(02-11-2020, 06:36 PM)Synric Wrote: If the Bengals decide to take an offensive linemen at 33 or 65 here some guys I like

At #33
Josh Jones, OT Houston
Cesar Ruiz IOL Michigan
Lloyd Cushenberry IOL LSU


At #65
Lucas Niang OT TCU
Matt Hennessy IOL Temple
Matthew Peart OT UConn
Tyler Biadasz IOL Wisconsin

I would be very happy with any one of these guys on day 2.

Some day 3 guys.

Isaiah Wilson OT Georgia
Solomon Kindley IOL Georgia
Michael Onwenu IOL Michigan
Terrance Steele OT/G Texas Tech
John Runyan OT/G Michigan
Kevin Dotson IOL Lousiana
Gage Cervenka IOL Clemson

The fact you have terrance steele on this list who is literally the worst offensive lineman I have ever seen tested at the senrior bowl and not Lewis or Netane Muti makes me question your ability to scout players.

(02-13-2020, 08:22 PM)Synric Wrote: I would say Jones as a prospect is closer to Andre Dillard from last year. Jones is more refined as a pass protector than in the run game. 

I was not a fan of Tytus Howard last season specifically because of the Senior Bowl. Howard reminded me of Ogbuehi always with wide elbows and hugging instead of tucked elbows hands holstered firing out.

Neither was very good last year.  Howard had a PFF rating of 59.4 and Dillard had a PFF rating of 59.7.  

There's just such a steep learning curve and such a difference in physicality that it's very difficult to find plug and play OL in the draft outside of round 1 anymore, and the aforementioned two guys were actually 1st rounders.  One falls through the cracks here or there, but you're usually eating at least a year or two of their rookie deal for them to warm the pine while they develop.  It's magnified for a guy like Jones because he's a finesse T from a small school and needs at least a year in an NFL weight room before he's ready to start.  

At 33, I really don't want a project.  It would be better to get a guy who can hit the ground running and contribute at a high level than a guy like Jones.  If you're going OL there with the intention to start them as a rookie, they need to be a guy who's played big boy college ball to make an easier transition.

(02-13-2020, 10:44 PM)Okeana Wrote: The fact you have terrance steele on this list who is literally the worst offensive lineman I have ever seen tested at the senrior bowl and not Lewis or Netane Muti makes me question your ability to scout players.

I like Damien Lewis just not in a zone blocking scheme hes a gap/man power guy. Muti has quickness but no length horrid balance (reminds me of Billy Price) and multiple lower body Injuries.

Terrance Steele has size and length but needs work in a weight room, clean up his hands, and hopefully improve his demeanor but a 7th round pick in the guy wouldnt be bad with his traits.

People are saying John jones could sneak into the top 10.

I find that crazy but you never know what could happen.

I tend to look at the right side for tackle, and seems that Lucas Niang and Isaiah Wilson are probably the best bets. Bartch and Driscoll after that.
Ruiz might be the best center and could be had in the 2nd but doubt they go that way. At G, like Lemieux, Stenberg, Kindley, Stepaniak, Onwenu, Runyan, and Steele.

If we draft a tackle, I would prefer a guy that's been playing RT for some time. It's not the easiest transition switching sides.

(02-14-2020, 10:15 AM)Gdale_Bengal Wrote: People are saying John jones could sneak into the top 10.

I find that crazy but you never know what could happen.

Dillard had similar hype last year, with some saying he'd be the first T off the board.  Highly doubt that Jones goes Top 10.

(02-14-2020, 01:43 PM)Whatever Wrote: Dillard had similar hype last year, with some saying he'd be the first T off the board.  Highly doubt that Jones goes Top 10.

You just dont know. Coaches fall in love with players or they have a particular skill set they value over other players at the position. I know I'm pretty high on Jones and think that if a run if OTs happen in the first hes going to be gone by probably 25th pick, but he is considered a dark horse candidate for top 10 and that's tough to see with wirfs, becton and thomas being the best lineman in this draft.

Someone asked me how good the Tackle class was and I was explaining it was one of the best in a while. This article sums it up pretty well.

https://theathletic.com/1607273/2020/02/14/pre-combine-nfl-draft-rankings-top-heavy-offensive-tackle-class-has-nfl-teams-excited/

(02-14-2020, 07:35 PM)Au165 Wrote: Someone asked me how good the Tackle class was and I was explaining it was one of the best in a while. This article sums it up pretty well.

https://theathletic.com/1607273/2020/02/14/pre-combine-nfl-draft-rankings-top-heavy-offensive-tackle-class-has-nfl-teams-excited/

For those that don't have The Athletic.

Quote:The overall depth of this offensive tackle class is mediocre, but it is the best collection of young talent in the early rounds that the NFL has seen in recent memory.

