(02-05-2020, 09:00 AM)Au165 Wrote: I meant going up from 33 specifically. There is often a belief among fans who hold 33 that their team will jump back in because it's only a single spot, but realistically it is kind of a rarity. There have been a decent amount of teams in general who do it though.

Gotcha.

Yea, I think it comes down to how valuable is that 5th year option for the team. While it's cheaper than a Top 10 contract that a FA would get on the open market, it's still a hefty chunk of change.

(02-06-2020, 12:15 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Gotcha.

Yea, I think it comes down to how valuable is that 5th year option for the team. While it's cheaper than a Top 10 contract that a FA would get on the open market, it's still a hefty chunk of change.

Honestly, outside of QB it's not a huge deal because it may just make more sense to sign them long term at that point anyways.

Arnette was a corner at Ohio State. He can play the slot or outside and is an excellent tackler. I could see him replacing Webb and being an immediate upgrade to the depth in the secondary. Still, I'd like to see Dennard stay.

(02-03-2020, 11:21 PM)Gdale_Bengal Wrote: I think the bengals are going to draft some guys they saw at the senior bowl earlier than we may like.

And theres a chance they dont get an OT until round 3 or 4 if they really like throckmorton, or even sooner than that if OTs fly off the board early. Like, if we do go Saftey on 4, it might be kyle dugger, or they take Gaither early if they think his athletic ability will make a huge impact.

I think they take real value at the top of 2, then they start to deviate from most other boards and probably make a lot of board members mad.

If they take Throckmorton, I'd hope it would be to kick inside to play guard.  I also hope it would be in the 4th or later.

I'd prefer Dye to Phillips as I said in the OP. Dye is a player I'm starting to really hope we get. He's be the type of linebacker we've needed for a while. I'd take him in 3 if he were there. If we were dealing in fantasy-land ideas, I'd rather see them add to the LB spot in free agency with a B plus grade player.

I have a feeling that we're going defense in 2 and maybe even 3. I also have a feeling that to the team, pass rusher and corner are bigger wants that linebacker.

Austin Jackson just reminds me too much of Cedric Ogbuehi.

Any OT but him please.

(02-06-2020, 11:41 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Austin Jackson just reminds me too much of Cedric Ogbuehi.

Any OT but him please.

I watched Jackson in some games.  There is really no comparison between Ced and Jackson.  Jackson just needs some more strength, and probably should have stayed at USC for another year.  Jackson is a RT similar to big Willie in his style.  I like him a lot.  

(02-06-2020, 07:01 PM)samhain Wrote: I'd prefer Dye to Phillips as I said in the OP.  Dye is a player I'm starting to really hope we get.  He's be the type of linebacker we've needed for a while.  I'd take him in 3 if he were there.  If we were dealing in fantasy-land ideas, I'd rather see them add to the LB spot in free agency with a B plus grade player.

I have a feeling that we're going defense in 2 and maybe even 3.  I also have a feeling that to the team, pass rusher and corner are bigger wants that linebacker.

Honestly, I don't know that either of them will be of much of a contributor for a year or two.  According to the scouting reports on each of them on TDN, the knock on each of them is Football IQ, and each of their strength is athleticism, and both need to add some mass and strength.  So, same strengths and weaknesses, but they have Dye rated about 70 picks higher than Phillips.

(02-07-2020, 01:05 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: I watched Jackson in some games.  There is really no comparison between Ced and Jackson.  Jackson just needs some more strength, and probably should have stayed at USC for another year.  Jackson is a RT similar to big Willie in his style.  I like him a lot.  

I'll take your word for it, as I don't watch film on players anymore. But every time I read "ideal size, great bend, raw and needs to develop strength and anchor" I will never not think of Ogbuehi ever again.

He has permanently scarred project tackles for me haha.

(02-07-2020, 02:19 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Honestly, I don't know that either of them will be of much of a contributor for a year or two.  According to the scouting reports on each of them on TDN, the knock on each of them is Football IQ, and each of their strength is athleticism, and both need to add some mass and strength.  So, same strengths and weaknesses, but they have Dye rated about 70 picks higher than Phillips.

It may be moot, really.  I was listening to Austin Gayle from PFF (based in Cincinnati, if you didn't know!) last week on the local afternoon drive show.  He was saying that off-the-ball linebackers have very little value to most teams anymore when compared to DBs and D Linemen.  

As someone who's watched the Bengals for the last few seasons, I'd beg to differ on their value.  We need better than the guys we've got.  Still, it wouldn't shock me at all to see this major perceived need overlooked in favor of other defensive positions early in the draft.  

It's always hard to tell about where a guy gets taken.  Mack Wilson last year proved that.  For all we know, one of them could be sitting there in the 5th.

(02-08-2020, 05:25 PM)samhain Wrote: It may be moot, really.  I was listening to Austin Gayle from PFF (based in Cincinnati, if you didn't know!) last week on the local afternoon drive show.  He was saying that off-the-ball linebackers have very little value to most teams anymore when compared to DBs and D Linemen.  

As someone who's watched the Bengals for the last few seasons, I'd beg to differ on their value.  We need better than the guys we've got.  Still, it wouldn't shock me at all to see this major perceived need overlooked in favor of other defensive positions early in the draft.  

It's always hard to tell about where a guy gets taken.  Mack Wilson last year proved that.  For all we know, one of them could be sitting there in the 5th.

I can see why he would say that.  Teams want LBs that can do it all;  Stuff the run, cover the pass, execute a blitz.  If a LB only seems to have value as a coverage guy or defending the flats, but gets easily caught up in blocks or trucked in the running game, they might as well run Nickle or go with a 3 Safety alignment.

(02-08-2020, 05:35 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I can see why he would say that.  Teams want LBs that can do it all;  Stuff the run, cover the pass, execute a blitz.  If a LB only seems to have value as a coverage guy or defending the flats, but gets easily caught up in blocks or trucked in the running game, they might as well run Nickle or go with a 3 Safety alignment.

It's a catch 22, really.  I personally like the idea of having fast, rangy linebackers in a league where you know that you're going to run into Lamar Jackson twice a year and might see a guy like Watson if you are good enough to contend for the conference.  Your point is fair, though.  LA shut Lamar down running a defense with 7 DBs on the field.

The only thing I know for sure is that the old AFC North style linebacker isn't going to cut it anymore.  Preston Brown's demise proved that pretty handily.  If you run out linebackers that can't run, you will be eaten alive not only by RPO quarterbacks, but also misdirection a-la Kyle Shanahan.  The Bengals linebackers were stuck in the mud against those play calls because they just flat out could not run with them.  It wore out the entire defense in short order.  Pittsburgh came out and did almost the exact same thing 2 weeks later, and the results were very similar. it wasn't as if they hadn't seen that kind of offensive game plan before, they just couldn't do a damn thing about it. Not having linebackers that can run comes with a price, for sure.