(11-02-2019, 05:30 PM)J24 Wrote: 1.) He isn't wrong but it's funny that he used two organizations that believe in draft first and free agent later(Seahawks & Steelers). It shows how far off this organization really is that even those teams manage to use the Trade market and free agency.
2.) We actually used free agency when Carson was in town we signed Odom, Owens, Adams, Jackson, Bryant, O'Neal, Williams, and Webster. That's half the reason why the front office doesn't sign people anymore because it didn't work then.
3.) I don't care what Palmer has to say he quit on us F him. Dalton has more valid reasons to ***** then he does anyways.

All of those guys we signed were second rate talent or washed up divas nobody wanted. The front office has a habit of undervaluing key talent. You want to build from the draft? Then maybe manage the contracts better to keep them when they do well. Why they held onto Justin Smith and let Steinbach go the offseason that Braham retired, L Jones and W Anderson were coming off injuries is beyond me. That ruined Carson. Yet we decided to roll with guys like Stacy Andrews and Dennis Roland.

The Bengals front office is always looking to pick up a bargain free agent. When was the last time they signed the best free agent at a position of need at the start of free agency?

(11-02-2019, 05:43 PM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: I’d pull an Eli if I were drafted by this team. I wouldn’t play for a Mike Brown team. I don’t blame Carson one bit for quitting.


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If we end up with the #1 pick in the draft my money is on whoever we pick doing exactly that. I can't see how any young player in today's social media world would be "naive" like Palmer had been back in '02. Everyone knows this front office is an absurd joke and I can't see how the best college player in the country, given a choice, would be OK having to play here. The Bengals suck and I don't see that ever changing with these clowns running the show. 

Mike has done nothing but drag his father's name through the mud. He's a complete moron and knows nothing about football. 

(11-03-2019, 01:10 AM)Stonyhands Wrote:   Why they held onto Justin Smith and let Steinbach go the offseason that Braham retired, L Jones and W Anderson were coming off injuries is beyond me.  

Anderson and Jones were both healthy when they got their extensions and Steinbach walked.  And that was before Braham retired.

Braham was a free agent after the '04 season.  We re-signed him before the '05 season.  '05 was the last year of Willie Anderson's contract but we signed him to an extension before the season.

Jones got his contract extension before the '06 season, and we also gave Bobbie Willliams a contract extension that year.  

At that point we had re-signed 4 of our 5 starting O-linemen in two years and made Levi and Willie the highest paid OT duo in the league.  There was no way we could have afforded to also make Steinbach the highest paid OG in the league.  So we drafted Whitworth as his replacement.

(11-03-2019, 01:06 AM)bfine32 Wrote: You didn't answer the question. Seems we signed a couple of the biggest FA WRs that year. I get that you've dug your heels in, but I think CP9 wanted to sign TO that year and the team did what he wanted. 

TO signed on July 27th or near it.  That's not exactly indicative of a top tier guy.  It's a dumpster dive on a guy that nobody wanted any part of, who also happened to be at the tail end of his career.  Bryant swindled them.  Not exactly shining examples of top tier signings.

(11-03-2019, 12:02 AM)bfine32 Wrote: But the Bengals have only made one of us a millionaire. 

Meh, I don't get this argument.  Carson made Carson a millionaire by being good at playing football.  If the Bengals use the 1st overall pick on Byron Leftwich or some injured CB Carson goes to the Bears or almost any other team and makes millions playing football.  It's the same thing with AJ Green being loyal to the Bengals as if no other NFL team would have dared to draft him.  If a guy is a 7th round pick no one believed in or if he had some sort of criminal record that made him nigh unemployable and an NFL team gave him his first, last, or only chance I can see him feeling like he was "made" by that team, but players who would be eagerly employed by other teams.  

As for his mindset, I always assume that he was under the impression that Mike Brown finally experiencing decent/winning seasons for the first time in a decade or more would convince him to update thing and move towards operating like a normal franchise in order to win more and stay relevant...not so.  Maybe the same thing happened after 2015...geez, it was great to make the playoffs 5 years in a row, but ehh...let's just slide back down into being crap.

On a personal level I know how it feels to attempt to make things work with certain people and then to lie awake at night thinking "I was wrong, I can't do this, I can't fix this and I was an idiot to think I could make it work...I need to get out."  Oof.  

