Boyd will never come close to those numbers.

He did well last year because green and Ross were injured.

He's very unlikely to continue to have those kinds of seasons.

If becomes anyone's favorite target I'll move to Cambodia and live life as a hermit.

(05-21-2020, 05:20 PM)motoarch Wrote: He did well last year because green and Ross were injured.

The first 8 games of 2018 when Green was 100% healthy Boyd had 49 receptions for 620 yards and 5 tds.

(05-21-2020, 06:42 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The first 8 games of 2018 when Green was 100% healthy Boyd had 49 receptions for 620 yards and 5 tds.

So?  I saved a ton by switching to GEICO.

(05-21-2020, 07:41 PM)motoarch Wrote: So?  I saved a ton by switching to GEICO.

Sorry you can't understand my point.  Let me try again.

You said the only reason Boyd had good numbers was because Green was injured last year.  So I pointed out that he put up even BIGGER numbers when Green was healthy.

Hope you get it now because I don't know how to make it any more simple than that.

(05-21-2020, 05:04 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Not sure what you mean by "dog house".

Marvin benching Tyler for a couple of games was just a coach holding a player accountable for off field indiscretions.

Dorsey and Dawson were just not good players.  I guess they were in the "dog house" of every single coach in the entire league.

Ross was just not ready to play.  Again, Marvin holding a player accountable for not knowing the playbook and trying to hide injuries.

That's your take and it isn't mine.  Your "couple games" extended most of a season for Boyd.  Dorsey took a screen pass something like 60 yards, then blocked a punt, and never saw the field again.  I have no idea what that was all about.  Saying guys like Dorsey and Dawson were not good players and because no other coach gave them a chance proves that is a bit of a stretch.  Would we have known what Vontaze Burfict was without an injury to Thomas Howard?  Can't say for sure.  Not everyone in the league gets chances, but that was Marv sticking with paid players and veterans that weren't playing very well to begin with. 

Ross not being ready to play has been debated ad nauseum around here.  He must have learned a lot not playing under Marv (which makes no sense) because his first game with ZT, he had career highs in yards and TDs, against a pretty good Seahawks secondary.  

(05-21-2020, 05:05 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Tyler Boyd has never had 1,050+ yards in his career, but you're saying "just" 1,200 yards a year for the next 5 years.

Lol

And before last year, John Ross had never had a 100 yard receiving game, and he started the season with two.  Again, I think his role expands and he becomes more important to this offense than ever before.  He got 90 receptions and 1000 yards last year with few weapons around him and Ryan Finley starting for three games.  If you don't see his potential in the slot with Burrow and more outside weapons at this point, then I won't keep trying. 

Green has been taking more and more snaps out of the slot.  If Green isn't signed long term (although I believe he will be), I think Boyd will get a ton of targets in the slot moving forward.

Even Fred noted:  "The first 8 games of 2018 when Green was 100% healthy Boyd had 49 receptions for 620 yards and 5 tds.".

(05-22-2020, 09:38 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Sorry you can't understand my point.  Let me try again.

You said the only reason Boyd had good numbers was because Green was injured last year.  So I pointed out that he put up even BIGGER numbers when Green was healthy.

Hope you get it now because I don't know how to make it any more simple than that.

Thanks for clarifying.  Again so?

(05-22-2020, 12:29 PM)motoarch Wrote: Thanks for clarifying.  Again so?

I don't understand your question.

When someone posts something that is wrong I correct them.

That is how message boards everywhere work.

(05-22-2020, 09:43 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Not everyone in the league gets chances, but that was Marv sticking with paid players and veterans that weren't playing very well to begin with. 

WTF are you talking about.  The two season Dawson was here ('15-'16) our scoring defense ranked #2 and #8.  So what do you mean about vets not playing well?

Then Dawson got another shot with the Seahawks in '17 and their Super Bowl winning coaching staff agreed that he sucked.

DeDe Dorsey got shots with both the Colts and Lions.  They both agreed he sucked and cut him.

Marvin was correct about both of those players.  It was not some imaginary "doghouse" you created in your head.  They just were not good enough.

(05-22-2020, 01:40 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't understand your question.

When someone posts something that is wrong I correct them.

That is how message boards everywhere work.

But I'm not wrong.

(05-22-2020, 01:48 PM)fredtoast Wrote: WTF are you talking about.  The two season Dawson was here ('15-'16) our scoring defense ranked #2 and #8.  So what do you mean about vets not playing well?

Then Dawson got another shot with the Seahawks in '17 and their Super Bowl winning coaching staff agreed that he sucked.

DeDe Dorsey got shots with both the Colts and Lions.  They both agreed he sucked and cut him.

Marvin was correct about both of those players.  It was not some imaginary "doghouse" you created in your head.  They just were not good enough.

They played so well they signed AJ Hawk and Rey Maualuga was also horrible.  This team was good because of their front four and their secondary, NOT their LB corps.  Burfict made that group pretty good.  The rest of the LBs were horrible.  But go ahead and polish the statue of Rey Maualuga and AJ Hawk outside PBS.  

