(08-21-2019, 12:05 PM)Destro Wrote: Same with AJ, but we see how he does.

If your expectation that Ross would ever be as good as AJ Green, that's your own fault for having those lofty expectations.
I've never expected Ross to be as good as AJ Green.

(08-21-2019, 10:49 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I can understand this point but let's compare their first two years in the league thus far...
Ross - 16 games, 210 yards, 7 TDs
Eifert - 16 games, 482 yards, 2 TDs

Basically, where Eifert had more than double the yards, Ross had more than triple the TDs. Are 250 yards more important than 5 TDs?

And to your point on Eifert, in his now 6 seasons, he had ONE Pro Bowl season, and it was because of his 13 TDs, not his 615 yards. Eifert was the 12th TE in 2015 in terms of receiving yards but the 1st TE in terms of TDs. And this was in his third year, which Ross has not yet had.

My point is Eifert didn't blossom until his third year and has an injury-riddled career outside of two years (2013, 2015), so I think it is fair to compare Ross and Eifert.

those 16 games of eifert he was a back up not a starter at all. eifert was a backup and had been splitting snaps with gresham at tight end until 2015.  he didnt come into the league with a injry riddled career at notre dame and in 14 yes suffered the dislocated elbow.  then once finally the starter he became a top 3 tight end in the league, a pro bowler.  He showed great promise his first season splitting snaps with gresham which we havent seen any of in ross and then when eiferts handed the keys in 15 he goes off.  Ross has shown no promise and we still dont know at all what we have in out top 10 pick because his injury prone college career has now followed him in the pros.  again imo real simple to see the difference in ross and eifert.  if ross doesnt play this year or does nothing of value u really think we are gonna bring him back.... no why cuz he hasnt shown us anything when healthy to make him worthy of coming back.  however eifert has.  thats why hes back yet again.  we know what we can get from a healthy eifert.  with ross we know nothing.

(08-21-2019, 12:09 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If your expectation that Ross would ever be as good as AJ Green, that's your own fault for having those lofty expectations.
I've never expected Ross to be as good as AJ Green.

why not both top 10 picks at he same position?  Or is this just to the point alot of people make about it being a horrible selection at 9?  i never expected him to be even near the talent of aj green as well why cuz he was nowhere near the talent of aj green lol hes a mid second round wide receiver who made our staff go gaga over his damn 40 time lol damn bengals smh

(08-21-2019, 12:09 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If your expectation that Ross would ever be as good as AJ Green, that's your own fault for having those lofty expectations.
I've never expected Ross to be as good as AJ Green.

Nope, I don't even see him being better than Boyd. AJ is hurt, with new offense, should do fine, like he always seems to do. Eifert is IR veteran, yet we change OCs many times and they do fine. Just wonder why the excuses for on 1st rounder don't apply to another ( or a second rounder, for that matter ). If he is not on the field, I expect him to be a playbook master. You have nothing else to do but read. How many "systems" has AD been under since he started? 

"New offense" is not a poor excuse for any good player. Every draft pick, FA and traded player is effectively learning a new system. Pros can succeed regardless. 

(08-21-2019, 12:24 PM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: why not both top 10 picks at he same position?  Or is this just to the point alot of people make about it being a horrible selection at 9?  i never expected him to be even near the talent of aj green as well why cuz he was nowhere near the talent of aj green lol hes a mid second round wide receiver who made our staff go gaga over his damn 40 time lol damn bengals smh

I think there's a different expectation between a Top 5 selection and the 9th pick, plus I do think Ross was somewhat of a reach. I think he was more accurately projected in the 15-25 range, which meant he wasn't a perfect prospect in all areas like AJ was.

(08-21-2019, 12:19 PM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: those 16 games of eifert he was a back up not a starter at all. eifert was a backup and had been splitting snaps with gresham at tight end until 2015.  he didnt come into the league with a injry riddled career at notre dame and in 14 yes suffered the dislocated elbow.  then once finally the starter he became a top 3 tight end in the league, a pro bowler.  He showed great promise his first season splitting snaps with gresham which we havent seen any of in ross and then when eiferts handed the keys in 15 he goes off.  Ross has shown no promise and we still dont know at all what we have in out top 10 pick because his injury prone college career has now followed him in the pros.  again imo real simple to see the difference in ross and eifert.  if ross doesnt play this year or does nothing of value u really think we are gonna bring him back.... no why cuz he hasnt shown us anything when healthy to make him worthy of coming back.  however eifert has.  thats why hes back yet again.  we know what we can get from a healthy eifert.  with ross we know nothing.

You just contradicted your previous statement then. To call someone "trash" as you have should mean you've seen plenty of their on-field performance. If you say you don't know, is it really fair to call someone trash?

I'd be far more accepting of the criticism if you (or anyone) calls him an unknown.

(08-21-2019, 12:30 PM)Destro Wrote: Nope, I don't even see him being better than Boyd. AJ is hurt, with new offense, should do fine, like he always seems to do. Eifert is IR veteran, yet we change OCs many times and they do fine. Just wonder why the excuses for on 1st rounder don't apply to another ( or a second rounder, for that matter ). If he is not on the field, I expect him to be a playbook master. You have nothing else to do but read. How many "systems" has AD been under since he started? 