(11-02-2019, 05:17 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: same things we’ve been complaining about for decades. Same things countless other players complained about, and nothing changes. Mike doesn’t care, I’m so sick of people saying he does. Truth is, if he actually cared he’d have hired someone who had a clue about running a football franchise decades ago

Mike is convinced he knows how to build a winning team in the nfl. That is why he is dangerous. Some day the NFL will come around to way of thinking and the other teams will be correct. All 31 other teams are
are not building wining teams correctly. The pats don’t know sh@t. Steelers we all know always suck. Keep the course. You will see in about 50 years the NFL will be building teams Mikes way. Then we will have the last laugh. I mean what team has more then 4 scouts when you have the internet? What a waist of money. I for one like the Mike does not spend my money I give him recklessly. New Dey.
8 and 8 with finely

I still don't get why people use TO as an example of a bad FA signing...the guy was a one year rental and he scored 9 TDs. Seemed like one of the few things that year that didn't go wrong.

Anywho, if Palmer didn't demand a trade we probably would have just benched him for Dan LeFevour or something.

(11-03-2019, 01:10 AM)Stonyhands Wrote: All of those guys we signed were second rate talent or washed up divas nobody wanted.  The front office has a habit of undervaluing key talent.   You want to build from the draft?  Then maybe manage the contracts better to keep them when they do well.  Why they held onto Justin Smith and let Steinbach go the offseason that Braham retired, L Jones and W Anderson were coming off injuries is beyond me.  That ruined Carson.   Yet we decided to roll with guys like Stacy Andrews and Dennis Roland.  

The Bengals front office is always looking to pick up a bargain free agent.  When was the last time they signed the best free agent at a position of need at the start of free agency?

O'Neal went to a pro bowl and led the NFL in interceptions in 2005 and Odom was on his way to DPOY before he got hurt in 2009. Bobbie Williams was a starter for 8 seasons for us after signing in 2004.

(11-03-2019, 12:41 AM)pdub2005 Wrote: I think its such a joke that people say Palmer quit on us. You are way off base on the free agents. Maybe you don't remember, but Dexter Jackson was nothing special, he had a good super bowl and Hobspin played on that like no other. Sam Adam was old and FAT. Deltha was a traded for, not a free agent. Webster and Odom I will give you, they were some what respectable signings. NO ONE wanted TO, we were bidding against ourselves by that point. Our org is a joke, and we all think so, so why hold it against a guy who didn't want to play for this JOKE. My  beef with this article is that Carson is dumping on us just because of the situation, and he is acting like the Raiders weren't a total sh!t show since the 2002 super bowl. The Cardinals are one of the few teams in the NFL who have a worse history than we do. The Cards are a freaking joke, and the Raiders spent more time in the mid and late 2000s and up until now as inept franchises.  

1.He  literally quit on us.
2.) I said traded for or free agent

It doesn’t have to be one or the other - it can and is both: the Bengals front office is horrible and Carson is a douche.
What makes Carson look bad is that he complained after that terrible season yet the Bengals made the playoffs with a rookie QB in 2011. What could they have done with Palmer throwing to AJ and with a decent player added with the second rounder that they wouldn’t have had to use on a QB?

Also wasn’t it Palmer who called out Ocho Cinco saying the number one WR should be with his team just a year before Palmer himself quit? It’s ok for the QB to quit on his team but it’s not ok for a WR to miss OTAs?

I would like to take this opportunity to remind many of you on here that all you did was BOO Carson Palmer. Yes, you posted on here it was your right to BOO. You put all the blame for 2008 and 2010 on Carson Palmer, just as many of you are putting all the blame on the losing on Andy Dalton now. In the words of Barry Goldwater, " in your hearts you know I'm right ". So now some of you LOVE Palmer, no more BOO.

I felt Palmer had No Blocking. I fell Dalton has No Blocking. I feel all quarterbacks after Paul Brown died under Mike Brown have had No Blocking. Mike Browns words in 1992 and in 2017, " Why should I pay a Guard ".

I was all for Carson until he refused to play and wanted traded as Ocho wanted traded. Then I was all for the kids AJ and Andy in 2011. Now I expect they are ready to want out of Cincy also, and I look for both to do OK on other teams. However I too have lost faith in Mike Brown Family front office. They make as much money as any other NFL owners, win or lose, and they keep it all in The Family. I like to say they don't know what they are doing, but sadly they know exactly what they are doing. Their goal is not winning, their goal is making as much money as they can, win or lose, and keeping it all in The Family. This is why years of no or few scouts, only Northern NFL team without indoor practice facility, no true GM, just about everybody on staff is either Brown or Blackburn or some kind of family. Them running the late Paul Browns team is like Fredo learning the casino business. No matter how inept they are, everybody in THE FAMILY gets put on the payroll, which is THEIR MAIN FOCUS, not winning.

