in some way and/or those who are considered more B-tier players to plug in as short-term starters until draft picks come (along).

Exactly, they are going to have to make a couple big moves in FA if Taylor wants to win right off the bat. Otherwise it is going to take many years. We need 4 more starters on the O-line and at Linebacker. That isn't all going to happen in the Draft. I also agree with Pistons here on the comp pick crap. These hardly ever work out for us.

(02-11-2019, 02:10 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The compensatory pick strategy is my issue. It's been dumb.

We tout compensatory picks like they have a ton of value and the list has been posted and we haven't landed any talent over the years.

The concept itself is not necessarily dumb, but the execution sure has been.
For example, the Bengals took Marcus Hardison with their 4th round comp pick in 2015 when they could have instead taken Grady Jarrett (who went 2 picks after).
Or taking Paul Dawson in the 3rd round comp of that same year, only to see Tre Flowers and Daryl Williams go 2-3 picks later.

Seeing as we don't have anyone going to Free Agency who would garner a comp pick this is the year to go after UFAs even with our "strategy".

And yes Hobson sounds ludicrous when he starts crying poor while we are 50 million under the cap.

(02-11-2019, 12:25 PM)McC Wrote: https://www.bengals.com/news/hobson-s-choice-bengaldom-takes-in-massive-change

It may be a new dey but Goebbels still going with the same nonsense.  That guy makes me sick.

I don't believe he's saying anything inaccurate or even spun. The avoidance of free agents to get comp picks is a Mike Brown strategy, Hobson is just acknowledging that it exists which it does. If he were spinning things in this article to make Mikey look good he wouldn't have mentioned that because that is one of Mikey's most failed policies.

He does mention that the players from the last two drafts need to step up. Some of those players have, some have not. Bates, Mixon and Hubbard have been the most accomplished players from the last two drafts. But if Ross, Price and Jefferson actually played to their draft position this team would show much better on Sundays.

The new coaching staff is going to have to decide on these guys. Hopefully they won't keep guys on the 53 man roster just because of their draft position like the team did with Ogbuehi, Fisher, Hunt, etc. There's no need to carry deadwood when you can fill that roster spot with someone who actually contributes in games.

 

(02-11-2019, 01:56 PM)ochocincos Wrote:
I think those getting upset about the spin are those that expected/hoped the team would change its mindset on free agency now that Marvin's gone, but it sounds like it hasn't. I think people wanted to hear that the Bengals would start going for top-tier FAs rather than reserve their money for extensions.

Personally, I'm not surprised, as this is the same FO as when Marvin was here. Expect guys who have connections to the coach(es) in some way and/or those who are considered more B-tier players to plug in as short-term starters until draft picks come (along).

I am confused. How is he spinning anything when he is reporting the net result. The team does/has had a free agency plan for over a decade that relies of the draft and compensatory picks from the drafts and sprinkle in FA. 

It would be spin if he stated the opposite based on the recent history.

(02-11-2019, 02:10 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: the list has been posted and we haven't landed any talent over the years.

Ryan Glasgow, Marvin Jones and George Iloka were all compensatory picks.

(02-11-2019, 03:04 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I am confused. How is he spinning anything when he is reporting the net result. The team does/has had a free agency plan for over a decade that relies of the draft and compensatory picks from the drafts and sprinkle in FA. 

It would be spin if he stated the opposite based on the recent history.

...and Hobs seemed to leave plenty of hope that the Bengals may deviate a bit from that norm this year. Ala what the Bengals did in 2003 in Marv's first free agency. 

Ultimately, we have a lot of money to spend, a new HC and a dire needs at o-line and LB. I expect a bit more action in March than the norm. 

(02-11-2019, 03:04 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I am confused. How is he spinning anything when he is reporting the net result. The team does/has had a free agency plan for over a decade that relies of the draft and compensatory picks from the drafts and sprinkle in FA. 

It would be spin if he stated the opposite based on the recent history.

Spin isn't the right word. It's more of frustration that the approach isn't going to change (according to what Hobson said).