(11-12-2020, 09:46 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: That's 5 examples in the span on 16 years. We've done it 5 times now in one season (Mike Daniels, Xavier Williams, Margus Hunt, Quinton Spain, Takk McKinley).

If you want yo count every scrub that never amounted to anything I could come up with dozens of more waiver wire signings and low level trades during the Marvin era.

This team is making more moves because it is desperate.  We are in the middle of a stretch that I am guessing is the worst in the history of the team.  I'd have to go back and look, but I doubt that even in the dark days of the '90's we ever went 24 games with only 4 wins.

When you suck this bad you have to make more moves.  It cracks me up that in the middle of this nightmare some fans still try to act like it is better now than during the Marvin era.

(11-11-2020, 06:27 PM)Joelist Wrote: Could blow up in their faces  - locker room issues. Or could be a massive steal. I'm hoping for steal.

More importantly we had better not see MJ back out there at LG against the Stealers. We have Spain so play him!

I don't like, of course, how he bitched his was out of Atlanta (and they couldn't swing a trade for ANYTHING), but I view him as more of an OLB in a 3-4 hybrid defense that is what they wanted Dunlap to become.  This could be the square peg meets the square hole kind of thing...I can hope.  

(11-12-2020, 09:59 AM)fredtoast Wrote: If you want yo count every scrub that never amounted to anything I could come up with dozens of more waiver wire signings and low level trades during the Marvin era.

This team is making more moves because it is desperate.  We are in the middle of a stretch that I am guessing is the worst in the history of the team.  I'd have to go back and look, but I doubt that even in the dark days of the '90's we ever went 24 games with only 4 wins.

When you suck this bad you have to make more moves.  It cracks me up that in the middle of this nightmare some fans still try to act like it is better now than during the Marvin era.

Well regardless of what we think, Marvin is gone. So you don't have to defend him anymore. We are where we are and I'm happy that our FO is making an attempt to improve. Zac's first year was a disaster but that was largely with the team that Marvin left behind. Also, we can't really get that mad about how bad that season was because even 1 more win means we lose Burrow.

Hopefully, we get better this season, which it appears as though we are. We currently are 4-19-1 under Taylor. The worst 2 season stretch was in 1993 to 1994, where they went 6-26 under Dave Shula. If we can win 2 more games, he will not be the worst 2 season stretch in Bengals history but obviously, we are hoping for more. I think we could win as many as 5 more games this year or as little as 2. 

If Taylor does go, however, I hope the front office continues to spend on free agents like they have been. Because that's what nearly every other NFL team does.

(11-11-2020, 09:01 PM)bfine32 Wrote: This is something I never understood and asked the same question after we traded Carlos to Seattle and he couldn't go.

If ATL had traveled to play Pittsburgh this week then Tak would have been OK Covid wise. Why is he not OK just because he changed teams? 

They have tests. 

Because when they are cut they are no longer bound by team rules, no longer being tested every day.  When they travel to the new team they are travelling commercially not the private charter of the team.  All that gives a player at least a 2 day window for exposure 

(11-11-2020, 10:35 PM)jfkbengals Wrote: Very underwhelming for a 1st round pick.

Not to the John Ross level, but underwhelming nonetheless.

He'll definitely provide better depth, but he's not going to be a Pro-Bowler.

Reggie Nelson was traded for by the Jags for a 7th round pick (I believe) and he became a Pro Bowler.  He was asked to play differently than he was here and it wasn't to his strengths.   I don't know enough about the Falcon's defense to know what he did there, but PFF had him between 61 and 69 (this year).  I am hoping he is the 3-4 OLB with speed we have been looking for but didn't have.  

And I know he ins't likely to become a Pro Bowler, but if he shines the rest of the season as a great fit for this defense, you just saved a potentially very high draft pick for another position like OT, G, or DT.  

(11-12-2020, 12:05 AM)Yojimbo Wrote: I hope he’s ok with playing in Cincy. Since the draft, he’s talked about wanting to play close to home, Oakland. That was one of his issues with Atlanta. Finding out SF put in a claim on him and then he ends up in Ohio, probably isn’t going to help.

I don’t think playing for a contract is going to motivate him to be great here, he was in the same scenario in Atlanta and it didn’t motivate me there.

Interesting stuff.  I didn't realize that.  Part of me can empathize with the guy, but how many guys get to play in their hometown?  Good info, though.  

(11-12-2020, 10:25 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Interesting stuff.  I didn't realize that.  Part of me can empathize with the guy, but how many guys get to play in their hometown?  Good info, though.  

He was actually close because the 49ers put in a claim but the Bengals are higher on the waiver wire.

(11-12-2020, 01:39 AM)bengaloo Wrote: We need help rushing the passer and Takk has 17.5 sacks in 4 seasons compared to Hunt's 7.5 sacks in 8 seasons. This is a good mid-season move no doubt. A change of scenery might do him good.

Dunlap shmunlap. He didnt want to be a Bengal or he would be. It's addition by subtraction for players that dont want to play on their team. I'm over it. We have Takk now so Wecome Takkarist McKinley

Although they had corresponding moves, I don't see Takk as a replacement for Hunt.  He is more an additional outside LB that can rush the passer.  a 3-4 alignment (even the so-called hybrid) didn't suit Dunlap as well as it does Takk.  

