(08-01-2020, 05:46 PM)felis tigris Wrote: You're very much correct in noting that TB is a major health issue globally.  And it is transmitted via airborne droplets.

The big difference in terms of response is the rate of transmission.  SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19) has a much higher transmission rate than the bacterium that causes TB.  TB is only active is 5%-10% of the people infected and usually takes 1 to 2 years to produce symptoms (although it can be much longer than that).  Consequently, while TB is a pervasive issue for humanity, particularly in countries with high levels of poverty and lower levels of access to medical care, it doesn't have the potential to "crash" health systems the way COVID-19 can, even in countries with robust medical infrastructure.  When the system is "crashed," the case fatality rate for everything goes up dramatically, as we saw earlier this year in Italy, Spain and NYC.

It really isn't about agenda; TB only causes 9,000 to 10,000 deaths per year in the US.  It's about keeping keeping our health system in a position where that remains the case.

EDIT:  Sorry to go PnR there - I don't have enough posts to be allowed to chime in there, so I couldn't resist.  On topic, just given the issues that MLB is having, once teams start travelling (even if they're able to get through "pre-season"), I suspect this is going to go pear-shaped as well.

Glad you chimed in with a good respectful post that made me think. This is what I like to see from posters.

(08-01-2020, 02:15 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I'll give you less travel and more time between games but the less interaction I'd have to disagree with. Larger rosters and larger coaching staffs so more guys standing closer together plus baseball and basketball at most would have 2 guys close to each other on any given play, in the NFL the O-line and D-line are always in physical contact with each other not too mention the ball carrier being tackled by one or more guys each play. There is a lot more up close interaction in football then any other sport.

The big issue with baseball is constant changing of teams and personal plus everyday play.. nfl will be more controlled within groups. Also with the week gap will also be able to control spread 

(08-01-2020, 04:05 PM)Mer Wrote: No. I think there is a virus and that unfortunately has made people sick/die as most viruses do. I don't believe it's what the media is making it out to be. TB killed 1.5 million people world wide in 2018.It's an airborne disease. Why aren't we wearing masks to prevent TB infections? 

WHO 2018 article:

A total of 1.5 million people died from TB in 2018 (including 251 000 people with HIV). Worldwide, TB is one of the top 10 causes of death and the leading cause from a single infectious agent (above HIV/AIDS). In 2018, an estimated 10 million people fell ill with tuberculosis(TB) worldwide.

According to the CDC in regards to tuberculosis ;


Airborne. Spread from person to person through the air.



1.5 mill worldwide deaths and
Up to 13 million: estimated number of people in the United States living with latent TB infection

Again...
Why aren't we wearing masks for TB?

It doesn't fit they're agenda.

Because we don’t have 4M cases of active TB. When we treat someone we active TB we wear N95 masks.

I would think a biological MD/science teacher would know the answer to such a simple question.

(08-01-2020, 05:46 PM)felis tigris Wrote: You're very much correct in noting that TB is a major health issue globally.  And it is transmitted via airborne droplets.

The big difference in terms of response is the rate of transmission.  SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19) has a much higher transmission rate than the bacterium that causes TB.  TB is only active is 5%-10% of the people infected and usually takes 1 to 2 years to produce symptoms (although it can be much longer than that).  Consequently, while TB is a pervasive issue for humanity, particularly in countries with high levels of poverty and lower levels of access to medical care, it doesn't have the potential to "crash" health systems the way COVID-19 can, even in countries with robust medical infrastructure.  When the system is "crashed," the case fatality rate for everything goes up dramatically, as we saw earlier this year in Italy, Spain and NYC.

It really isn't about agenda; TB only causes 9,000 to 10,000 deaths per year in the US.  It's about keeping keeping our health system in a position where that remains the case.

EDIT:  Sorry to go PnR there - I don't have enough posts to be allowed to chime in there, so I couldn't resist.  On topic, just given the issues that MLB is having, once teams start travelling (even if they're able to get through "pre-season"), I suspect this is going to go pear-shaped as well.

