(03-14-2019, 09:40 AM)Wyche Wrote: You might wanna watch some tape on the guy prior to last season.  He played hurt basically after the second series of the season.

You don't lead the league with 144 tackles being a bum.  He hasn't given up a TD since his rookie season in coverage.

Brown was/is good at keeping the action in front of him. I wasn't nearly as irritated with this signing as Bobby Hart.
However, I was really hoping that a whole new coaching staff would have been able to come in with fresh eyes and treat outside FAs the same as internal and therefore gone for who they wanted. 
While it may ultimately have ended up the same performance-wise, I would have preferred Hicks and Daryl Williams over Hart and Brown.
This just feels like the old "We know our guys" mentality even though the new coaches don't actually know these guys.
They basically have the same team as last year minus Eifert, Kroft, and Dennard (so far) but with new coaches, which shouldn't really rain down optimism.

At this point, I get the sense the Bengals are going to approach this like every other year...keep their mediocre/bad starters for the sake of having a person there and then draft potential replacements (to groom). If that's their approach, I really HOPE they try to trade up to get more picks into Day 1/2 because this team needs it.

(03-14-2019, 09:50 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Brown was/is good at keeping the action in front of him. I wasn't nearly as irritated with this signing as Bobby Hart.
However, I was really hoping that a whole new coaching staff would have been able to come in with fresh eyes and treat outside FAs the same as internal and therefore gone for who they wanted. 
While it may ultimately have ended up the same performance-wise, I would have preferred Hicks and Daryl Williams over Hart and Brown.
This just feels like the old "We know our guys" mentality even though the new coaches don't actually know these guys.
They basically have the same team as last year minus Eifert, Kroft, and Dennard (so far) but with new coaches, which shouldn't really rain down optimism.

At this point, I get the sense the Bengals are going to approach this like every other year...keep their mediocre/bad starters for the sake of having a person there and then draft potential replacements (to groom). If that's their approach, I really HOPE they try to trade up to get more picks into Day 1/2 because this team needs it.

I agree with all of this, but I think Brown is a lot better than people give him credit for.  You still need a good MLB in this league, and he's that.  Every year we bitched and moaned (and rightfully so) about going out and getting over the hill names at LB.  This guy is young, and can play.  I think he's worth another shot, plus he plans to lose 10-15 pounds to get faster in coverage.  The kid has a good head on his shoulders, good leader, plays hard, plays smart, and has been durable up until last year.  (Just our damn luck, amirite?)  I think folks that have a problem with this signing only saw last year and based their judgments off of that (not you, obviously).  I remember him at Louisville.  He's a good player.

I would think they look to get a day 1 starter at backer in the draft.....if they're smart.  Healthy Brown/New Guy/Vigil should be an improvement over last season.  They really need to send Burfict packing, and use that money to either sign another backer or another T.

(03-14-2019, 08:23 AM)Sled21 Wrote: And we can grab White or Bush in the 1st if we have to..... why's that, you say? Because we now have a right tackle on the roster and can afford to wait till round 2 or 3 to take another one....

Don't know if you are being sarcastic or not, but I agree.  Hart was solid in run blocking and deficient in pass blocking.  I am certain they will spend a 3rd or 4th rounder on a RT to compete with Hart.  They might also still get another FA OT.

I really like Bush....if we slide a bit to get another pick, or stay put and take Oliver or one of the other stud DTs and get a guy like David Long (who I think is way underrated) and improve both levels of the defense.  

(03-14-2019, 10:07 AM)Wyche Wrote: I agree with all of this, but I think Brown is a lot better than people give him credit for.  You still need a good MLB in this league, and he's that.  Every year we bitched and moaned (and rightfully so) about going out and getting over the hill names at LB.  This guy is young, and can play.  I think he's worth another shot, plus he plans to lose 10-15 pounds to get faster in coverage.  The kid has a good head on his shoulders, good leader, plays hard, plays smart, and has been durable up until last year.  (Just our damn luck, amirite?)  I think folks that have a problem with this signing only saw last year and based their judgments off of that (not you, obviously).  I remember him at Louisville.  He's a good player.

I would think they look to get a day 1 starter at backer in the draft.....if they're smart.  Healthy Brown/New Guy/Vigil should be an improvement over last season.  They really need to send Burfict packing, and use that money to either sign another backer or another T.

I liked Brown, still do. But he could be better in coverage. Might as well try to get a released guy like Zach Brown and/or draft a LB high just in case Preston becomes a 1-2 down LB.

(03-14-2019, 10:42 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I liked Brown, still do. But he could be better in coverage. Might as well try to get a released guy like Zach Brown and/or draft a LB high just in case Preston becomes a 1-2 down LB.

Once again, we're in total agreement.  My thoughts are, if I was assembling the roster, keep Brown, release Tez, and do exactly what you outline here.  Step one is done, what they will do from here on remains to be seen.

(03-13-2019, 11:09 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: That's kinda what I was driving at. It doesn't feel like Taylor is getting to put his own stamp on the team. 


Duke has been the defacto GM for years. Coaches still have varying schemes and ideas though, and the GM should work with him to get some players in here that fit his vision for the team. That's how most teams work. You don't just hire a new coach and say "we like you, but you'll work with the players we throw at you". 

Taylor seems more of a puppet for Duke than an actual coach. 

(03-14-2019, 09:20 AM)Hoofhearted Wrote: I think since ZT M.O. is offense, first pick will be on that side of the ball. At least that's my hunch. If they're really high on a LB, they'll probably pull the trigger, but all things equal they probably take an offensive guy in the first round. 

