(10-16-2019, 03:49 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: They're......adequate. Leaving two of them out there to cover sideline to sideline exacerbates the problem.

I’m still unsure about the adequacy part. The speed isn’t there, bad angles and tackling wouldn’t be as exposed with 3 but I’d say mediocre at best. Upgrades wouldn’t hurt, 3 new starters with these 2 off of the bench maybe.

I think a lot of people are overreacting. We all know that the major cause of this downturn is due to the Health issues and injuries of our offensive line. Plus AJ Green being out. If not for this we have already won at least half our games thus far.Realistically??? Get a new quarterback!!!

Realistically? We draft like we did pre 2015.

You can point to the 2015 draft as the point our window slammed shut.

(10-16-2019, 05:15 PM)MEBengalsFan Wrote: I know many want FA to come in and help the Bengals win now. But how did the Glenn, Brown, TO, etc... signing work out for the team? Most of the time FA don't live up to the hype so I'm more looking forward to the draft and the current younger players on the roster developing and improving and making enough of an impact now to help the team out next season.

I dunno.  Maybe they need to improve their practices at signing Free Agents.

Just because they don't do it well doesn't mean Free Agency doesn't work or help an NFL team.

Free agents have improved and helped other teams numerous times.

Sure.  We all want draft picks to step in and be contributors but as you can see that doesn't always happen.

You just can't write off Free Agency because of Glenn, Brown, or others.

They absolutely need it.  

I suggest we get Archbishop Schnurr to perform the Rite of Exorcism on the 50 yard line.

(10-16-2019, 12:55 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Find new starters at the following positions (in priority order):

Offense:
- LT/LG (Reserve Williams for the other)
- RT
- QB
- Future WR1
- RG (after LT, LG, and RT get resolved)
- TE

Defense:
- 2 LBs
- 1 DL
- 2 CBs (one outside, one slot)
- S

ST:
- K

That's 13 positions. You can't realistically expect anyone drafted after 4th round to become a good position player, so that's potentially 3 drafts worth if you only focus on draft. You're looking at 2022 being the earliest the team would become a true contender if the Bengals hit on every draft pick through the first 4 rounds over the next few years.

If the Bengals want to become a true contender before 2022, they need to participate in FA more than getting B-to-C-level veterans.

It's either that or actually get coaches in that can develop late-round talent well on a consistent basis.

I would throw out on offense TE, WR 1(Depends on AJ) , and RG as needs. Nice to have sure but not needs.
On defense I would throw out DL,  S, and CB in the Nice to have pile as well.

We definitely need to use Free agency this year

(10-16-2019, 02:14 PM)BengalChris Wrote: Why can't we measure Zac by what goes on on the field?

That's the only thing we can measure him by.

Realistically, this gets fixed by firing this coach and hiring another one. Rinse repeat every couple of years until the team stumbles on a coach who can win with Mike Brown at the helm. That's what happened last time, so I think it will work again.

Sadly... I have to agree.

Jettison Tobin and get a GM in here that has a resume
Of building playoff teams.
Then overhaul the scouting department.
Add about 10 scouts minimum
That's a start. Tobin has had more misses than hits
As GM here

(10-16-2019, 11:06 PM)impactplaya Wrote: Jettison Tobin and get a GM in here that has a resume
Of building playoff teams.
Then overhaul the scouting department.
Add about 10 scouts minimum
That's a start. Tobin has had more misses than hits
As GM here

What GMs are available that have built playoffs teams in recent memory?

(10-16-2019, 08:15 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: I would throw out on offense TE, WR 1(Depends on AJ) , and RG as needs. Nice to have sure but not needs.
On defense I would throw out DL,  S, and CB in the Nice to have pile as well.

We definitely need to use Free agency this year

Yes that's why I said in priority order. 
AJ will be 32 next year. Ross hasn't established himself enough to truly earn that WR1 or WR2 status post-AJ.
I expect Eifert to be gone after this season. Uzomah is ok but nothing special.
Miller is ok but an upgrade would be good.
The DL we thought was going to be good but they still don't get to the QB enough. If the Bengals have a chance at Chase Young, they have to consider it.
CBs aren't playing well right now and I don't see the unit becoming good just because of Dennard's return. Plus, Dennard could go elsewhere in FA. The team also needs to move on from Kirkpatrick. He is who he is at this point.
Safety has good players but Shawn Williams becomes a FA after next year.