Accurate health information is neither political or religious. And thanks for the info.

(08-01-2020, 06:14 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Nice post.


I don't think he means to Tiger Teeth. It just has affected you way more. Sucks is all we know. 

It is not a hoax as Mer here said. It just seems politically led and we need to ask why we treated other sicknesses and viruses
different. We shouldn't downplay when other people die from another illness, don't you agree?

You are one of my favorite people on this board, so don't be offended by my post Tiger Teeth.

I don't believe it's a hoax as folks keep coining me with. I think it's politically driven and the media is over playing it all to scare us into submission. 

(08-01-2020, 05:46 PM)felis tigris Wrote: You're very much correct in noting that TB is a major health issue globally.  And it is transmitted via airborne droplets.

The big difference in terms of response is the rate of transmission.  SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19) has a much higher transmission rate than the bacterium that causes TB.  TB is only active is 5%-10% of the people infected and usually takes 1 to 2 years to produce symptoms (although it can be much longer than that).  Consequently, while TB is a pervasive issue for humanity, particularly in countries with high levels of poverty and lower levels of access to medical care, it doesn't have the potential to "crash" health systems the way COVID-19 can, even in countries with robust medical infrastructure.  When the system is "crashed," the case fatality rate for everything goes up dramatically, as we saw earlier this year in Italy, Spain and NYC.

It really isn't about agenda; TB only causes 9,000 to 10,000 deaths per year in the US.  It's about keeping keeping our health system in a position where that remains the case.

EDIT:  Sorry to go PnR there - I don't have enough posts to be allowed to chime in there, so I couldn't resist.  On topic, just given the issues that MLB is having, once teams start travelling (even if they're able to get through "pre-season"), I suspect this is going to go pear-shaped as well.

Thank you for the respectful response and insight. We're not all going to agree about things but it's nice to have adult conversations and not be told, "shut up and wear the mask".

(08-01-2020, 10:36 PM)Mer Wrote: I don't believe it's a hoax as folks keep coining me with. I think it's politically driven and the media is over playing it all to scare us into submission. 

And the rest of the world just went along with it? To what end would a country like Italy for example “over play” it?

(08-01-2020, 09:40 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Because we don’t have 4M cases of active TB. When we treat someone we active TB we wear N95 masks.

I would think a biological MD/science teacher would know the answer to such a simple question.

True. According to the CDC we have 13M latent cases. God forbid it should all start affecting those folks at the same time.

(08-01-2020, 10:39 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: And the rest of the world just went along with it? To what end would a country like Italy for example “over play” it?

There are actually countries out there that didn't change things and they have developed herd immunity there, but you won't hear about that on the news. It doesn't raise their ratings to report positive news. Unfortunately, as most people already know, it attacks older folks and those with compromised immune systems just as other viruses do. Are we going to shut down schools and businesses now every time a new virus comes along?

(08-01-2020, 10:36 PM)Mer Wrote: I don't believe it's a hoax as folks keep coining me with. I think it's politically driven and the media is over playing it all to scare us into submission. 

Submission to what? Social distancing? Wearing a cloth face covering?

(08-01-2020, 10:42 PM)Mer Wrote: True. According to the CDC we have 13M latent cases. God forbid it should all start affecting those folks at the same time.

Well, you’re question was why don’t we wear masks for TB. The answer is we do. We definitely do. We wear N95 masks when around active TB. Latent TB isn’t contagious and that’s why there isn’t a need for masks when around people with latent TB.

Latent TB does affecting all 13M of those patients because they are infected, but they just don’t have active TB and aren’t capable of transmitting it to others through normal everyday contact at school or work. The chance of latent TB becoming active TB is roughly 5-10% over their lifetime. So the chance of 13M cases of latent TB becoming active TB at the same time is nominal. Or so low that we can completely ignore that infinitesimal chance. But, (god forbid), they did (which they won’t) then we would need to wear masks. And not just surgical masks, but N95 masks designed to prevent infection from TB.

