(10-11-2020, 10:26 PM)samhain Wrote: Yes are coaches are bad and yes our rookie quarterback needs to learn to stop holding onto the ball so long.  Both are big problems.  Even so, I'm still of the belief that the majority of our offensive issues stem from the line (no shit, right?)

Knowing that we have an assortment of bad to awful players (with the exception of maybe Jonah and Trey), and 11 games left to play, what's left that can be done to fix this in the short term?  The guys we need to replace the right side likely aren't out on the street to sign.  The Bengals have a rookie quarterback to keep in one piece, and the guys are just not getting it done.

The best I can manage to come up with is a renewed commitment to the run a-la Paul Brown.  Let the guys up front attack more instead of retreating to pass protect all the time.  Use the running back you invested in this offseason.  Run the hell out of him, Gio and whoever else they want to throw out there.  Get a fullback.  I keep hearing how antiquated that concept is, but the team that just beat the shit out of us seems to value it enough.

This empty backfield, five-wide nonsense ain't it.  Not with our personnel.  They need more than the five guys up front to survive the blitzing that will come at them for the rest of the season.  

Run it, run it, run it, then run it some more.  They might even get decent enough at it to make opposing defenses think twice about the blitz.  If they can't then they'll se a lot of games that will look a lot like this afternoon's debacle.  

Hakeem Adenji and Fred Johnson aren't saviors any more than Price or Redmond were.  Switch up the offensive strategy for the duration of the season and then retool when the offseason gets here if you want to go pass-heavy again.

Agreed, and NE likes FBs too. As to the 5 wide stuff, apparently Joe likes it because it enables him to get a better read when it spreads the defense out. We're in quite the conundrum with a rookie learning, and shit for olinemen. 

Pray for some injuries to Hart Redmond and Jordan. Only way they'll make a change.

(10-12-2020, 12:44 AM)Jhowdy54 Wrote: Pray for some injuries to Hart Redmond and Jordan. Only way they'll make a change.

Get a grip.

(10-12-2020, 12:17 AM)Wyche Wrote: Agreed, and NE likes FBs too. As to the 5 wide stuff, apparently Joe likes it because it enables him to get a better read when it spreads the defense out. We're in quite the conundrum with a rookie learning, and shit for olinemen. 

Man, when you look at this o-line:

Jonah - He's looked rough at times, but it's way to early to make any judgement on him. 
Jordan - Gets pushed around and beaten off the snap a lot! I know he's still very young and 4th rder, but damn.
Hopkins - Decent and serviceable, but I don't know that he'll ever be much more than that.
Redmund - Has always been pretty bad, got cut and brought back, still not very good. 
Hart - There are just too many times the guy looks completely lost / confused out there in pass pro. 

Price - A complete bust that has continued to get worse, and is pathetic in pass protection.
XSF - Got injured early, so jury's still out, but the only FA addition to the line has been mediocre, at best, in his career.
Big Fred - A disaster at G, and can't unseat Hart at RT. Maybe a career backup who's never good enough to start?
Adeniji - Don't really know what we have in him. By all accounts, he has promise, but is still a 6th rd pick.

The lack of overall talent and potential in this group frightening. LG, RG and RT all have to be addressed this off-season, IMO.

Interested to see how Jonah grades out for this one. He looked terrible to my eye test.

I feel a big 250# plus back is what this team lacks. Bring in a true fullback as well and pound it all day. Drive block and pick up 3-4 yards per carry with a RB the size of a small lineman. With the trend going to smaller, faster LBs maybe a big boy to carry the load is what we need. Get them used to the pounding and then throw in some shiftyness with Mixon and Geo. Eventually the play-action would work as well.

If XSF is healthy, perhaps it's time to bench MJ again and put him at LG. He's not superstar, but he's something. I'm not sure when we get to the "see what we have" phase of the year, but I would be we see Adenji or Fred at T before it's all said and done. I hope one of them surprises us.

(10-12-2020, 01:59 AM)samhain Wrote: If XSF is healthy, perhaps it's time to bench MJ again and put him at LG. He's not superstar, but he's something. I'm not sure when we get to the "see what we have" phase of the year, but I would be we see Adenji or Fred at T before it's all said and done. I hope one of them surprises us.

It’s hard to believe Jordan is so bad. You’d think with his size even mediocre technique would be enough to make him serviceable.

(10-12-2020, 02:04 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: It’s hard to believe Jordan is so bad. You’d think with his size even mediocre technique would be enough to make him serviceable.