I took some heat last fall when I put Jedrick Wills at No. 1 in my offensive tackle rankings, but that is what the tape told me, and I continue to stand by that. But the beauty of this tackle class is the volume of high-level talent at the top. Several NFL scouts prefer the intriguing ceiling of Mekhi Becton. Some lean towards Tristan Wirfs while others think he needs to move inside to guard.
It will be interesting to see the order these tackles come off the board on draft weekend — maybe as many as six or seven in the first round. Until then, here is a look at my top-10 offensive tackles entering the combine:

1. Jedrick Wills, Alabama (6-5, 322, 5.28)
Lexington, Ky. (Lafayette), junior. Age: 20.93 (calculated to nearest 100th on draft day)
A two-year starter at Alabama, Wills lined up as the right tackle in offensive coordinator Steve Sarkisian’s scheme, allowing only one sack over his 39 games for the Tide. He protected Tua Tagovailoa’s blindside in college and while he has the natural talent to switch over to left tackle, all of his in-game snaps in high school and college came at right tackle, creating an unknown in his evaluation.
A fired-up competitor, Wills looks like a man among boys as a run blocker, driving defenders off the ball and never passing on an opportunity to bury. He needs continued growth as a technician, but he has steadily developed in pass protection, gaining proper depth in his kickslide with fluid steps. Overall, Wills is a balanced, light-footed big man with the explosive power, aggressive mentality and budding confidence that should translate very well to the NFL level, projecting as a long-term NFL starter with All-Pro upside.


2. Tristan Wirfs, Iowa (6-5, 320, 5.08)
Mount Vernon, Iowa (Mount Vernon), junior. Age: 21.25
A three-year starter at Iowa, Wirfs lined up primarily at right tackle in offensive coordinator Brian Ferentz’s pro-style scheme. He became the first true freshman in the Kirk Ferentz era to start at offensive tackle and was considered interchangeable on the left or right sides (played mostly right tackle because Alaric Jackson was a better left tackle than right tackle).
A natural athlete, Wirfs’ background in track (explosiveness) and wrestling (body control) have translated to his football skills, including the importance of training and preparation. While he is still refining his fundamentals, his ability to reset is impressive, rarely losing his center. Overall, Wirfs’ lack of ideal length will push him to guard on some boards, but his big-man twitch, developed power and tendency to always default to his balance are an impressive combination, projecting as a starting tackle or guard in the NFL.

3. Mekhi Becton, Louisville (6-7, 365, 5.40)
Highland Springs, Va. (Highland Springs), junior. Age: 21.01
A three-year starter at Louisville, Becton was the starting left tackle in head coach Scott Satterfield’s stretch zone scheme, becoming the first player in school history to win the Jacobs Trophy, which goes to the top blocker in the ACC (as voted on by the coaches). He alternated at left and right tackle under the previous coaching staff, which used strongside/weakside tackles, and is well-versed at either position (played both spots in high school).
With his rare combination of size and athleticism, Becton stonewalls rushers in pass protection and generates a surge in the run game, using his length to escort defenders off the screen. He overwhelms with his natural strength, although he has some sloppy reps on tape and must continue to fine-tune his consistency. Overall, Becton has overaggressive tendencies that lead to balance concerns, but he is a gifted blocker with impressive movement skills and power, projecting as a high-upside prospect at either left or right tackle.

4. Andrew Thomas, Georgia (6-5, 318, 5.11)
Lithonia, Ga. (Pace), junior. Age: 21.25
A three-year starter at Georgia, Thomas was the starting left tackle in former offensive coordinator James Coley’s pro-style spread. He put his name on the NFL radar as a true freshman starter at right tackle (moved to the left side as a sophomore) and graded as one of the most effective blockers in the SEC the last three seasons.
Thomas has dominant qualities in the run game, steering and controlling blockers once he gets his hands on them. With his tendency to wind up, lean and abandon his lower body fundamentals, he needs to shore up his pass pro technique, but he gets the job done on tape due to his anchor, toughness and girth. Overall, Thomas’ balance issues are the main concern with his pro transition, abandoning his mechanics and getting himself out over his skis, but he can maneuver his hips in pass protection and clear run lanes, projecting as a starting NFL tackle with fixable issues.

5. Josh Jones, Houston (6-5, 311, 5.28)
Richmond, Texas (George Bush), redshirt senior. Age: 22.84
A four-year starter at Houston, Jones was the starting left tackle in head coach Dana Holgorsen’s shotgun spread offense. A basketball athlete most of his life, he played in three different offensive systems at Houston (for five different offensive line coaches), which stunted his development, but he showed promising development as a senior.
Jones has outstanding lower body movements and flexibility, replacing his hands and showing natural sink to keep rushers occupied. The anchor strength concerns are valid, and he looks to have body type restrictions so teams must be comfortable with his frame. Overall, Jones is currently a better pass protector than run blocker, but his flexible athleticism and eager hands are outstanding foundation traits to play left tackle in the NFL, making him deserving of first-round consideration.

