(04-24-2020, 12:31 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: It makes a difference in every scheme.  It's like batting right handed vs. batting left handed.  I didn't think it was a big deal until a line coach was on Moving the Chains and talked about it.

As I said, not true with zone blocking because the motion depending which way the run goes is the same LT or RT. In terms of pass protection it can but it depends if they are kick setting or like LA run blocking the pass sets. Not many teams do the traditional deep kick set anymore and even if you do it’s not nearly as difficult as batting opposite, more like throwing a punch with left versus right.

He played RG at the senior bowl perfectly comfortable which would be the same motions as RT with no issue.

(04-24-2020, 12:17 PM)Memphis_Bengal Wrote: For anyone worried about Josh Jones arm length...he is just over 3mm shorter arm length than Wirfs.

Josh Jones - 33 7/8
Tristan Wirfs - 34
Austin Jackson - 34 1/8

Don't think that will prevent him from being a great OT in NFL

Or here in America we say 1/8 of an inch....

(04-24-2020, 12:37 PM)Au165 Wrote: As I said, not true with zone blocking because the motion depending which way the run goes is the same LT or RT. In terms of pass protection it can but it depends if they are kick setting or like LA run blocking the pass sets. Not many teams do the traditional deep kick set anymore and even if you do it’s not nearly as difficult as batting opposite, more like throwing a punch with left versus right.

He played RG at the senior bowl perfectly comfortable which would be the same motions as RT with no issue.

I guess I'll take the line coach's word for it and assume that a guy isn't going to seamlessly adjust to switching sides after playing 4 years on the left side.  I[m not concerned about his run blocking from that side,.

If that's who we take, I hope he can make the switch.  If all the toughest about him being raw despite starting 4 years are true, we may have bigger problems than just switching sides.

(04-24-2020, 01:12 AM)BURROWorBUST Wrote: First round projections left on the board. Who do you take?

17 Josh Jones OL HOU

20 Yetur Gross-Matos EDGE PSU

21 Xavier McKinney S BAMA

24 Kristian Fulton CB LSU

26 Zack Baun LB WISC

28 Grant Delpit S LSU

29 Ross Blacklock DL TCU

30 Trevon Diggs CB BAMA

31 Jonathan Taylor RB WISC

Josh Jones seems like the pick to me.

I’d rather have Mims, the Bengals need WR depth. Did you see the WR situation last year ? Lol

The same people that are saying pick up a o linemen later in round 3 or 4 are the same guys that will be screaming the Bengals did not address the o line holes again this year if the o line is not solid.

(04-24-2020, 12:42 PM)sandwedge Wrote: Or here in America we say 1/8 of an inch....

lol...right right but 3mm SOUNDS like a lot less than 1/8 of an inch. I just wanted to highlight how silly it is to say his arms would be a hindrance for him but not Wirfs.

(04-24-2020, 12:44 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: I guess I'll take the line coach's word for it and assume that a guy isn't going to seamlessly adjust to switching sides after playing 4 years on the left side.  I[m not concerned about his run blocking from that side,.

What I am telling you also comes from line coaches, so I guess it all depends on which line coach you like more. If we take him then Jim Turner is saying by default they think he can play RG/RT and transition without issue, so in effect us taking him means you will jump on board with him playing RT since Jim Turner is also a "Line coach".

Side note if you look at last night, at least two of the tackles taken are going to kick to the opposite side they played in college.

(04-24-2020, 12:45 PM)Trademark Wrote: I’d rather have Mims, the Bengals need WR depth. Did you see the WR situation last year ? Lol

True BUT...this is the deepest WR draft in years so we can still pick up quality WRs in rounds 3/4

Looking at how 2/3 might go would you rather have:

2: Baun 3: Claypool/Shenault
OR
2: Tee Higgins/Denzel Mimms 3: ADG

(04-24-2020, 12:45 PM)Trademark Wrote: I’d rather have Mims, the Bengals need WR depth. Did you see the WR situation last year ? Lol

I think the Bengals will still draft a WR and maybe even two in later rounds.  Like you I am concerned about the talent there.

