(05-17-2020, 01:31 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: After four years in to their careers:

Dak has 15,778 yards, 97 TDs, and 36 INTs
Andy had 14,758 yards, 99 TDs, and 66 INTs.

Aside from the dramatic difference in INTs, the other numbers are pretty similar.  Dak took over a team that was loaded for an injured Romo, Dalton took over a team that many expected to go 0-16.  Very different situations, very similar results.  

Oh, and Dalton took that team in a tough division to the playoffs all four years leading up to his best season in 2015, where he was an MVP consideration before the injury. 

It isn't as crazy as you make it sound.  I would love to see how Dak would fare in Cincy during those years.  Maybe I will get to see how Dalton would fare this year?   Who knows.  Either way, you can't say with 100 certainty that Dak is that much better because he has never had to play on a talent-depleted team.  

This is just like the “even Tom Brady couldn’t win here” nonsense people spouted for years. I always disagreed with that, too.

Also, I’m not going to just casually brush off Dalton having nearly twice as many INTS’s as Dak after 4 years. That’s a big deal. Hell, Andy had 20 one season. And it wasn’t on a “depleted team” either. That 2013 team was damn good. Look at the Brady’s, the Rodgers, the Wilson’s, and the Mahomes of the league, they don’t turn the ball over anywhere close to that. Throwing too many INT’s literally just cost a former 1st overall pick (Jameis Winston) a starting job. Otherwise those 30 TD’s and 5k yds would have looked pretty great. In fact they’d look a lot like Dak’s numbers...

(05-17-2020, 02:25 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: This is just like the “even Tom Brady couldn’t win here” nonsense people spouted for years. I always disagreed with that, too.

Also, I’m not going to just casually brush off Dalton having nearly twice as many INTS’s as Dak after 4 years. That’s a big deal. Hell, Andy had 20 one season. And it wasn’t on a “depleted team” either. That 2013 team was damn good. Look at the Brady’s, the Rodgers, the Wilson’s, and the Mahomes of the league, they don’t turn the ball over anywhere close to that. Throwing too many INT’s literally just cost a former 1st overall pick (Jameis Winston) a starting job. Otherwise those 30 TD’s and 5k yds would have looked pretty great. In fact they’d look a lot like Dak’s numbers...

That's fine, the concept of always playing from behind must be lost on you.  Maybe ask Phillip Rivers or early Peyton Manning about it?  

The Super Dak Homer time-killer thread lol

(05-17-2020, 04:04 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: That's fine, the concept of always playing from behind must be lost on you.  Maybe ask Phillip Rivers or early Peyton Manning about it?  

We were always playing from behind during Dalton’s first 4 years? Not exactly how I remember it. And again, you’re acting like the Cowboys are the Patriots or something. They were an 8-8 team last year. Dak also already has 9 4th quarter comebacks through 4 seasons (Andy had 10). So he’s done his share of playing from behind as well.

Can you believe some people have to trash Andy even in a "Super Homer" thread.

It is sad when an obsession becomes a problem.

(05-18-2020, 11:31 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Can you believe some people have to trash Andy even in a "Super Homer" thread.

It is sad when an obsession becomes a problem.

Kind of like the people that have to bash AJ in a thread about the greatest players of an entire decade. Sad.

At least my “trashing” is backed up by stats and facts. Some of you “realists” are merely guessing AJ won’t be able to stay healthy, and continue play at a high level for us.

(05-17-2020, 04:48 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: We were always playing from behind during Dalton’s first 4 years? Not exactly how I remember it. And again, you’re acting like the Cowboys are the Patriots or something. They were an 8-8 team last year. Dak also already has 9 4th quarter comebacks through 4 seasons (Andy had 10). So he’s done his share of playing from behind as well.

When Dak had a Hall-of-Fame TE (Witten), An All-Pro RB (Elliott), and All-Pro WR (Bryant), and an O-line with THREE FIRST TEAM ALL-PROS (Tyron Smith, Travis Frederick, Zach Martin)  the best he could muster was a 104.9 passer rating.  Dalton posted a 106.2 with half the talent around him in 2015.  Dak had th number one running game in the league.  Daltons best run support was the 2015 team that ranked 13th.


This argument reminds me of when some guys around here tried to claim that Tyrod Taylor was better than Andy.  Just look how he fared when he did not have the number one rushing attack in the league behind him.

Prescott has had more talent around him on offense than any other QB in the league ever since the Cowboys drafted him.  There are a lot of QBs that could have matched his production with that much talent around them.

(05-18-2020, 11:43 AM)fredtoast Wrote: When Dak had a Hall-of-Fame TE (Witten), An All-Pro RB (Elliott), and All-Pro WR (Bryant), and an O-line with THREE FIRST TEAM ALL-PROS (Tyron Smith, Travis Frederick, Zach Martin)  the best he could muster was a 104.9 passer rating.  Dalton posted a 106.2 with half the talent around him in 2015.  Dak had th number one running game in the league.  Daltons best run support was the 2015 team that ranked 13th.


This argument reminds me of when some guys around here tried to claim that Tyrod Taylor was better than Andy.  Just look how he fared when he did not have the number one rushing attack in the league behind him.

