(04-28-2019, 03:06 PM)OSUfan Wrote: It has also been mentioned that Taylor received several text messages from other teams applauding him on the selection and confirming that he would have been gone very soon.

If that's true, then maybe he wasn't a reach at all. We really don't know. All we have to go on are mocks, which are hilariously inaccurate after the fact. Of course, if we argue this, we also can't brag about getting a "steal". Which I'm fine with.

(04-28-2019, 03:03 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: That's what I was thinking. NFL scouting departments are rarely THAT far apart in evaluations. IF the Bengals reached, it's likely that Sample was viewed as a late-2nd or 3rd round value, and the Bengals saw him as a guy that fit what they're doing and didn't want to risk him not being there in the 3rd. 

Different teams have different values for player not based on their skills, but the teams needs and scheme.  Sample could have been a 5th/6th rounder for a lot of teams, but it only takes one or two teams to value him as a late second/early third round selection for the Bengals to miss out on him.

(04-28-2019, 03:14 PM)Joelist Wrote: Yep!

What teams really say is not “this players is over/over valued at this pick” but rather “will this player still be on the board for our next picks after this one?”. If you’re up in say Round 2 and a targeted player is there and you have reason to believe they will be gone by the time you come up again you don’t mess around - you take them.

And that's the thing, if it was as easy as just drafting from Kipers board then ALL TEAMS would have great drafts.

There are scouting services that all teams subscribe to. It would be interesting to see how these compare with Kipers.

Was it good value? I honestly do not think so.

Can he be a productive player in our system? Absolutely.

I can see why they selected him but I just think there were other players on the board that offered better value. This reminds me of when a good RB is selected in the first round.

(04-28-2019, 03:15 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Different teams have different values for player not based on their skills, but the teams needs and scheme.  Sample could have been a 5th/6th rounder for a lot of teams, but it only takes one or two teams to value him as a late second/early third round selection for the Bengals to miss out on him.

That's basically what I meant. You're just elaborating a bit more. What I was saying is that I doubt teams were all that far apart in how they viewed Sample as a talent. Yes, team needs factor into draft boards. 

(04-28-2019, 02:05 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: That said, it appears we could have got him in the 3rd or 4th Round.

Zac Taylor said the rumblings after we picked Sample indicated to him that other teams wanted him and that he would not have lasted to our pick in the next round.

(04-28-2019, 02:36 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I don't think anyone's saying it was good value. They're saying they understand the pick and we're trying to form an identity.

In other words "we get it". Also, you have no idea if he would've been available that late.

This. No one is saying its a good value pick.   At the same time how many of our AMAZING value picks(sliders) have come through for us?
The staff wanted this guy so I give them the benefit of the doubt.  With him on the field you are not tipping your hand for sure.

Also some people are saying teams had him rated higher than the media and fans.  This happens every draft.  Its why guys like Mack Wilson that people were gushing over for that 2nd pick went in the 4th.    Draft is a crap shoot.  hoping this guy has a great career here.

The same folks saying Sample could be had later were also saying Mack Wilson would go much earlier.

I think it's much too early to hate the pick. We at least need to see a Sample-Size of his play in the NFL

(04-28-2019, 02:31 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: Sample could have been drafted in round 5 or 6 it was a stupid pick for a second rounder. Rest of draft was good but let’s not act like that was a good value pick.

Seriously? That’s just ridiculous banter and you know it. We love you anyway.

(04-28-2019, 02:36 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I don't think anyone's saying it was good value. They're saying they understand the pick and we're trying to form an identity.

In other words "we get it". Also, you have no idea if he would've been available that late.

I get it too. I think Sample was a piece we needed that others couldn’t fill. His interest mainly lays in his ability to block. I like what someone else said when it was like picking up another lineman who can catch. I think we’re just not used to this kind of forward thinking, strategic approach. BPA is not the greatest strategy, but not everyone will buy into it.

(04-28-2019, 05:45 PM)Junglejuice Wrote: Also some people are saying teams had him rated higher than the media and fans.  This happens every draft.  Its why guys like Mack Wilson that people were gushing over for that 2nd pick went in the 4th.    

(04-28-2019, 06:16 PM)bfine32 Wrote: The same folks saying Sample could be had later were also saying Mack Wilson would go much earlier.