But we have already invested $18 million to upgrade the WR position over what we had last year, and have other holes that have not been addressed yet.

Zack Baun is a great talent but also a big risk because he is all projection. He will be switching positions in the NFL from a 34 edge to an inside linebacker. It does help that he was always the field guy at Wisconsin.

(04-24-2020, 01:00 PM)Synric Wrote: Zack Baun is a great talent but also a big risk because he is all projection. He will be switching positions in the NFL from a 34 edge to an inside linebacker.

So you want Jones, correct? You and AU seem to know your stuff when it comes to the draft so if you guys are both all in on him I’ll feel better if we take him.

(04-24-2020, 01:00 PM)Synric Wrote: Zack Baun is a great talent but also a big risk because he is all projection. He will be switching positions in the NFL from a 34 edge to an inside linebacker. It does help that he was always the field guy at Wisconsin.

They had him work all week at the senior bowl as a stack backer and he did pretty well by most reports. I think if we take him it's based on what they saw from him there. I think you can play him as a SAM in a 4-3 look then use him as more of a rusher in 3-4 looks.

Delpit or Neville Gallimore

(04-24-2020, 01:02 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: So you want Jones, correct? You and AU seem to know your stuff when it comes to the draft so if you guys are both all in on him I’ll feel better if we take him.

I like alot of guys actually. I like Zack Baun it might not seem like it I'm just putting a little hey there are some flags into it. 

Jones and Baun would fit well. I can also see Mims and Shenault, but I think the best value would be to trade back if they can find someone willing and take Lucas Niang who can play RG or RT year 1 but his hip is a serious flag.

(04-24-2020, 01:03 PM)Au165 Wrote: They had him work all week at the senior bowl as a stack backer and he did pretty well by most reports. I think if we take him it's based on what they saw from him there. I think you can play him as a SAM in a 4-3 look then use him as more of a rusher in 3-4 looks.

I can see him as that old school 43 Leo and a 34 inside/34 edge rusher. He can be moved all over. He is actually really good in space always playing on the field side helps is projection.

(04-24-2020, 12:52 PM)Au165 Wrote: What I am telling you also comes from line coaches, so I guess it all depends on which line coach you like more. If we take him then Jim Turner is saying by default they think he can play RG/RT and transition without issue, so in effect us taking him means you will jump on board with him playing RT since Jim Turner is also a "Line coach".

Side note if you look at last night, at least two of the tackles taken are going to kick to the opposite side they played in college.

Do you see Jones as a plug and play starter?  I personally like him a lot as a long term developmental prospect, but I question his ability to have a great immediate impact due to his technique and strength issues which will be hard to address with virtual OTA's.  That's not to say I think he's a bad pick at 33, just that I don't see him being a quality starter year 1.

(04-24-2020, 12:52 PM)Au165 Wrote: What I am telling you also comes from line coaches, so I guess it all depends on which line coach you like more. If we take him then Jim Turner is saying by default they think he can play RG/RT and transition without issue, so in effect us taking him means you will jump on board with him playing RT since Jim Turner is also a "Line coach".

Side note if you look at last night, at least two of the tackles taken are going to kick to the opposite side they played in college.

Who knows.  Maybe they would put him at LG or LT and move someone else.  It's hard to say.  Would I jump on board with him playing RT?  Depends on if he plays better than Hart.  Are there other guys that I would take at RT in this draft over Jones?  Yes.

As for last night, we'll see how well those guys do making the change.  It will be interesting to see how long the learning curve is.

So, if for some reason the 2020 season gets cancelled all together would the Bengals get the #1 pick again next year? Imagine the trade possibilities of teams wanting to move up for Lawrence or Fields!

(04-24-2020, 01:13 PM)Whatever Wrote: Do you see Jones as a plug and play starter?  I personally like him a lot as a long term developmental prospect, but I question his ability to have a great immediate impact due to his technique and strength issues which will be hard to address with virtual OTA's.  That's not to say I think he's a bad pick at 33, just that I don't see him being a quality starter year 1.