Additionally, unlike Covid 19, we can offer patients with latent TB antibiotic prophylaxis to reduce that 5-10% chance of developing active TB to as close to 0% as possible.

All of this information is readily available and easy to understand for any science teacher. If that biological MD/science teacher really was a science teacher. So why do I need to keep explaining all this science stuff to you? Because I get this distinct and strong feeling that you don’t understand it.

(08-01-2020, 10:51 PM)Mer Wrote: There are actually countries out there that didn't change things and they have developed herd immunity there, but you won't hear about that on the news. It doesn't raise their ratings to report positive news.

What countries have achieved herd immunity for Covid 19?

Quote:Unfortunately, as most people already know, it attacks older folks and those with compromised immune systems just as other viruses do. Are we going to shut down schools and businesses now every time a new virus comes along?

What about measles, mumps, rubella, polio, chicken pox, fifths disease, rosella; do those usually affect older adults?

And, yes, diseases like polio closed schools down in the past. We don’t need to close schools for every new virus. That depends upon its virulence.

(08-01-2020, 10:51 PM)Mer Wrote: There are actually countries out there that didn't change things and they have developed herd immunity there, but you won't hear about that on the news

Link?

(08-01-2020, 06:09 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Plenty of backlash and you are always calling for links when it is all over your face biting you on the nose lol

I honestly have not heard a large outcry to shut down the NFL season.  All I have heard is people complaining about the large outcry to shut down the NFL season.

If it is "all over the place" why can't you post some links?

(08-01-2020, 04:13 PM)Mer Wrote: Since I cut my cable 2 years ago and even then didn't watch Fox News will you please educate me on what makes real media?

You are the one who used the term.  So you explain to me.

I don't know where you get your info, but you parrott the exact same speaking points Fox News trains it followers to use.

(08-02-2020, 03:04 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: All of this information is readily available and easy to understand for any science teacher. If that biological MD/science teacher really was a science teacher. So why do I need to keep explaining all this science stuff to you? Because I get this distinct and strong feeling that you don’t understand it.

Well he doesn't get it from "the media"

This is ridiculous. How can you downplay one of the worst pandemics killing people by the thousands? I don't understand the logic.

(08-01-2020, 10:36 PM)Mer Wrote: I don't believe it's a hoax as folks keep coining me with. I think it's politically driven and the media is over playing it all to scare us into submission. 

So the media from Europe, Asia, South & Central America, Middle East, and Africa are joined at the hip in over playing it to help all these governments scare us humans into submission? 

Cool story if true.

(08-02-2020, 01:12 PM)Millhouse Wrote: So the media from Europe, Asia, South & Central America, Middle East, and Africa are joined at the hip in over playing it to help all these governments scare us humans into submission? 

Cool story if true.

Of course.

Can't you see the huge benefit they all get from destroying their own economies?

Obviously it is all worth a worlwide financial crisis if they can get us to wear masks in public places and stay six feet away from each other.  If you don't understand that then you have been brainwashed byt the media.

And, oh yeah, the "media" does not include the #1 most popular news network in America.

It all makes perfect sense.


SUBMISSION!!!

(08-02-2020, 03:22 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: What countries have achieved herd immunity for Covid 19?

Right...and I recently saw an article from the Mayo Clinic that estimated that 70% of the US population would have to get and recover from COVID-19 in order to develop a herd immunity. If that number is even close to being accurate, you're talking about millions of deaths potentially. The idea that the US should purposely try to develop a herd immunity at this point is an incredibly dangerous and irresponsible idea.

I'm really confused by this line of thinking, especially if the goal is to have as few deaths as possible while fighting this virus. I don't really talk about this topic at all on the board, but some notions are just so out there, at least IMO, it makes it hard not to respond.