"New offense" is not a poor excuse for any good player. Every draft pick, FA and traded player is effectively learning a new system. Pros can succeed regardless. 

At this time, you are correct. He's not. But his skill set is far more elite than Boyd's, so he has the potential to surpass him if he can:
- Stay healthy
- Learn the new offense well
- Be utilized in that offense in a way that best caters to his skill set

I realized that's a lot of "ifs" but he's not a complete type of player like AJ Green, Julio Jones, or OBJ.

And to your comment about reading the playbook, you can read as much as you want but reading the plays and executing the plays are two different things. It's like programming. You can read how to code as much as you want but until you actually get hands-on and do it, you're never going to really learn.

(08-21-2019, 12:56 PM)ochocincos Wrote: You just contradicted your previous statement then. To call someone "trash" as you have should mean you've seen plenty of their on-field performance. If you say you don't know, is it really fair to call someone trash?

I'd be far more accepting of the criticism if you (or anyone) calls him an unknown.

lol my goodness.  his performance up to this point is trash and whether or not he has the ability to blossom into what we should expect from a top 10 pick is unknown.

(08-21-2019, 12:53 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I think there's a different expectation between a Top 5 selection and the 9th pick, plus I do think Ross was somewhat of a reach. I think he was more accurately projected in the 15-25 range, which meant he wasn't a perfect prospect in all areas like AJ was.

bro i think more so is a teams need as opposed to the difference in talent from a top 10 pick and a top 5 pick.   we should expect pro bowls from our top 10 picks.  if not maybe thats why the bengals are the way they are STILL.

(08-21-2019, 01:32 PM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: bro i think more so is a teams need as opposed to the difference in talent from a top 10 pick and a top 5 pick.   we should expect pro bowls from our top 10 picks.  if not maybe thats why the bengals are the way they are STILL.

We expect Pro Bowls within the first two years for Top 10 picks? I don't have those expectations.

He is faster than Boyd, maybe. Bad hammy, you know. It's playing football. Speed is nice, but catching the ball running route and surviving hits is also a big part of it. Ross is a lot of if he can x, y and z.

(08-21-2019, 01:28 PM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: lol my goodness.  his performance up to this point is trash and whether or not he has the ability to blossom into what we should expect from a top 10 pick is unknown.

Thank you for the clarification. You did not specify this earlier.

(08-21-2019, 01:37 PM)ochocincos Wrote: We expect Pro Bowls within the first two years for Top 10 picks? I don't have those expectations.

The last Pro Bowl Player we drafted was in 2013. That equals a lot of losing.

(08-21-2019, 10:47 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The last Pro Bowl Player we drafted was in 2013. That equals a lot of losing.

Because Mixon wasn't robbed last year.  I mean, seriously, Whit only made 3 Pro Bowls while he was here and he's a HoF type LT.  There are several guys on the roster that could've been Pro Bowlers if they played for a more popular team.

(08-21-2019, 01:37 PM)Destro Wrote: He is faster than Boyd, maybe. Bad hammy, you know. It's playing football. Speed is nice, but catching the ball running route and surviving hits is also a big part of it. Ross is a lot of if he can x, y and z.

Thank you, the hits.  The fastest Bengal ever was in 1969 and the very new expansion team Bengals felt they had nothing to lose by trying something. They signed the 1968 Olympic Medal winner in track.  1 of the 2 that held a black gloved fist up in protest as US National Anthem played in their honor as they received their medals.  In a Bengals uniform. the Olympic track star was not just fast, he was super fast. He even made a few catches. However after every catch they had to carry him off on a stretcher.  He could not take the Pro Football hits and to this point neither has track star Ross.  ....I repeat, Ross is the fastest guy to the rehab room and the rehab whirlpool tub. 

All that said, I would hope out of all these draft pick injured Bengey's, that some start showing they are not made of glass.   Besides Ross we have John Williams, Price, Jackson-WJ3, Ogbuhei who came in injured and is now gone, Eifert,  Dennard and Kirkpatrick who were injured early and often when drafted.   Lower round picks of McCarron often injured early or often & now gone. Add injured Gio Bernard.   We need some of these Bengey's to show they are not made out of glass.  I know they keep putting in more rules on hits, but it isn't touch football just yet.  

Ross may be a track star. He has yet to prove he is a Pro Football player. That remains to be seen.  

I hope some of these injured Bengey's show they can man up and play Pro Football, because if all these draft picks are just too made out of glass, the Bengals will be stuck in last place from such awful draft picks.  As a Bengal Fan, I want this team to win.  Some of these cats need to get healthy and live up to their draft picks.  I know some are already out for 2019, but hopefully a few can suit up and deliver. 

I will say that I don't think much of Bengals having few scouts, and the way the Brown Family front office including Tobin work the draft. The proof is in the pudding and their picks look like they are made out of pudding. Almost never does a top pick play his first year, many players picked #1 knowing they are injured and will miss rookie year and THAT falls on Mikey Boy Brown and Family.

A lot of Ross hype is over a race that never happened. Reds Billy Hamilton against Bengals Ross. They were always both too injured. Hamilton gone because he couldn't hit, Ross here but injured still because he can't take a hit.