(10-03-2019, 12:20 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Bieniemy… with the soon to be fired Jay Gruden as the OC...


for DC...… most inexperienced you say....  Markus Lewis.

That would be hilarious if we hired Lewis son!

I do like your Bieniemy and Gruden suggestion!

(10-03-2019, 12:23 PM)thillan Wrote: Yeah I know the OP was sarcasm,

No, it wasn't. THE PISTONS has never shied away from voicing his displeasure about the Taylor hire, so he's at least consistent. But, no, this thread was just another way of him to crap on Taylor.

(10-03-2019, 12:32 PM)PhilHos Wrote: No, it wasn't. THE PISTONS has never shied away from voicing his displeasure about the Taylor hire, so he's at least consistent. But, no, this thread was just another way of him to crap on Taylor.

Well what can ya do?  You can either just say we are cursed and we'd be fine if AJ and Jonah etc didn't get injured, or you can blame someone and no matter who you blame someone is going to get upset.

We went into this year with the hopes that Marvin and Lazor etc were the problem and that Mike Brown had yielded power.  Here we are at 0-4 getting zilch out of the draft and we have to blame some combination of Mike Brown, no talent, injuries, inexperienced coaches, etc.

If ZT isn't a bad coach then he brought in garbage assistants and/or our team is just total garbage.  There is no way to look at this situation and not slag on someone or some group for being really lousy.

(10-03-2019, 12:23 PM)thillan Wrote: Yeah I know the OP was sarcasm, and this thread has a serious conversation.. I think I’d give him another year no matter what. Bengals had one of the worst defenses last year, and didn’t bring in anything. Offensive line is a wash, with retirement and injuries.

Really, we are mad at the guy, but what can you expect. Mediocre QB, poor OL, poor defense that brought in no new talent, how can you improve?

Taylor and his staff are symptoms of the problem, but they are not capable of fixing the problems.

Really I don't know that anything is other than luck. With the Bengals model, they have to hit about 4 drafts in 5 years out of the part to win. That's rare. And luck is involved a lot.

(10-03-2019, 12:36 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Well what can ya do?  You can either just say we are cursed and we'd be fine if AJ and Jonah etc didn't get injured, or you can blame someone and no matter who you blame someone is going to get upset.

We went into this year with the hopes that Marvin and Lazor etc were the problem and that Mike Brown had yielded power.  Here we are at 0-4 getting zilch out of the draft and we have to blame some combination of Mike Brown, no talent, injuries, inexperienced coaches, etc.

If ZT isn't a bad coach then he brought in garbage assistants and/or our team is just total garbage.  There is no way to look at this situation and not slag on someone or some group for being really lousy.

There's nothing wrong with criticizing the coaches. But, remember, that we have a first time HC, a first time OC, and a first time DC. There's going to be growing pains. Combine that with one of the worst front offices in all of professional sports, and it's a wonder we haven't found a way to lose 8 times in 4 games. 

That said, to take these 4 games and say that this is how it's ALWAYS going to be, that we're NEVER going to win a game with Taylor at HC and/or that Taylor and the other coaches are incapable of improving themselves or the team is just idiotic. 

(10-03-2019, 12:46 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Taylor and his staff are symptoms of the problem, but they are not capable of fixing the problems.

Right. 4 games is MORE than enough to make that determination.

It's a good thing the GM of the Patriots in 2000 realized how stupid that thinking is. Imagine firing Bill Belichick in 2000 after going 0-4. 

(10-03-2019, 12:46 PM)PhilHos Wrote: There's nothing wrong with criticizing the coaches. But, remember, that we have a first time HC, a first time OC, and a first time DC. There's going to be growing pains. Combine that with one of the worst front offices in all of professional sports, and it's a wonder we haven't found a way to lose 8 times in 4 games. 

That said, to take these 4 games and say that this is how it's ALWAYS going to be, that we're NEVER going to win a game with Taylor at HC and/or that Taylor and the other coaches are incapable of improving themselves or the team is just idiotic. 

I think it's more of a reaction to being sold a false bill of goods.  We allowed ourselves to believe that we were a win-now team, well we are 0-4 and that's more of a 180 that people can handle, I think.

(10-03-2019, 12:49 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I think it's more of a reaction to being sold a false bill of goods.  We allowed ourselves to believe that we were a win-now team, well we are 0-4 and that's more of a 180 that people can handle, I think.

I get it. I'm not happy with the team either. But there were A LOT of people who were predicting 5 wins or less. I don't know why those people suddenly are upset at 0-4. 