Scoring defense?   Cherry picking again....how were they against the rush?  The LBs were bad and Dawson still never got a shot.  They brought in a wiped out AJ Hawk and Maualuga sucked.  But you go on believing Marvin never had a dog house and that those guys just sucked.  

(05-23-2020, 08:31 AM)SHRacerX Wrote:  But you go on believing Marvin never had a dog house and that those guys just sucked.  

You mean agreeing with all the other teams in the NFL instead of you?


No problem.

I think both Boyd and Mixon can have huge years receiving with Burrow here now. He loves to throw to the Slot
Receiver and the RB's as we saw with Jefferson and Edwards-Helaire's numbers last season. Throwing more to the
RB's has been something I have been complaining about for years with our Offense. We have good pass catching
RB's all across the board if the backup can stay healthy.

Even Traveon and Rodney are very good pass catching RB's.

Boyd is dependable which is the biggest reason he could have a big year besides the fact Burrow likes to throw to
the Slot Receiver a lot.

(05-22-2020, 01:40 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't understand your question.

When someone posts something that is wrong I correct them.

That is how message boards everywhere work.

Post of the Year....Fred determines what is wrong.   

I think you meant to say that when your OPINION differs from someone else's, you try to say they are wrong.  That is how the message boards work, for you.  

(05-23-2020, 09:56 AM)fredtoast Wrote: You mean agreeing with all the other teams in the NFL instead of you?


No problem.

The very team that Ross is currently on the roster happens to be the same team that he was on under Marvin, and we saw a very different Ross under ZT than Marv.  But two other teams gave Dawson and Dorsey contracts and then moved on to younger, cheaper players.  So, I would hardly say they agreed with you, but if it helps you sleep better.  And you never really addressed Boyd's dog house season?  I guess you are sticking with the narrative that Ross wasn't ready to play but he learned in one offseason with ZT how to lead the NFL after two games.  

Thanks, no problem at all.  

(05-24-2020, 12:13 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Post of the Year....Fred determines what is wrong.   

I think you meant to say that when your OPINION differs from someone else's, you try to say they are wrong.  That is how the message boards work, for you.  

At least someone around here knows the difference between fact and opinion. 

(05-22-2020, 05:55 PM)motoarch Wrote: But I'm not wrong.

In case you are struggling with the difference between "fact" and "opinion" let me help you out.

You claimed that the only reason Tyler had good numbers was because Green was out with injut.  That is an opion.

I then posted nub ers showing that Boyd had very good production when Green was 100% healthy.  Those stats were facts.

My "facts" prove your "opinion" was wrong.

(05-24-2020, 01:15 PM)fredtoast Wrote: In case you are struggling with the difference between "fact" and "opinion" let me help you out.

You claimed that the only reason Tyler had good numbers was because Green was out with injut.  That is an opion.

I then posted nub ers showing that Boyd had very good production when Green was 100% healthy.  Those stats were facts.

My "facts" prove your "opinion" was wrong.

You're adorable.













And wrong

(05-22-2020, 09:48 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: And before last year, John Ross had never had a 100 yard receiving game, and he started the season with two.  Again, I think his role expands and he becomes more important to this offense than ever before.  He got 90 receptions and 1000 yards last year with few weapons around him and Ryan Finley starting for three games.  If you don't see his potential in the slot with Burrow and more outside weapons at this point, then I won't keep trying. 

Green has been taking more and more snaps out of the slot.  If Green isn't signed long term (although I believe he will be), I think Boyd will get a ton of targets in the slot moving forward.

Even Fred noted:  "The first 8 games of 2018 when Green was 100% healthy Boyd had 49 receptions for 620 yards and 5 tds."

It's not that he's not good enough, he is.  It's that as you put it there weren't any weapons around him.
Witha healthy green, Ross and if Higgens is as good as we hope he is there are going to be a lot of mouths to feed.
I just don't see how he puts up 90 catches and 1000 yards again unless he some how emerges as receiver 1 and I don't think that'll happen.
I don't care about the numbers Fred posted. It's to small of a sample size that does account for otheraother injured players weapons available at the time.  If we're going to do that then why not just assume Ross will do what he did in last year first 2 games all season long.  Then what?  Are Ross green and Boyd all having 1200 yard seasons?
Probably not and if I'm gambling on all three making a full season I'm guessing boyd finishes third out of those three statisticly and that's not even accounting for Higgens.




Edit: damn this team has some talent at receiver right now. Hope they can all stay healthy and the line comes together. If so this team might surprise everyone outside Cincinnati

(05-24-2020, 12:16 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: The very team that Ross is currently on the roster happens to be the same team that he was on under Marvin, and we saw a very different Ross under ZT than Marv. 

Hmm, Ross under ZT

1. looked good in week 1
2. scored a glorious TD in week 2 when we were down by 60 points and there was 3 seconds left in the game
3. balled out to almost give Burrow to the Dolphins and set our franchise back 15 years


At least in 2018 we could squint and pretend Ross was some sort of TD-scoring maniac. ZT hasn't exactly pounded the table to get Ross a long-term deal yet, but I guess 2020 will give us the answers because the first time Ross botches a route Burrow sends him on he's gonna be toast in the eyes of the fanbase.