I think he's miscast as a starter.  He was developmental pick intended to learn behind Boling, then Boling retired and made him a starter.  I feel like he just got welcomed into the league the hard way and never caught up.  Word was that he needed to add strength when he came out of school, and maybe he still does.

(10-12-2020, 12:48 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: Man, when you look at this o-line:

Jonah - He's looked rough at times, but it's way to early to make any judgement on him. 
Jordan - Gets pushed around and beaten off the snap a lot! I know he's still very young and 4th rder, but damn.
Hopkins - Decent and serviceable, but I don't know that he'll ever be much more than that.
Redmund - Has always been pretty bad, got cut and brought back, still not very good. 
Hart - There are just too many times the guy looks completely lost / confused out there in pass pro. 

Price - A complete bust that has continued to get worse, and is pathetic in pass protection.
XSF - Got injured early, so jury's still out, but the only FA addition to the line has been mediocre, at best, in his career.
Big Fred - A disaster at G, and can't unseat Hart at RT. Maybe a career backup who's never good enough to start?
Adeniji - Don't really know what we have in him. By all accounts, he has promise, but is still a 6th rd pick.

The lack of overall talent and potential in this group frightening. LG, RG and RT all have to be addressed this off-season, IMO.

Yeah, it's very scary. The talent is worse than subpar. It's hard to evaluate anything, or establish anything offensively when your line is this bad. Every week is simply survival mode. You should watch FSU, same damn thing. If I didn't watch two teams with the exact same struggles, I might be as harsh on RBs, coaches, QBs, etc as other posters are....but I get to watch this trainwreck TWICE every weekend.  FSU has had THREE coaching staffs since 2017, and it's the SAME RESULTS. 

Burrow's internal reaction after playing 5 games behind this line...

(10-12-2020, 02:28 AM)Wyche Wrote: Yeah, it's very scary. The talent is worse than subpar. It's hard to evaluate anything, or establish anything offensively when your line is this bad. Every week is simply survival mode. You should watch FSU, same damn thing. If I didn't watch two teams with the exact same struggles, I might be as harsh on RBs, coaches, QBs, etc as other posters are....but I get to watch this trainwreck TWICE every weekend.  FSU has had THREE coaching staffs since 2017, and it's the SAME RESULTS. 

Damn, and it's been since what, 2016/17 here as well? I swear, if the front office/coaches do next to nothing about the o-line and then say it will be fine AGAIN this off-season...

(10-12-2020, 02:29 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: Burrow's internal reaction after playing 5 games behind this line...

He should Belsnickel them all at Xmas time. Impish! All of you!

(10-12-2020, 02:38 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: He should Belsnickel them all at Xmas time. Impish! All of you!

I think each lineman should have to take 50 snaps behind the rest of the line against all out pressure from 15 defenders in practice, so they can get a feel for what they are subjecting their rookie QB to. 

(10-12-2020, 02:47 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: I think each lineman should have to take 50 snaps behind the rest of the line against all out pressure from 15 defenders in practice, so they can get a feel for what they are subjecting their rookie QB to. 

And afterwards lock them in a room and make them binge watch Two Broke Girls.

(10-12-2020, 02:51 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: And afterwards lock them in a room and make them binge watch Two Broke Girls.

(10-12-2020, 02:36 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: Damn, and it's been since what, 2016/17 here as well? I swear, if the front office/coaches do next to nothing about the o-line and then say it will be fine AGAIN this off-season...

Yep.... I'm stuck on Groundhog Day....twice every weekend!

(10-12-2020, 12:48 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: Man, when you look at this o-line:

Jonah - He's looked rough at times, but it's way to early to make any judgement on him. 
Jordan - Gets pushed around and beaten off the snap a lot! I know he's still very young and 4th rder, but damn.
Hopkins - Decent and serviceable, but I don't know that he'll ever be much more than that.
Redmund - Has always been pretty bad, got cut and brought back, still not very good. 
Hart - There are just too many times the guy looks completely lost / confused out there in pass pro. 

Price - A complete bust that has continued to get worse, and is pathetic in pass protection.
XSF - Got injured early, so jury's still out, but the only FA addition to the line has been mediocre, at best, in his career.
Big Fred - A disaster at G, and can't unseat Hart at RT. Maybe a career backup who's never good enough to start?
Adeniji - Don't really know what we have in him. By all accounts, he has promise, but is still a 6th rd pick.

The lack of overall talent and potential in this group frightening. LG, RG and RT all have to be addressed this off-season, IMO.