Jones is just a wasted pick at #33.
1. That would mean they have completely given up on Hart or Johnson at RT.
2. Or feel that Jones is heads and above better than both and can easily make the transition from LT to RT w/o any OTA's and come right on board and take over the RT position.

So, they are going to draft a guy at #33 that won't start Day 1??? I just can't see that at all.

Not with all the WR, DE's, LB or DB help that can start or rotate in the lineups Day 1.

Let's just take a guy not high on a lot of people's lists for the Bengals. But, Jaylon Johnson is a bonafide NFL Day 1 starter at CB. He's still available and was expected to go in the 1st round. There's just too many guys around at #33 to take a guy like Jones in my opinion.

(04-24-2020, 11:44 AM)Au165 Wrote: Yea I see a huge difference, Jones can eventually play tackle and Lewis won’t. You can start Jones at Guard year one then next year move him to tackle.

As for WR it’s a tough read, I don’t know if the team sees it as a pressing need right now. Taylor said whoever they take at 33 needs to be a starter and no WR is starting this year and their reps are probably limited in a currently crowded room which makes me wonder if 33 and WR go together in the staffs mind.

65 is the perfect spot for a Lb as some combination of Logan Wilson, Willie Gay, Davis-Gaithersburg, and Malik Harrison should be there. I don’t think any stand out head and shoulders above so I’d take any.

With you on the LBs, but I think Gay is the best pure athlete and coverage man out of that group, so he is my #1.

And I get what you are saying about Jones....he could do exactly that:  start at RG and move to RT next year if Hart and/or Johnson don't take the job and run with it.  But I don't know, honestly, how much better a prospect he is at OT.  And, more importantly, will he be able to take over the job at RG and be a significant upgrade?  I think Lewis, a mauler, can do that....two rounds later.  

Here is what PFF had to say about Lewis, in reference to his matchup against Derrick Brown, the best defensive prospect in this draft not named Chase Young.  

4. DAMIEN LEWIS, LSU

Draft Board Rank: 85th
Lewis was born to play guard in the NFL. At 6-foot-3, 332 pounds, Lewis looks as if he couldn't get under 300 pounds even if he trained for a marathon. He also looks like he wouldn't cede an inch on a bull-rush against a Mac truck. And he routinely didn't until Auburn's Derrick Brown came along. While Brown got him a couple of times in that game, the matchup was must-see TV for any trench-play enthusiast. Both got their nice wins in, and Lewis held up about as well as any guard did against Brown all season.


And here is what they said about Josh Jones:


4. JOSH JONES, HOUSTON

Draft Board Rank: 14th
There was no more impressive offensive tackle at the Senior Bowl. His 54% win rate in the one-on-ones was the highest of any tackle in attendance. That’s no surprise after he earned the highest grade of any draft-eligible tackle during the regular season at 93.2 overall. While his pass sets need to be retooled to some degree, Jones’ hands are some of the best in the entire draft class. We also love that his pass protection grade has improved every single year of his career.



You can see they really liked him, but I have serious reservations about his level of competition.  His Senior Bowl week helped to alleviate some of those concerns.  


If the Bengals take Jones, and I suspect they will, I will just have to hope a receiver like Antonio Gandy-Golden is there in the 4th round.  I just really don't like our depth at WR at all.  Too many guys that do the same thing, not enough guys that are explosive and can generate quick separation.  It is a scoring league, and I want to give Burrow as many weapons as we can where he isn't getting killed waiting for someone to break away from a defender.  It seems like we are putting all our eggs in Ross's basket, and that is ironic given how fans on here have pretty much written him off.  


I won't hate the pick...far from it.  I just wish there was something we could do to get two 2nd round picks...like trade Dalton to Jax and pick up half his salary?

(04-24-2020, 12:51 PM)Memphis_Bengal Wrote: lol...right right but 3mm SOUNDS like a lot less than 1/8 of an inch. I just wanted to highlight how silly it is to say his arms would be a hindrance for him but not Wirfs.

I knew what you meant and your right, it is a silly argument