6. Austin Jackson, USC (6-6, 308, 5.08)
Phoenix, Ariz. (North Canyon), junior. Age: 20.93
A two-year starter at USC, Jackson was the starting left tackle in offensive coordinator Graham Harrell’s up-tempo offense. Highly recruited out of high school, he steadily developed his body and game the last three seasons, making a jump as a junior that showcased his immense upside.
Although it rarely looks picture-perfect, Jackson has the foot quickness and body flexibility to get the job done in space. He allows his chest to receive too much action in his pass-sets, but the run game is where he must show the most improvement before he sees NFL snaps. Overall, Jackson is a smooth-moving big man with natural knee bend, projecting as a steady NFL starter when/if his upper body mechanics, specifically his punch timing and hand placement, catch up with his athletic skill.

7. Isaiah Wilson, Georgia (6-7, 339, 5.42)
Brooklyn, N.Y. (Poly Prep Country Day), redshirt sophomore. Age: 21.20
A two-year starter at Georgia, Wilson was the starting right tackle in former offensive coordinator James Coley’s pro-style spread. The Bulldogs had a top-three ranked recruiting class in 2017 and he was the highest-ranked prize in the class, although he required a redshirt year as he adjusted to the heat and got his body right.
A traits-based prospect, Wilson is built with a girthy frame, long arms and enough quickness to make it difficult for rushers to get around him. While he creates movement with play strength and a mean streak, he doesn’t consistently win with his hands and his fundamentals have yet to catch up with his natural skill, leaving him laboring and leaning. Overall, Wilson is a work in progress as a technician with uneven college tape, but he has yet to play his best football, offering the functional movements and brute power of an eventual NFL starter.


8. Ezra Cleveland, Boise State (6-6, 315, 5.25)
Spanaway, Wash. (Bethel), redshirt junior. Age: 21.96
A three-year starter at Boise State, Cleveland was the starting left tackle in head coach Bryan Harsin’s offense. After his redshirt year, he earned the starting left tackle job (pushing Archie Lewis to right tackle) as a freshman and started 40 games there the last three seasons, playing 95.6% of Boise’s offensive snaps over that span.
An impressive athlete for the position, Cleveland is comfortable in space with a quick, efficient punch and the intelligence to beat rushers to the spot. However, his lack of anchor strength and explosiveness in his hands are concerns for his NFL transition. Overall, Cleveland struggles to match power in the run game and his lack of length creates a small margin for error, but he stays balanced in his pass-sets with the lower body athleticism that frustrates rushers, projecting as an NFL starter.

9. Saahdiq Charles, LSU (6-4, 301, 5.09)
Jackson, Miss. (Madison-Ridgeland), junior. Age: 20.74
A three-year starter at LSU, Charles was the starting left tackle in offensive coordinator Steve Ensminger’s offense. Despite not becoming a full-time starting offensive lineman until his senior year in high school, he started all three seasons in Baton Rouge, protecting Joe Burrow’s blindside the last two years (aside from his six-game suspension in 2019).
A light-footed athlete, Charles is an impressive mover and shows enough core strength to hold his ground at the point of attack. He doesn’t have the ideal length for edge work and is consistently late getting his hands in position, which leads to body-to-body blocks and contact balance issues. Overall, Charles uses efficient movement patterns to consistently beat pass rushers to the spot, but his technique is under-developed and the maturity concerns will remove him from draft boards, projecting as a top-50 talent who likely won’t be drafted that high due to the red flags.

10. Prince Tega Wanogho, Auburn (6-5, 307, 5.23)
Montgomery, Ala. (Edgewood Academy), redshirt senior. Age: 22.42
A three-year starter at Auburn, Wanogho lined up at left tackle in head coach Gus Malzahn’s spread-option offense, showing steady development each season. The Nigerian native has only been playing the sport since 2014 and moved to the offensive line in 2016 so the instinctive issues are understandable, but his intelligence and “want to” are there.
Wanogho is a gifted athlete with a bounce in his feet that allows for quick advantages, helping him protect the corner vs. edge speed or redirect vs. inside counters. He creates too many self-inflicted mistakes due to timing and finesse issues with his punch and needs to load more ammo into his hands. Overall, Wanogho doesn’t currently play with consistent timing or cohesion, but he is a toolsy prospect with NFL starting potential due to his light-footed athleticism and reliable football character.