(10-03-2019, 12:36 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Well what can ya do?  You can either just say we are cursed and we'd be fine if AJ and Jonah etc didn't get injured, or you can blame someone and no matter who you blame someone is going to get upset.

We went into this year with the hopes that Marvin and Lazor etc were the problem and that Mike Brown had yielded power.  Here we are at 0-4 getting zilch out of the draft and we have to blame some combination of Mike Brown, no talent, injuries, inexperienced coaches, etc.

If ZT isn't a bad coach then he brought in garbage assistants and/or our team is just total garbage.  There is no way to look at this situation and not slag on someone or some group for being really lousy.

And I think the guilty parties are a combination...but, we're definitely not a well coached team.

(10-03-2019, 12:53 PM)PhilHos Wrote: I get it. I'm not happy with the team either. But there were A LOT of people who were predicting 5 wins or less. I don't know why those people suddenly are upset at 0-4. 

the new day change was suppose to bring positive change....  not 90s flashbacks.

(10-03-2019, 12:53 PM)PhilHos Wrote: I get it. I'm not happy with the team either. But there were A LOT of people who were predicting 5 wins or less. I don't know why those people suddenly are upset at 0-4. 

It's the how the team played that's upsetting. Pittsburgh had a bottom 5 rush offense and bottom 5 pass offense and rush defense...and destroyed us.

The same misdirection works week after week against us.

The offense looks lost.

(10-03-2019, 01:04 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: It's the how the team played that's upsetting. Pittsburgh had a bottom 5 rush offense and bottom 5 pass offense and rush defense...and destroyed us.

The same misdirection works week after week against us.

The offense looks lost.

Yes. I'm aware of this. What makes you think that this will NEVER change while Taylor is HC?

You are dreaming...again. Taylor will remain the entirety of his first contract and will have time to purge the roster and find his QB.

(10-03-2019, 01:04 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: the new day change was suppose to bring positive change....  not 90s flashbacks.

Maybe the slogan should have stated "new era" instead of "new day" because the new era Bengals will take time to build.  

(10-03-2019, 01:18 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Yes. I'm aware of this. What makes you think that this will NEVER change while Taylor is HC?

I'll jump in and say I'm not sure he will NEVER learn, but at the same time I was a bit pessimistic he was going to be an instant upgrade over Marvin Lewis...the extremes are fun to discuss, I'll admit.

We were hoping our days of flopping in the 2nd half, playing bum vets over rookies, losing in prime time and losing to the Steelers were going to leave town with Marvin.  So far it seems like all those things have remained if not gotten worse.  

(10-03-2019, 01:35 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Maybe the slogan should have stated "new era" instead of "new day" because the new era Bengals will take time to build.  

We're in Year 28 of our rebuilding plan...

I can see one replacement thus far in Jim Turner. He should be gone. He vouched for Hart and although the unit appeared to improve some in pass-pro, they have regressed with rushing game. Redmond will be playing soon. They will plug him in at one of the guard positions. It will be telling if he helps improving the O-line. I think Price has regressed.

(10-03-2019, 01:41 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: I can see one replacement thus far in Jim Turner.  He should be gone.  He vouched for Hart and although the unit appeared to improve some in pass-pro, they have regressed with rushing game.  Redmond will be playing soon.  They will plug him in at one of the guard positions.  It will be telling if he helps improving the O-line.  I think Price has regressed.

Turner is ZT's buddy. I doubt ZT wants him fired.

(10-03-2019, 01:37 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: We're in Year 28 of our rebuilding plan...

I think Lewis changed the culture and took the team to 5 straight playoffs was a noticeable change that many fans took for granted.  The melt downs during the playoffs and Lewis's penchant to draft red flag plays albeit talented players hurt him.  It fed Mike Brown's half-way house paradigm for troubled athletes.  

I think it was unrealistic for many of us fans to assume Taylor et al. would come in and pick up where Lewis left off and take the team the the playoffs.  Many on this forum were excited that the Front Office replaced many of the coaching staff that were still under contract.  It was a signal that they were fed up and wanted to win.  

Taylor is trying to modernize the franchise after the LAR, Saints, and KC.  He doesn't have the athletes to achieve this regardless of the mantra, "we have the guys in this room to succeed".  

I agree with you that some position coaches like Turner and maybe the secondary coaches should be critically examined.  I am not sure Sweet Lou is the right guy on defense either.  

I also agree that the draft personnel should be expanded to match other teams and I think firing Tobin would be a good place to start.