This coming offseason will be very crucial. They have to nail the first 3-4 rounds of the draft and/or actually do well in FA.

(10-16-2019, 05:29 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote: I’m still unsure about the adequacy part. The speed isn’t there, bad angles and tackling wouldn’t be as exposed with 3 but I’d say mediocre at best. Upgrades wouldn’t hurt, 3 new starters with these 2 off of the bench maybe.

Yeah, I guess adequate was a poor word choice....in my mind, that would be average to slightly below. You can get by with them, but you could certainly do better.

(10-16-2019, 05:51 PM)ezekiel23 Wrote: I think a lot of people are overreacting. We all know that the major cause of this downturn is due to the Health issues and injuries of our offensive line. Plus AJ Green being out. If not for this we have already won at least half our games thus far.Realistically??? Get a new quarterback!!!

Sure, health plays a role, but TALENT  plays a larger role.

Let's shift the question to this ... Which Bengal players would be SURE-FIRE STARTERS on any Top 10 NFL team?

Offense: Green, Mixon,  Boyd (maybe), Gio (maybe)

Defense: Geno, WJIII (maybe)

That's it. 3 sure-fire starters and 3 "maybe depending on the team" starters. 6 out of 22 players ... 28%.

'Nuff said.

Hire a real GM and give him the keys.

(10-17-2019, 09:50 AM)ochocincos Wrote: What GMs are available that have built playoffs teams in recent memory?

Bill Polian off the top of my head.

(10-17-2019, 10:56 AM)Whatever Wrote: Bill Polian off the top of my head.

I said recent memory. Polian hasn't been a GM since 2011.

(10-17-2019, 11:02 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I said recent memory. Polian hasn't been a GM since 2011.

Jerry Reese?

(10-17-2019, 11:13 AM)Whatever Wrote: Jerry Reese?

I didn't know who that was lol.
I guess he could be ok.
Giants have been bad overall the past decade but he helped build some good teams in the past decade here and there and actually has a Super Bowl title.

(10-17-2019, 10:12 AM)PV Bengal Wrote: Sure, health plays a role, but TALENT  plays a larger role.

Let's shift the question to this ... Which Bengal players would be SURE-FIRE STARTERS on any Top 10 NFL team?

Offense: Green, Mixon,  Boyd (maybe), Gio (maybe)

Defense: Geno, WJIII (maybe)

That's it. 3 sure-fire starters and 3 "maybe depending on the team" starters. 6 out of 22 players ... 28%.

'Nuff said.

Gio would not be a starting RB on most teams in the league. There are backups on other teams better than him.

On defense, Dunlap would start on most teams.

QJ3 has really regressed this year.

But, yes - Your point is correct. With better coaching though maybe some of these guys would be better.

(10-17-2019, 10:03 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Yes that's why I said in priority order. 
AJ will be 32 next year. Ross hasn't established himself enough to truly earn that WR1 or WR2 status post-AJ.
I expect Eifert to be gone after this season. Uzomah is ok but nothing special.
Miller is ok but an upgrade would be good.
The DL we thought was going to be good but they still don't get to the QB enough. If the Bengals have a chance at Chase Young, they have to consider it.
CBs aren't playing well right now and I don't see the unit becoming good just because of Dennard's return. Plus, Dennard could go elsewhere in FA. The team also needs to move on from Kirkpatrick. He is who he is at this point.
Safety has good players but Shawn Williams becomes a FA after next year.

This coming offseason will be very crucial. They have to nail the first 3-4 rounds of the draft and/or actually do well in FA.

What do you think about Tate at TE?  
What would be nice is a legit speed threat as a backup at WR. Willis and Morgan have been disappointing.  I guess you get what you pay for thought.
Dline I would rather add a 3T then End and maybe a traditional 3-4 sam Backer in the draft. Like what Ahmad Brooks was for the 49ers back in the day.

(10-17-2019, 02:09 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: What do you think about Tate at TE?  
What would be nice is a legit speed threat as a backup at WR. Willis and Morgan have been disappointing.  I guess you get what you pay for thought.
Dline I would rather add a 3T then End and maybe a traditional 3-4 sam Backer in the draft. Like what Ahmad Brooks was for the 49ers back in the day.

I always thought Tate could be a converted TE. He's too small to block inline right now though. He needs to add 20 lbs.
I see Tate like I did Darren Waller. Waller came into the league as a big WR (6'6", 238 lbs) and is now up to 255 lbs. Waller is on pace to hit 1000 yards this year.