(07-12-2019, 01:51 PM)jason Wrote: I would e went with Peko, but you asked for guys who are no longer in the league. All I know is the Bengals have sucked against the run since he's been gone.

Oops. My bad.

I think I may have broken my own rule.

(07-12-2019, 12:37 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The source I used had Krumrie listed as our all time leading tackler.  It was counting tackles as far back as 1983.

Pro Football Reference ?

I don’t doubt their numbers but I do wonder where they came from.

(07-11-2019, 02:10 AM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Oddly enough, he was tried as an OLB/edge pass rusher initially in SF and was also a disappointment.

It wasn't until after they moved him inside in the 3-4 that he lived up to his lofty draft status.  I don't think he was underrated at all in Cincinnati.  The reality is that he would have never been worth what we paid for him the way we were using him.

Let's be honest...he also had some type of pharmaceutical help when he got to the West Coast.  Dude put on about 20 lbs of solid overnight and became unblockable.  

(07-11-2019, 03:28 AM)Goalpost Wrote: I'm going to go with an obvious, James Brooks.  From '84 to '91, he gave us 1344 carries.  That places him 4th all time in attempts, but the kicker is he went 4.8 per in his career with us.  Nobody is really close to his ypc average, as a rb, with that type of carries.

My favorite Bengal of all-time.  Would never just run out of bounds....lowered his shoulder and POPPED any DB that was running him out of bounds.  Ahead of his time.  A true dual-threat RB.  I think he and Woods BOTH averaged 5.0 YPC in 1988-89

(07-12-2019, 12:54 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Number one most underrated player in Bengal history is probably Domata Peko.   From '08 to '15 he helped anchor a Bengal defense that was 5th in yards allowed, 5th in tds allowed and 7th in rushing yards allowed, and over that period Peko was NUMBER ONE in the league in tackles by an interior lineman.

Peko...........388
Ngata.........379
K. Williams..377


Despite all of this Peko took more shit form more fans than almost any player we had.  They ripped on him endlessly and even said that the fact we were playing Peko was proof that we did not care about winning.  Then when he left the Super Bowl Champion Broncos paid him more than we were to start for one of the best defenses in the league.

Mike Zimmer is considered a god by many around here, but fans even refused to believe him when he said Peko was one of the best NTs in the league.

I'll never understand what he did to deserve so much hate.

Absolutely.  And strangely, the guy is a first class human being.  I have no idea why so many fans didn't like him.  They like Maualuga with his long hair, and he couldn't play.  

The Bengals are STILL trying to replace him.  Here's to hoping Billings, Glasgow, or Wren step up. 

Ok, I read them all and I didn't want to duplicate so this is what I came up with:

Jeff Blake: On a very poor team, he made the Bengals fun to watch. Had the most amazing deep ball I have ever seen. Accurate and so arcing that it would leave the TV screen. Blake to Pickens was unstoppable for a short period of time.

Leon Hall: Started out pretty rough, but ended up becoming a shut down CB for a few years.

Dan Ross (RIP): Everyone talks about Rodney Holman, but Ross and Anderson had such a connection. Ross could get past the chains, turn, catch the ball (great hands) and teams could do nothing to stop it. Anderson would throw the ball long before Ross would make his move and it was always right on the money and there was no defending it. That offense had so many weapons, but sometimes I was like: "keep doing that until they stop it!".

Tim Krumrie: One of the most intense Bengals ever. A NT that led his team in tackles? Seriously? And he would bust his butt in practice every snap and make the team better in preparation. Lapham used to say that if he was having a rough day in practice, and he said "Hey Tim, back off a little" that Krumrie would snap back: "I am going to kick your ass the next play and every play until practice is over"/

(07-09-2019, 05:31 PM)bambino5130 Wrote: Takeo Spikes

All pro  name. OVERrated as a player in my opinion.

