(04-14-2019, 11:22 PM)Joelist Wrote: So name the better options you believed they should have signed. 

Me I agree they should have targeted LB in Free Agency and dropped the big dollars for Mosley. On offensive line the pickings were sparse. Miller was actually in the Top 10 offensive line Free Agents rankings - which tells you how lean the cupboard was. 

They've already been mentioned.  Williams, Kalil, James.  James' deal was high as hell, but considering the kind of player Hart is, so was his.  They paid a hell of a lot for a really bad player.  

Point I'm making is, Bobby Hart's last year as a starter should have been 2018.  He was a weakness and will continue to be for the next year or so.  You could have signed a guy like LJ Fort or Jordan Hicks for what they dropped on him (or comparable amounts), alleviated a hole at LB and drafted a tackle.  Instead, we spent a hunk of cap on Brown and Hart, basically keeping things the same as last year.  That's not good enough.  

I'd have offered Hart 3 mil for a 1 year deal to be the backup swing guy.  He could kick rocks if that's not enough.  They should've been looking for an Eric Winston type to fill out the roster, not a starter on day 1 of FA if the pickings were so bad.  They have the 11th pick for Christ's sake.  You can get a RT that will lock the spot down for at least the next half-decade at a controllable cap number.  Instead they got the same garbage they had last year for a lot more money.  Stupid.

Which does nothing about the reality that this was a poor Free Agent class at OL, and we saw very middling players pull huge paychecks.

(04-14-2019, 04:43 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Agreed. I loved the Taylor signing, but everything since has kinda taken away from that excitement. The Bengals really had a big opportunity to change the culture and some perceptions, but it doesn't seem like they're willing to change their methods. 

I'm still looking forward to seeing what Taylor brings (and the new staff - despite their unimpressive resumes). I like that the staff is following successful trends, like having an offensive minded HC calling plays while the "offensive coordinator" acts in a different manner.

Just wish this FO was more willing to change themselves to help Taylor and co be in a better position to be successful immediately. Instead, this FA was worse than standard fare...even by Bengals standards.

At this point, we just have to hope that a regime change has a major impact (which is possible if Taylor winds up a diamond) and we hit on some major needs in the draft.

All coaches need players. Marvin couldn't even win regular season 1pm games without it. Sean McVay saw a weakness in the Rams o-line and the Rams addressed it with Whitworth. We addressed it with Hart and Miller. Obviously there's quite a difference there.

I'm holding out hope that they can have a nice draft and alleviate some concerns.  They need to from a talent standpoint.  They have 2 position groups in o-line and linebacker that are going to hurt them badly.  

This offseason since the Taylor hire has been an unmitigated disaster IMO.  They looked at 6 or 7 dudes before they signed some guy that I guarantee 80 percent of this board has never heard of before the move in Louie Slapnuts.   Jim Turner is a proven trash heap of a man that has no real record of being a great line coach, either.  The other staff guys were just dudes.  These guys are the expendables of NFL assistants. Nobody in the league wanted them but they're old drinkin' buddy Zac.  Not real exciting.  

Then you had FA, which was basically bringing back the same guys from last year with a Buffalo reject thrown in.  How inspired.

(04-15-2019, 12:12 AM)Joelist Wrote: Which does nothing about the reality that this was a poor Free Agent class at OL, and we saw very middling players pull huge paychecks.

Then don't sign them to be starters and use your high first round pick to draft one.  We did worse than sign a middling player to a huge paycheck.  We signed a bottom feeder to one, relatively speaking.  

(04-15-2019, 12:17 AM)samhain Wrote: I'm holding out hope that they can have a nice draft and alleviate some concerns.  They need to from a talent standpoint.  They have 2 position groups in o-line and linebacker that are going to hurt them badly.  

This offseason since the Taylor hire has been an unmitigated disaster IMO.  They looked at 6 or 7 dudes before they signed some guy that I guarantee 80 percent of this board has never heard of before the move in Louie Slapnuts.   Jim Turner is a proven trash heap of a man that has no real record of being a great line coach, either.  The other staff guys were just dudes.  These guys are the expendables of NFL assistants. Nobody in the league wanted them but they're old drinkin' buddy Zac.  Not real exciting.  