So fans said they had a right to Boo Carson. Now Carson is saying Boo to the Bengals, and he has that right. Turn about is fair play.

Well put!

Folks cam Hate how CP left all they want. His failings as a person +in some peoples eyes) don't disprove his assertions about how the team has been run.

(11-03-2019, 12:09 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Palmer won one (1) playoff game in his fourteen (14) year career.  Arizona built a hella good team around him in 2015, and the best he could manage was one (1) playoff victory, that took overtime to attain.  

But, "Oh, Carson should be a first ballot HOFer"...  

He's absolutely not a HOF caliber player.  I'm not sure why anyone would argue that.  His resume doesn't come close to bearing it out.  

I do believe that when he was at his peak in 05, that he looked like a generational arm talent.  He had all the arm strength you could want and could put the ball wherever he wanted.  At the end of 04 and through 05, he looked like a guy that was going to be on par with Manning and Brady.

I can honestly remember sitting in the stands watching him and wondering how this would get screwed up for us.    

Whether it was injuries or the teams he played on, his ability didn't translate to a great career.  I don't place the blame completely at the feet of this derelict organization, but they get their share.

Either way, nothing he's said about the Bengal brass is incorrect or new.  It's a second rate group of grifters.  Winning may be some priority, but it isn't the first.  It sucks that he quit on the team, but I get why he did, and an I don't harbor ill will.  Maybe he's a douche, maybe he isn't.  I don't know the guy.  I have a hard time being mad at him for what he did, either way.

All they need is a real QB, right?

Carson's comments are one of the reasons why I said stay with Dalton for now . . . build a better team around him, either he succeeds or he's gone. He's dealt with the Front Office shit for years, bringing a new kid into this mess right now is a recipe for yet another disaster. I would keep building that line and if Dalton/Bengals fail next year, high draft pick in 2021 but with a MUCH better prepared football team(See Goff). Bringing in a high draft pick next year to compete with Finley is going to result in another lost era. This team is not ready for an inexperienced QB in front of another inexperienced QB.

I wonder if the Bengals will be the 32nd NFL team to finally add crossing/drag routes to it's playbook? Little over a week to go to find out.

We need petition to force MB to sell lol

(11-03-2019, 05:35 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: All they need is a real QB, right?

Carson's comments are one of the reasons why I said stay with Dalton for now . . . build a better team around him, either he succeeds or he's gone. He's dealt with the Front Office shit for years, bringing a new kid into this mess right now is a recipe for yet another disaster. I would keep building that line and if Dalton/Bengals fail next year, high draft pick in 2021 but with a MUCH better prepared football team(See Goff). Bringing in a high draft pick next year to compete with Finley is going to result in another lost era. This team is not ready for an inexperienced QB in front of another inexperienced QB.

I wonder if the Bengals will be the 32nd NFL team to finally add crossing/drag routes to it's playbook? Little over a week to go to find out.

I agree for the most part but for two things.

Dalton is probably broken mentally and it might not be fixable.

Lastly, I'm not confident that the front office even knows how to successfully build the team anymore.

Dumb luck only gets them so far.

We've got some really below average players.
Declining players.
Way overpaid players.
From what we've seen so far... bad coaches at all levels.

That's a whole lot of fixing.

Yeah... I'm not confident at all.

Carson who???

(11-03-2019, 12:47 AM)bfine32 Wrote: CP9 wanted TO; he said so. Was he lying then or now? 

So they got him one guy he wanted? K. I do remember Carson not having anything bad to say about TO as a team mate, at least at the time. Either way, I think we could both agree that by in large most of us Bengals fans find the bengals to pursue team improvement with not as much zeal as most teams. Their refusal for decades to build an indoor practice facility, the tiny scouting department, etc have all shown that the Bengals aren't exactly a world class place to land as a draftee or free agent. I do believe we have gotten better as an organization since the 90s, but we have a long way to go and I don't Mikey is gonna do what needs to be done. Honestly, Carson has had enough of a career to have an impact on future draftees. I really hope that Joe Burrow, Tua, or Herbert isn't taking this to heart. Dalton probably isn't the mood either to tell future QBs that this is an okay place to start your career. 

I’m trying to imagine Carson Palmer’s reaction in Mike Brown’s office when things “got heated” to use Carson’s words to describe the situation. I can hear Mikey Boy screaming, “I don’t pay for blockers!” at the top of his lungs.

(11-03-2019, 02:26 AM)J24 Wrote: 1.He  literally quit on us.
2.) I said traded for or free agent

In all fairness he said run this team like a normal franchise or I want out.  It's like my wife quitting on our marriage after saying get a job or I want out.  What a quitter she was.