Justin Smith, Peko, and Carl Pickens

(07-13-2019, 09:22 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: My favorite Bengal of all-time.  Would never just run out of bounds....lowered his shoulder and POPPED any DB that was running him out of bounds.  Ahead of his time.  A true dual-threat RB.  I think he and Woods BOTH averaged 5.0 YPC in 1988-89

He's my favorite athlete of all time. My father actually got a game-worn James Brooks jersey back in 1987. I still have it today and remind my family that if the house is on fire, I go back in for that jersey first and then for them. I'm kidding. Kinda. 

Side story about James Brooks; a girl I was friends with for years in New Jersey went to University of Cincinnati and got an internship at a radio station. She called me out of the blue one summer and asked me if I knew a bunch of players she listed to me (I did). She said she met them at a restaurant and got me their autographs. One was David Fulcher. He was cut the next day. I may have been the last person he gave an autograph to as a Bengal.

Anyway, the next summer she calls me out of the blue again and asked me if I know James Brooks. I explained to her, in great detail, how he was my all-time favorite Bengal and athlete and that I would seriously think about going gay for him. She said she works with him at some radio show and got me his autograph. I was supposed to fly out to visit her two weeks later and meet him, but I had to cancel. Small world though. 

He never got the credit he deserved IMO. I will say this; most of the Giants/Jets/Eagles fans living around me in NJ in the '80's and 90's always thought he was damn good. 

Great thread 

I don't know if you would consider Ross Browner underrated or not, but you don't hear his name much anymore when it comes to past Bengals. I know he had got bit by a spider a few years back and it caused him a number of health problems including a foot amputation, that's the last I've heard anything about him.

I always thought Carl Pickens will go down as the most underated
Bengal of recent memory.
he wasnt much of a interview off the field. he lacked the charisma of Chad.
wasnt approachable as AJ.
but on the field he could flat out play the position.
darn good route runner. could really high point the ball.
super excellant at tracking the ball over his shoulder.
for 3 years he simply was the best WR in the AFC.
that year he had what...15 16 TDs was pure dominance.

(07-13-2019, 02:34 PM)BrownAssClown Wrote: I don't know if you would consider Ross Browner underrated or not, but you don't hear his name much anymore when it comes to past Bengals. I know he had got bit by a spider a few years back and it caused him a number of health problems including a foot amputation, that's the last I've heard anything about him.

Nice mention, but I think I'm going with his bookend Eddie Edwards.  That guy was a legitimate pass rusher for a number of years.  He's probably the best pass rushing DE in team history. I know Coy Bacon had a monster year as a Bengal, but he only played 2 seasons in Cincy.

(07-13-2019, 01:04 PM)BengalFanInNJ Wrote: He's my favorite athlete of all time. My father actually got a game-worn James Brooks jersey back in 1987. I still have it today and remind my family that if the house is on fire, I go back in for that jersey first and then for them. I'm kidding. Kinda. 

Side story about James Brooks; a girl I was friends with for years in New Jersey went to University of Cincinnati and got an internship at a radio station. She called me out of the blue one summer and asked me if I knew a bunch of players she listed to me (I did). She said she met them at a restaurant and got me their autographs. One was David Fulcher. He was cut the next day. I may have been the last person he gave an autograph to as a Bengal.

Anyway, the next summer she calls me out of the blue again and asked me if I know James Brooks. I explained to her, in great detail, how he was my all-time favorite Bengal and athlete and that I would seriously think about going gay for him. She said she works with him at some radio show and got me his autograph. I was supposed to fly out to visit her two weeks later and meet him, but I had to cancel. Small world though. 

He never got the credit he deserved IMO. I will say this; most of the Giants/Jets/Eagles fans living around me in NJ in the '80's and 90's always thought he was damn good. 

That was probably a part of his excellence.  He was just a true lunch pail worker.  Went out and busted his ass every time.  Cincinnati has always loved players like that...see Hustle, Charlie.  

I never met the man, but I have a great deal of respect for what he did as a player.  