Then you had FA, which was basically bringing back the same guys from last year with a Buffalo reject thrown in.  How inspired.

Bingo. I was excited about Taylor everything since has been shit.

(04-14-2019, 06:18 PM)Whatever Wrote: Take it with a grain of salt, but Carpenter had a PFF grade of 56 and Fluker was 49.  Neither represents an upgrade.  In fact, Fluker is a big downgrade.

Williams is coming off a major knee injury and probably made the best decision he could have staying with the Panthers.  He doesn't have to adjust to a new scheme and teammates while recovering.

I liked James as a FA, but he got twice what he was projected to get.  While an average RT is a big upgrade, he is still getting elite money for being simply average.

Saffold is a good LG, but he's up there in age and maybe doesn't translate to RG.

Fair points with most of this, but I still say it's discouraging to see this team sit on its hands when the o-line has been an issue 3 years running. If they didn't like the linemen in free agency, why not target a LB and free up the draft to shore up the line?

Imo, the lackadaisical free agency is indefensible. You're coming off of 3 straight losing seasons and working in a regime. Show them you're serious about winning and give them some talent to work with.

(04-15-2019, 12:17 AM)samhain Wrote: I'm holding out hope that they can have a nice draft and alleviate some concerns.  They need to from a talent standpoint.  They have 2 position groups in o-line and linebacker that are going to hurt them badly.  

This offseason since the Taylor hire has been an unmitigated disaster IMO.  They looked at 6 or 7 dudes before they signed some guy that I guarantee 80 percent of this board has never heard of before the move in Louie Slapnuts.   Jim Turner is a proven trash heap of a man that has no real record of being a great line coach, either.  The other staff guys were just dudes.  These guys are the expendables of NFL assistants. Nobody in the league wanted them but they're old drinkin' buddy Zac.  Not real exciting.  

Then you had FA, which was basically bringing back the same guys from last year with a Buffalo reject thrown in.  How inspired.

We need to knock the draft out of the park and/or hope Taylor is the next McVay.

I agree about the coaching hires. It wasn't just that they were/are green. That's acceptable if their resumes suggest they were due for promotion. Callahan was okay. He interviewed for OC with the Titans last year, so that shows he's been on the radar at least.

Anarumo though? Nothing impressive about the resume and it smelled like settling after a pretty embarrassing DC search. Not a big fan of the Turner hire, and most of the other hires were pretty meh. I did like bringing Duffner back. Sadly though, he'll be the most experienced voice of the defense.

(04-14-2019, 06:33 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I'm not sure if you mean this as a knock against them, seeing as the Rams scored 3 points in the SB.

At least the Rams made it to Super Bowl.  Bengals haven't won a play-off game since 1990 season.  Nuff Said. 

(04-14-2019, 11:30 PM)TKUHL Wrote: It's a "New-Dey" can I patent this?

After no play-off wins since 1990 season, I like it.   You are on it.  Garbage can Who Dey.  Bring on New Dey. 

(04-14-2019, 03:43 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: Yep.  I was wishing for a starter through free agency at least but we settled for crap again.  Only thing I can think of we are really tanking the next two years waiting on QB Lawrence

If that is the plan, I am actually okay with it. Two bad years to get that level of QB play would be worth it.

I'm disappointed but we just have to see how it all plays out.

I have no idea whey they didn't try to add very good defensive help. We didn't lose anyone this year that would be worth saving that 6th round Comp pick for. So Load up some in FA. Mosley, Barr, even Shelton. Setup the draft so that all we need is OL and a TE and if a great Defensive player falls so be it, take him. But keep drafting OL til we get that fixed.

I wouldn't have really bothered with signing any OL. Almost all of my mocks have been heavy and triple dipping on the OL, the point is, draft them til you hit. nothing wrong with depth, we need that too, and if you hit on more than one at the same position, great!! Trade one for a bonus pick next year.

(04-14-2019, 12:13 PM)Bengalitis Wrote: So what's the new motto? We are running out of ways to use "dey". Dump Dey?