Prescott has had more talent around him on offense than any other QB in the league ever since the Cowboys drafted him.  There are a lot of QBs that could have matched his production with that much talent around them.

Tyrod Taylor has a better chance at being a starting QB this season than Andy Dalton. I don’t necessarily agree that Taylor was ever better than Dalton, but do with that what you will.

And Dak put up those numbers as a ROOKIE. But sure, a 5th year veteran QB on an equally stacked team put a slightly better rating for 12 games. Because those situations are exactly the same, context be dammed!

Also, talk about being intentionally misleading wrt to Dak’s “All Pro” WR in Dez Bryant. He had 50 rec for 796 yds that season. Hell, Cole Beasley was Dak’s leading WR that year. Cole Beasley.

(05-18-2020, 12:04 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Also, talk about being intentionally misleading wrt to Dak’s “All Pro” WR in Dez Bryant. He had 50 rec for 796 yds that season. Hell, Cole Beasley was Dak’s leading WR that year. Cole Beasley.

Okay, so change "All-Pro" to "Pro Bowl".  Bryant had 8 tds that year and if Dak had been able to throw the ball downfield like Dalton Bryant would have had a lot more receptions and yards.

And Cole Beasley is an excellent possession receiver.  The Bills gave him a $30 million contract last year

(05-18-2020, 11:57 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: And Dak put up those numbers as a ROOKIE.

Yep.  More proof that his performance was due to the talent around him.  If it was just based on Daks skills then his production woud have gone up after his rookie seasoninstead of dropping

(05-18-2020, 11:57 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: But sure, a 5th year veteran QB on an equally stacked team 

"Equally stacked"?

Really?

did you miss the part about the three first team All pros on the offense line and the leading rushing game in the league?

(05-18-2020, 12:25 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yep.  More proof that his performance was due to the talent around him.  If it was just based on Daks skills then his production woud have gone up after his rookie seasoninstead of dropping



"Equally stacked"?

Really?

did you miss the part about the three first team All pros on the offense line and the leading rushing game in the league?

You're stttrrreeeeeeeccccchhhhhing  things to act like the 2016 Cowboys "team" was all world and the 2015 Bengals were just so-so.

Was the Cowboys roster better ? it's debatable but perhaps some (oline). But AJ Green, Eifert, Sanu, Jones, Gio. Hill, Whit, A. Smith, Zeitler just off the top of my head weren't hot garbage.

(05-18-2020, 12:21 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Okay, so change "All-Pro" to "Pro Bowl".  Bryant had 8 tds that year and if Dak had been able to throw the ball downfield like Dalton Bryant would have had a lot more receptions and yards.

And Cole Beasley is an excellent possession receiver.  The Bills gave him a $30 million contract last year

And John Ross had 7 TD’s last season, so what? 50 rec and <800 yds is not Pro Bowl level production from at star WR. Dez went off of his name.

As for the bolded, you mean like this?

https://youtu.be/_Bw-oHON2mw

Or this?

https://youtu.be/IGvn1JYcqIc

Dak’s Y/A (7.6) is actually higher than Dalton’s (7.1). He’s much better throwing the ball down the field than he gets credit for.

https://youtu.be/tgE0U6ZAdDI

(05-18-2020, 12:51 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: You're stttrrreeeeeeeccccchhhhhing  things to act like the 2016 Cowboys "team" was all world and the 2015 Bengals were just so-so.

Was the Cowboys roster better ? it's debatable but perhaps some (oline). But AJ Green, Eifert, Sanu, Jones, Gio. Hill, Whit, A. Smith, Zeitler just off the top of my head weren't hot garbage.

Our 2015 team was so good AJ freaking McCarron almost beat the eventual Super Bowl champs on the road in OT, and nearly won a playoff game against a team we beat like once a decade. The lack of an All Galaxy OL notwithstanding, that team was indeed stacked.

It’s really weird to me a Bengals fan would want to downplay an entire team full of players that balled out, and had career seasons, just to prop up one guy in an argument.

(05-14-2020, 08:21 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Looks like Ben has already given up.....on everything. 

Isn't that what everyone in the Pittsburgh area looks like?  

(05-18-2020, 06:30 PM)sandwedge Wrote: Isn't that what everyone in the Pittsburgh area looks like?  

No. Just the women and Ben.

(05-18-2020, 06:37 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: No. Just the women and Ben.

(05-18-2020, 06:57 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote:

My wife brought home KFC for supper. Think I'm gonna eat soup now. Shit! Just had a vision, I think I'll settle for salad. Damnit! Think I'll just sit here and drink beer until my food looks attractive.

(05-18-2020, 01:31 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: It’s really weird to me a Bengals fan would want to downplay an entire team full of players that balled out, and had career seasons, just to prop up one guy in an argument.

All I am doing is stating facts.  Our run game in 2015 was no where near as good as what Prescott had.  Our O-lin never had 3 first team All-Pros.

You are the on playing pretend to try and shit on Dalton.  Why would any fan do that?

(05-19-2020, 02:04 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You are the on playing pretend to try and shit on Dalton.  Why would any fan do that?

Because this is the super homer thread and part of being a super homer is to convince yourself that everyone who is still on the team is awesome and everyone who left the team is THE reason we didn't win the year before.  Duh.