It seems like there's a resurgence in the massive offensive tackle. There are quite a few 320 plus guys in there.

I'm hoping we can get a guard on day 2. I'd like to see them get Kindley, one of the Michigan guys, or Logan Stenberg. Wouldn't mind Throckmorton as a guard, either.

Two of my favorite prospects are Isaiah Wilson and Solomon Kindley. Watching Georgia games, they both stood out to me. Both are big and powerful and could really open up some holes for Mixon to get our running game on track. They would be an instant improvement at Tackle and guard. Although I’m really not sure what grade teams have on Kindley. I see him mocked anywhere from the late 1st to the 4th round.

What are people’s thoughts on Trey Adams. Obviously some major medical concerns but because of that I think he’ll be drafted much later than his skill level. Could he be someone worth taking a flier on?

Trey Adams is my guy; I think he'll be superb, if he stays healthy. Would love him in the 2nd or 3rd, but he may not go as high as 2.

(02-16-2020, 02:38 PM)WhoDeyK Wrote: Two of my favorite prospects are Isaiah Wilson and Solomon Kindley. Watching Georgia games, they both  stood out to me. Both are big and powerful and could really open up some holes for Mixon to get our running game on track. They would be an instant improvement at Tackle and guard. Although I’m really not sure what grade teams have on Kindley. I see him mocked anywhere from the late 1st to the 4th round.

What are people’s thoughts on Trey Adams. Obviously some major medical concerns but because of that I think he’ll be drafted much later than his skill level. Could he be someone worth taking a flier on?

I think Adams would be a good gamble on Day 3 if they don't get a T on Day 2.  However, given his injury history and the T talent available at the top of this class, I wouldn't want him before then.  

(02-16-2020, 11:51 PM)Whatever Wrote: I think Adams would be a good gamble on Day 3 if they don't get a T on Day 2.  However, given his injury history and the T talent available at the top of this class, I wouldn't want him before then.  

Agreed. If he’s available going in to day 3 I’d pull the trigger. Especially if there’s a run on tackles early on and we don’t get someone on the first two days. When healthy, I think he’s better than Lucas Niang and Prince Tega Wanogho. I think he could fill the RT spot nicely.

(02-11-2020, 09:16 PM)Synric Wrote: I'm big on all 3 Michigan guys. I wouldn't hate Ruiz in the 2nd and Onwenu in the 4th rebuild the interior offensive line. I know everyone is hard on Hart but the interior line was worse.

Good point on Michigan...they made a piss poor QB look pretty solid with their play.  Burrow would have killed behind that line, just like he did at LSU. 

(02-13-2020, 01:48 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I've seen a lot of variance on Solomon Kindley and Tyler Biadasz. I've seen both mentioned in the first round before.
Trey Adams is also up in the air because of how concerned teams may get with his injury history (although he's currently healthy).
I've also seen Shane Lemieux mentioned all over the place.

After the massive success of Quinten Nelson, a lot of teams looked harder at the OG position, but he was a rare talent.  Most of these guys like you mentioned are not going to show up in Rd 1, as there are sexy QBs, DEs, CBs, and WRs, that seemingly always push these guys to the later rounds. 

If I had to guess what FA the Bengals would sign (not what I would hope for, Thuney) that it will be a LB, meaning they will have to get a top tier OG to push Jordan and/or replace Miller down the road.  If they get an insane offer to slide a few picks in Rd 2 and pick up an additional 3rd, I could surely see them getting a top tier Safety or CB in Rd 2, and then getting the OG and a WR in Rd 3.  It would be awesome if they netted a Rd 2 pick for Dalton, but I am starting to question if they will get much at all for him.  I just don't see that many fits where that team will give up anything for the right to have him for one season under a relatively cheap contract.  

(02-23-2020, 10:13 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: After the massive success of Quinten Nelson, a lot of teams looked harder at the OG position, but he was a rare talent.  

Remember when some thought Nelson wasn't worth such a high pick and Will Hernandez was going to be as good or better? Fun times.

(02-24-2020, 02:12 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Remember when some thought Nelson wasn't worth such a high pick and Will Hernandez was going to be as good or better? Fun times.

You need a new definition of fun times. Or you need to get out more often! [emoji23]


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(02-14-2020, 02:28 AM)Synric Wrote: I like Damien Lewis just not in a zone blocking scheme hes a gap/man power guy. Muti has quickness but no length horrid balance (reminds me of Billy Price) and multiple lower body Injuries.

Terrance Steele has size and length but needs work in a weight room, clean up his hands, and hopefully improve his demeanor but a 7th round pick in the guy wouldnt be bad with his traits.

Cedric Ogbuehi 2.0 it sounds like.