(07-13-2019, 04:05 PM)impactplaya Wrote: I always thought Carl Pickens will go down as the most underated
Bengal of recent memory.
he wasnt much of a interview off the field. he lacked the charisma of Chad.
wasnt approachable as AJ.
but on the field he could flat out play the position.
darn good route runner. could really high point the ball.
super excellant at tracking the ball over his shoulder.
for 3 years he simply was the best WR in the AFC.
that year he had what...15 16 TDs was pure dominance.

Halfway through Pickens sophomore year at Tennessee, before he was a star at WR, the moved him to defense because of a rash of injuries.  Despite only playing half the season at safety he led the team in interceptions and was the Defensive MVP of the Cotton Bowl.  And these weren't garbage time stats.  UT only lost one game and finished #5 in the country that year as Pickens scored tds by reception, interceptions return, and kick off return.

(07-13-2019, 04:05 PM)impactplaya Wrote: I always thought Carl Pickens will go down as the most underated
Bengal of recent memory.
he wasnt much of a interview off the field. he lacked the charisma of Chad.
wasnt approachable as AJ.
but on the field he could flat out play the position.
darn good route runner. could really high point the ball.
super excellant at tracking the ball over his shoulder.
for 3 years he simply was the best WR in the AFC.
that year he had what...15 16 TDs was pure dominance.

I look at Carl Pickens the same way I look at a guy like Barry Bonds. Yeah, they're great players, but they have no one but themselves to blame for not being as respected as they probably should be. Act like an ass, get treated like an ass.

(07-15-2019, 07:18 PM)NKURyan Wrote: I look at Carl Pickens the same way I look at a guy like Barry Bonds. Yeah, they're great players, but they have no one but themselves to blame for not being as respected as they probably should be. Act like an ass, get treated like an ass.

I lived in Columbus at the time so my access to the Bengals wasn't really up to snuff in the 1990s... How did Carl Pickens behave like Bonds? I know he was kinda salty with management as most Bengals are by the time they leave, but that's about it.

FWIW... Barry Bonds is the best baseball player I saw in my lifetime... Asshole or not.

(07-15-2019, 08:25 PM)jason Wrote: FWIW... Barry Bonds is the best baseball player I saw in my lifetime... Asshole or not.

ut oh, now you've done it:

(07-15-2019, 08:44 PM)bfine32 Wrote: ut oh, now you've done it:

I know... As soon as I posted that I realized I should've went with "I've seen".

(07-15-2019, 08:25 PM)jason Wrote: I lived in Columbus at the time so my access to the Bengals wasn't really up to snuff in the 1990s... How did Carl Pickens behave like Bonds? I know he was kinda salty with management as most Bengals are by the time they leave, but that's about it.

FWIW... Barry Bonds is the best baseball player I saw in my lifetime... Asshole or not.

Well it's been awhile, but IIRC besides constantly badmouthing the team and ownership (I think he was the reason the Bengals created the "loyalty clause") he would actively talk free agents out of coming here, treated local media like garbage, fired his agent immediately after signing a mega deal. Boomer Esiason views Pickens as one of the worst teammates he's ever played with, and Boomer's been around. Here's a quote from Boomer from Chip Ludwig's book: "He's everybody's cancer and he shouldn't be in your book. He created his own island. He was such a negative influence on people". Boomer also has harsh words for how Pickens treated Darnay Scott and the other WRs at the time.

He was also accused of assaulting his wife years after he was done with football which also isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of the man.

Compare Pickens to the guys that came later and challenged/beat a lot of his records - Chad Johnson and AJ Green were both incredibly personable, positive, and infinitely more like-able.

No arguing that guys like Pickens and Bonds were great players, all I'm saying is I can't exactly feel sorry for them based on how they carried themselves. I might put a few pitchers ahead of Bonds on my list of "best baseball player I saw during my lifetime", but he's clearly a Hall of Famer. I'm just not going to lose any sleep if he has to twist in the wind a bit before getting in.