While ZT is an offense guy, he's HC now and has to be aware of the glaring needs at LB. Draft analysis say OT's are good to go into the 3rd round, while there are some purely spectacular guys on the defensive side of the ball that will be available in the 1st. If he's a BPA guy, he will probably go defense in the 1st.

(03-14-2019, 10:36 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Don't know if you are being sarcastic or not, but I agree.  Hart was solid in run blocking and deficient in pass blocking.  I am certain they will spend a 3rd or 4th rounder on a RT to compete with Hart.  They might also still get another FA OT.

I really like Bush....if we slide a bit to get another pick, or stay put and take Oliver or one of the other stud DTs and get a guy like David Long (who I think is way underrated) and improve both levels of the defense.  

No, I'm 100% serious. Signing Hart opened options for the draft. There are better defensive players to be had in the first, ie backers and linemen, that we could grab, then still get a quality OT in the second or 3rd.

(03-14-2019, 01:07 PM)Sled21 Wrote: While ZT is an offense guy, he's HC now and has to be aware of the glaring needs at LB. Draft analysis say OT's are good to go into the 3rd round, while there are some purely spectacular guys on the defensive side of the ball that will be available in the 1st. If he's a BPA guy, he will probably go defense in the 1st.

This organization hasn't drafted an OL starter that has played well since drafting Zeitler in 2012. The real only times they have succeeded with OL selection has been within the first 50 picks, so I would have zero faith they could select a good starter-quality OL beyond their 2nd round pick.

(03-14-2019, 02:10 PM)ochocincos Wrote: This organization hasn't drafted an OL starter that has played well since drafting Zeitler in 2012. The real only times they have succeeded with OL selection has been within the first 50 picks, so I would have zero faith they could select a good starter-quality OL beyond their 2nd round pick.

Bodine... and Westerman started a few games. 

(03-14-2019, 02:22 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: Bodine... and Westerman started a few games. 

Notice I said OL STARTER who has played well. Westerman has played well in brief appearances but for whatever reason hasn't been slotted as a more long-term starter. Bodine was bad.

(03-14-2019, 02:29 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Notice I said OL STARTER who has played well. Westerman has played well in brief appearances but for whatever reason hasn't been slotted as a more long-term starter. Bodine was bad.

Yea, why I emphasized started a few games. They also missed on OG, so even drafting in the top 50 they miss on occasionally. Depending on your thoughts on Billy, there's him to.

(03-14-2019, 02:10 PM)ochocincos Wrote: The real only times they have succeeded with OL selection has been within the first 50 picks,

Boling #101 in 4th round.

Whitworth #55 in 2nd round

(03-14-2019, 03:07 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Boling #101 in 4th round.

Whitworth #55 in 2nd round

I thought Whitworth was higher, but he's practically 50. You got me on a technicality there.
I forgot about Boling.

Overall point still stands that they haven't drafted a good starter since Zeitler.

(03-14-2019, 02:40 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: Yea, why I emphasized started a few games. They also missed on OG, so even drafting in the top 50 they miss on occasionally. Depending on your thoughts on Billy, there's him to.

Billy isn't good yet.

(03-14-2019, 03:44 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I thought Whitworth was higher, but he's practically 50. You got me on a technicality there.
I forgot about Boling.

Overall point still stands that they haven't drafted a good starter since Zeitler.

You also said since 2012. Boling was 2011

(03-14-2019, 02:10 PM)ochocincos Wrote: This organization hasn't drafted an OL starter that has played well since drafting Zeitler in 2012. The real only times they have succeeded with OL selection has been within the first 50 picks, so I would have zero faith they could select a good starter-quality OL beyond their 2nd round pick.

So, outside of Ogbuehi and Fisher, how many linemen did they draft early that have not become reliable starters?  Don't include Price in this list.  He will be a much improved player this year.  

I guess I am trying to say that they haven't busted on a large number of offensive linemen in the past overall, just the two recent OTs.  And, yes, they were HUGE misses.  Think about it:  If Ced played like a first round OT, we aren't complaining about losing Whit but praising the front office for their planning and insight.  Ditto Fish replacing the RT stop-gaps.  But both were huge misses and it really set this team back.  

Preston Brown's contract details are up on Over the cap.

https://overthecap.com/player/preston-brown/3012/

3 years at 16.38 mil 5.48 mil average 4.72 mil cap hit in 2019 and can cut for 1.66 mil in 2020 (833k if designated after June 1st cut).

I'd also like to point out that Over the Cap and Sportsrac have slightly different numbers for Bobby Hart one has the cap hit at 5.4 mil and the other at 4.4 mil.

(03-12-2019, 07:57 PM)jj22 Wrote: Well they "attacked" their weak spots in free agency. I'm sure Hobs would tell ya.

Well, to be fair they won the super bowl last year, but Hobson just didn't want to tell anyone.. 
Ya think he's insufferable now? Imagine if we actually did win a super bowl.. 

(03-16-2019, 12:23 AM)Synric Wrote: Preston Brown's contract details are up on Over the cap.

https://overthecap.com/player/preston-brown/3012/

3 years at 16.38 mil 5.48 mil average 4.72 mil cap hit in 2019 and can cut for 1.66 mil in 2020 (833k if designated after June 1st cut).

I'd also like to point out that Over the Cap and Sportsrac have slightly different numbers for Bobby Hart one has the cap hit at 5.4 mil and the other at 4.4 mil.

That does not sound like a bad eal for a starting MLB, even if he comes off the field on passing downs.  And if he gets down to 240 and can cover TE's, even better.