Yep.  Happens every year.  Funny thing is that when a guy is taken a round or 2 earlier than the "experts" predict everyone says the team was wrong an the experts were right, but when a guy is drafted a round or two later noe one tries to argue that every team in the league was wrong and the media "experts" were correct.

Does anyone know if the LAR used zone blocking schemes? I know they used slant blocking schemes and split line blocking which the Patriots countered by just running at the QB.

(04-28-2019, 05:45 PM)Junglejuice Wrote: This. No one is saying its a good value pick.   At the same time how many of our AMAZING value picks(sliders) have come through for us?
The staff wanted this guy so I give them the benefit of the doubt.  With him on the field you are not tipping your hand for sure.

Also some people are saying teams had him rated higher than the media and fans.  This happens every draft.  Its why guys like Mack Wilson that people were gushing over for that 2nd pick went in the 4th.    Draft is a crap shoot.  hoping this guy has a great career here.

That is a good point. For years we seemed to pick up guys who were supposed to go higher that fell...and a lot fell for a reason apparently as they weren't good Pros.

Is this year three or year four of Billings "falling" to Cincy in the 4th round? I remember when projected early to mid first round QB John Walsh fell to Cincinnati in the last round and never even sniffed the field with Blake and Klingler ahead of him. One of the Draft gurus at Pro Football Weekly had him as the #2 QB taken, #10 overall.

They had a game plan and they stuck with it.

(04-28-2019, 02:05 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Yep. I think Sample was a good addition to the roster. We've see TE's from systems that are all passing and no blocking struggle entering the NFL because they can't learn to block.

Sample actually can block and he has good hands on small attempts. I think the routes and tricks to get open can be taught.

That said, it appears we could have got him in the 3rd or 4th Round.

The board just played out in a bad manner for us in the 2nd and 3rd as there were no LB's worth taking with our 2nd Round pick. As good as it played out in the 1st Round to fill an OT need, it played out the opposite in the 2nd.

According to the head coach, he wouldn't of been there in the next couple of rounds. You'd have missed the TE you wanted because some hack pundit said a 4th Rd pick.Thankfully we have a coach that knows more.

(04-28-2019, 02:31 PM)Socal Bengals fan Wrote: Sample could have been drafted in round 5 or 6 it was a stupid pick for a second rounder.  Rest of draft was good but let’s not act like that was a good value pick.

Not true

(04-28-2019, 02:01 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Last year's Rams offense was run oriented. The run game was what made the pass game so efficient. They were only 14th in the league in pass attempts but 8th in rush attempts.

And when they did throw the ball it usually was not to the TE. The Rams TEs had 57 receptions for 612 yards. The Bengals had 1200 fewer passing yards than the Rams but our TEs had more receptions (67) and yards (708).

I don't get into all the pre-draft rankings like I used too. I don't really know anything about all the TEs available, but if our offense depended on having a certain type of TE that was not on our roster I can see why we would use a second round pick to get the best one.

I pointed this out to a lesser extent a couple months back. I think the draft moves definitely indicate this offense will be similar to LA’s.


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(04-28-2019, 03:03 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: That's what I was thinking. NFL scouting departments are rarely THAT far apart in evaluations. IF the Bengals reached, it's likely that Sample was viewed as a late-2nd or 3rd round value, and the Bengals saw him as a guy that fit what they're doing and didn't want to risk him not being there in the 3rd. 

I see that as far more likely than "our scouts are buffoons and took a 6th round talent in the 2nd round".

I look at it like this. If we had waited till our 3rd, we wouldn't have gotten him and possibly miss out on Pratt. We got 2 players we wanted, I'm not sure what is the problem..

I have thought since Gresham has been gone the Bengals have missed his run blocking at the TE position. I don’t miss his penalties but I miss his run blocking. Hopefully Sample is the answer.

You pick what you want early, kinda like the squeelers jumping to get their LB. Zac did the same without having to do a trade but pulling the trigger on the player he really wanted for his plans.. (we hope).

(04-28-2019, 07:59 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yep.  Happens every year.  Funny thing is that when a guy is taken a round or 2 earlier than the "experts" predict everyone says the team was wrong an the experts were right, but when a guy is drafted a round or two later noe one tries to argue that every team in the league was wrong and the media "experts" were correct.

You only have to look at this year, Greedy dropped to the latter half of the second, and it was automatically a A+. Obviously cb needy teams passed on him because they didn’t have him rated as highly as the experts.