New Dey. 

(04-14-2019, 11:31 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Too bad the "new" approach to free agency was even worse than the old.

Hope all the other "new" stuff is better.

I agree 100%.

There's not a single "new" thing about this front office.

 

I have to wonder if part of the somewhat disorganized Free Agency had to do with it taking so long to get the defensive coaches on board. Without them and as such not really knowing what the system will be it makes it harder to target players properly and it disincents players from coming in when they have no idea if the system will fit them.

(04-15-2019, 07:10 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: If that is the plan, I am actually okay with it. Two bad years to get that level of QB play would be worth it.

That's the way fans have been Bungalized.  Wishing for two awful seasons for a draft day in 2021.  Only fans who became Bungles live for draft day over game day this much.  I'll go on record as saying I do NOT want 2 awful seasons to get some dude in the draft 2 years from now.  My guess is he is not the Superman or he would be in draft sooner.  I guarantee you the coaches and players are not thinking of trying to lose for 2 years to draft this gherkin.  For all you people know, Lawrence may stink in the NFL.

Back to the actual thread topic, we still need to see this new O Line system. If it really finally ditches the zone blocking concepts in favor of power blocking and directional drive blocking then good! I expect preseason game one will be revealing.

(04-14-2019, 07:11 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I usually say that a free agent will go wherever he gets the most money, but maybe the free gent O-linemen just did not want to play here.   Maybe they don't want to deal with Turner's BS, or maybe they just don't have any respect or confidence in the whole new regime.

But even if Hart was the best we could get we should not have paid him $7 million for next year.

The bigger concern to me is likely we are not considering the best OT available for 1st round pick. If we go LB, I am OK if White is gone we grab Bush, but drafting a 2nd or later round OT more than likely means they are not starting year one, a 1st round guy could beat Hart out in my opinion.

(04-15-2019, 03:54 PM)Joelist Wrote: Back to the actual thread topic, we still need to see this new O Line system. If it really finally ditches the zone blocking concepts in favor of power blocking and directional drive blocking then good! I expect preseason game one will be revealing.

Players make schemes look good or bad. Coaches can only make mediocre players look so good. My issue is the FO has not given the coaches enough OL talent to succeed in 2019, the same issues we had with 2018. Th team tried to address the OL with Glenn signing and then 1st round pick, but in the end, the OL just was not good enough to get it done. Yet, we are standing pat it appears in 2019 starting OL.

(04-14-2019, 11:30 PM)TKUHL Wrote: It's a "New-Dey" can I patent this?

I got dibs on groundhogs Dey


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

(04-15-2019, 05:15 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Players make schemes look good or bad. Coaches can only make mediocre players look so good. My issue is the FO has not given the coaches enough OL talent to succeed in 2019, the same issues we had with 2018. Th team tried to address the OL with Glenn signing and then 1st round pick, but in the end, the OL just was not good enough to get it done. Yet, we are standing pat it appears in 2019 starting OL.

Problems with our Tackles seemed to be a theme last year and they have to go up against some great defensive end athletes on opposing teams.

The once lowly Browns will have Olivier Vernon & Miles Garrett as their defensive ends, for example.

I'm starting to like left tackle Andre Dillard who could step in at right tackle in 2019 and then move to left tackle long term in 2020 with Cordy Glenn moving to the right side in 2020.

(04-15-2019, 05:15 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Players make schemes look good or bad. Coaches can only make mediocre players look so good. My issue is the FO has not given the coaches enough OL talent to succeed in 2019, the same issues we had with 2018. Th team tried to address the OL with Glenn signing and then 1st round pick, but in the end, the OL just was not good enough to get it done. Yet, we are standing pat it appears in 2019 starting OL.

I think it’s goes both ways. If for example you run zone blocking with big, powerful but somewhat slower linemen you as the coach are setting them up to fail. If on the other hand you use a power scheme with directional driving you are giving them their best chance at success.

And yes, four of our starting linemen fit a power scheme better than a lateral zone scheme. It still puzzles me why after we let Lazor overrule Piano Man to get away from the lateral zones late in 2017 we went right back to them last year.