(09-19-2019, 07:19 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Agreed both Average player's who need superstars around them to make them better.  Certainly not the worst but can be replaced.

Opponents have run it up the Bengals' ass since Peko's been gone...

(09-19-2019, 07:19 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Agreed both Average player's who need superstars around them to make them better.  Certainly not the worst but can be replaced.

Peko was not just "average"  he was one of the better NTs in the league.  He was consistently near the top of the league in tacklesby a D-lineman.

Even after Mike Zimmer was gone to the Vikings he said Peko was one of the best.  Funny how so many people claim the love Zimmer but think they know more about D-linemen than he does.

And the haters still won't admit they were wrong about him.

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2019/9/19/20871475/film-room-how-the-bengals-run-defense-faltered-vs-49ers

(09-19-2019, 08:30 PM)jason Wrote: Opponents have run it up the Bengals' ass since Peko's been gone...

(09-19-2019, 08:34 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Peko was not just "average"  he was one of the better NTs in the league.  He was consistently near the top of the league in tacklesby a D-lineman.

Even after Mike Zimmer was gone to the Vikings he said Peko was one of the best.  Funny how so many people claim the love Zimmer but think they know more about D-linemen than he does.

And the haters still won't admit they were wrong about him.

Explain 2007?  Anyways I don't think it is earth shattering too call someone Average". Was he bad no but he wasn't great either.

They have four linebackers. If he is the second worse backer on the lteam he still starts.

Rewatching the game was brutal. Both linebackers stunk up the joint. Maybe we should play 3 backers more often. Just saying.

I agree Vigil is bad,But if he was the only problem we had we would be in excellent shape.

(09-19-2019, 10:16 PM)ezekiel23 Wrote: I agree Vigil is bad,But if he was the only problem we had we would be in excellent shape.

That's the distressing part. A bunch of players made a bunch of mistakes.

I must admit that I stated Vigil would impress this year, but 2 games in he's doing all he can do to prove me wrong.

Teams if they are smart will line up a FB and run lead plays
Right at Vigil. Easy 5 to 7 yards.
Then run counters cause Vigil will over play his gap and look stupid
Has he ever made a meaningful play ?

Vigil has always been an up and down player. In one game he'll struggle in coverage but do well against the run. Then the next game it'll be vice versa. He struggles to put a complete game together. I would be fine trying Pratt and Evans out there since the worst thing would be us just getting more of the same.

(09-19-2019, 10:16 PM)ezekiel23 Wrote: I agree Vigil is bad,But if he was the only problem we had we would be in excellent shape.

I understand what you are saying but if one position group can't do its job then it has a tendency to snowball the rest of the unit. Same goes for the offensive line.

(09-20-2019, 12:44 AM)Bengal Dude Wrote: Vigil has always been an up and down player. In one game he'll struggle in coverage but do well against the run. Then the next game it'll be vice versa. He struggles to put a complete game together. I would be fine trying Pratt and Evans out there since the worst thing would be us just getting more of the same.

I have never seen Vigil have games back to back where he just 
Flat out made plays over and over 
And not tackles 9 yds downfield either 
I'm talking around the LOS .....behind it....
Just a force 

(09-19-2019, 08:48 PM)treee Wrote: https://www.cincyjungle.com/2019/9/19/20871475/film-room-how-the-bengals-run-defense-faltered-vs-49ers

That is horrifying. I kind of already understood that the runs to the outside were capitalizing on our corners not being great run stoppers but that link goes much deeper into the problems with formation, reads, and our linebacking situation. We got massively outcoached and the article spells out exactly how it happened. I wonder if they'll try to fix it or if this really is just a rebuilding season where we are intentionally sabotaging ourselves. What a mess. 

(09-19-2019, 12:47 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: If, in the 2020 draft, the Bengals selected a Linebacker in the first 3 rounds of the draft, I wouldn't complain one bit.

They're that bad. They looked like they were stuck in slow motion on Sunday.

They can't choose a good LB in the first two rounds. They already have those picks taken up, but feel free to hope for a 3rd round LB...

Rd 1: An injured player
Rd 2: A blocking TE or troubled RB
Rd 3: A subpar LB who is probably overdrafted




They've actually drafted a LB in the 3rd round 4 out of the last 5 years.
2015: Paul Dawson
2016: Nick Vigil
2018: Malik Jefferson
2019: Germaine Pratt

It goes to show that...
1. They need to spend higher picks on the position
2. They are shit at finding LB talent

(09-19-2019, 08:34 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Peko was not just "average"  he was one of the better NTs in the league.  He was consistently near the top of the league in tacklesby a D-lineman.

Even after Mike Zimmer was gone to the Vikings he said Peko was one of the best.  Funny how so many people claim the love Zimmer but think they know more about D-linemen than he does.

And the haters still won't admit they were wrong about him.

Yeah, and maluaga got the same amount of hate yet he was probably our last best linebacker not named burfict...

(09-19-2019, 02:03 PM)I_C_DeadPeople Wrote: Why are you perplexed? They operate as they always have. They have never addressed weaknesses with any urgency. 

we will be outmuscled by Buff. PERIOD
Bengals have a weak roster and Duke Tobin needs to be shown the door for all the misfires last several yrs. For a team that doesn't sign elite FAs, you would think they would invest in a Kick Ass Scouting Dept.    

(09-20-2019, 12:44 AM)Bengal Dude Wrote: Vigil has always been an up and down player. In one game he'll struggle in coverage but do well against the run. Then the next game it'll be vice versa. He struggles to put a complete game together. I would be fine trying Pratt and Evans out there since the worst thing would be us just getting more of the same.

Evans was pretty terrible last year.

(09-20-2019, 05:02 AM)BoomerFan Wrote: That is horrifying. I kind of already understood that the runs to the outside were capitalizing on our corners not being great run stoppers but that link goes much deeper into the problems with formation, reads, and our linebacking situation. We got massively outcoached and the article spells out exactly how it happened. I wonder if they'll try to fix it or if this really is just a rebuilding season where we are intentionally sabotaging ourselves. What a mess. 

It's as if the defensive coaches aren't that good isn't it?

They'll try to fix it, but I don't know if they can. Our defense didn't seem to adjust for the 2nd half.

The temporary fix would be to simplify the defense a lot...but teams will exploit that too.

(09-19-2019, 08:48 PM)treee Wrote: https://www.cincyjungle.com/2019/9/19/20871475/film-room-how-the-bengals-run-defense-faltered-vs-49ers

This is Browns sixt year.  He has been a starter since his rookie year. It doesn't make since that he would be this slow to read and react.

This is Vigil's third year as a starter.  He looks completely lost.

Maybe the coach's aren't giving them the proper secondary reads.  Or maybe the players haven't been pproperly preparedfor how to adjust to shifts and/motion.

Remember the year we played the Patriots while Burfict was out.  The defense just seemed to stand around flat footed not knowing what to do.  That is what this defense reminds me of.

Vigil and Brown aren't great players, but I've seen them play much better than this.