The old saying of "you can't have enough CBs" also works for guys that can rush the passer.  We may see more of Hunt and Hubbard playing inside on passing downs (which is odd to say, as first down is really a passing down any more as well) and a rotation of Lawson and Takk playing outside.  

(11-12-2020, 04:31 AM)BritishBengal Wrote: Not everything in life has to be connected or premeditated. Takk just represents FO picking up a player with value. It doesn't have to say anything about Dunlap, Hunt or any personnel move. Takk is 25, has averaged around 6 sacks a year and although he hasnt matched his draft position, he is still solid and young. When you are top of the waiver claim list, you have to use it.

They were ahead of Cleveland, San Fran, and the other team that put in claims, but at this point of the season, it goes by record this year and not last year.  The Bengals are no longer the top of the waiver claim, but in this case, they were still first among those putting in a claim.  Happy they got him and hope he balls out.  

(11-11-2020, 11:53 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Playing like we didn't get any better by beating a 1 loss team while being a 1 win team aside:

We didn't get any worse and Seattle didn't get any better. 

We had no choice but to trade Dunlap after our coaching staff decided to change the scheme after we had a losing record. They treated Carlos like garbage (should have made better decisions last off season so they could have traded him and got a lot more), Carlos got mad and then his public actions made it a no brainer to trade him. I wish Carlos well.

As for the simpleton 1 game analysis it is absurd to evaluate a trade/waiver wire move after one week. The Seattle pass defense was on pace to be the  worst in NFL history. The defense is not a player, it is a unit. Looking at stats, Dunlap has better DE stats of any DE (not saying a whole lot) for any game this year. So, yes Seattle defense that sucked prior to his arrival still sucks. But look at his stats and tell me he made them worse. Youc can't.

Carlos is a good guy and eas a good player for us. Let's see if young Takk can do here the next 10 years what Carlos did here before we annoint him, on other hand, I am glad we grabbed him as low risk pick up and a move we seemed to shy away from in the past,

I wish Carlos greatness in Seattle and Takk greatness here. The two of them are not enemies, but some seem to be pitting them against each other, Both have a clean slate, let's see over the next few years (not 1 game) how it pans out.

(11-12-2020, 10:29 AM)Synric Wrote: He was actually close because the 49ers put in a claim but the Bengals are higher on the waiver wire.

I get very confused on all of this stuff. But, he is in year 4 so I thought he was a free agent and could sign with any team, his choice and not a waiver pick up. But, guess I misunderstood. How many years does a guy play prior to being no longer subject to waivers if cut?

(11-12-2020, 09:59 AM)fredtoast Wrote: If you want yo count every scrub that never amounted to anything I could come up with dozens of more waiver wire signings and low level trades during the Marvin era.

This team is making more moves because it is desperate.  We are in the middle of a stretch that I am guessing is the worst in the history of the team.  I'd have to go back and look, but I doubt that even in the dark days of the '90's we ever went 24 games with only 4 wins.

When you suck this bad you have to make more moves.  It cracks me up that in the middle of this nightmare some fans still try to act like it is better now than during the Marvin era.

Since you mentioned it, I went and looked it up. The Bengals went 4-20 in 1998-1999. Beginning in Week 7 of 1998, the went 1-10 the rest of the season. In 1999, they started off 1-10 before reeling off three straight victories. The 24 game period you mentioned ended in Week 14 of 1999, right after the second win of the three game win streak. 

(11-12-2020, 10:25 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Interesting stuff.  I didn't realize that.  Part of me can empathize with the guy, but how many guys get to play in their hometown?  Good info, though.  

Not many, but we have a couple in Huber and Hubbard.

(11-12-2020, 10:36 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Although they had corresponding moves, I don't see Takk as a replacement for Hunt.  He is more an additional outside LB that can rush the passer.  a 3-4 alignment (even the so-called hybrid) didn't suit Dunlap as well as it does Takk.  

The old saying of "you can't have enough CBs" also works for guys that can rush the passer.  We may see more of Hunt and Hubbard playing inside on passing downs (which is odd to say, as first down is really a passing down any more as well) and a rotation of Lawson and Takk playing outside.  

Right.... What people seem to be forgetting is that when they brought Margus back, it is as a DT and he is playing inside due to the total devastation at that position this year. They brought Margus in to push the pocket backwards, not to rush from end like his last stint here. 

As for Carlos, if people can't remember and be honest about his propensity to take plays off, then they are just blocking it. There were 2 totally different and distinct Carlos Dunlaps on the field, one was a game wrecker and the other just stood up and acted like he was trying to do something. 

(11-12-2020, 10:48 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: We had no choice but to trade Dunlap after our coaching staff decided to change the scheme after we had a losing record. They treated Carlos like garbage (should have made better decisions last off season so they could have traded him and got a lot more), Carlos got mad and then his public actions made it a no brainer to trade him. I wish Carlos well.

As for the simpleton 1 game analysis it is absurd to evaluate a trade/waiver wire move after one week. The Seattle pass defense was on pace to be the  worst in NFL history. The defense is not a player, it is a unit. Looking at stats, Dunlap has better DE stats of any DE (not saying a whole lot) for any game this year. So, yes Seattle defense that sucked prior to his arrival still sucks. But look at his stats and tell me he made them worse. Youc can't.

Carlos is a good guy and eas a good player for us. Let's see if young Takk can do here the next 10 years what Carlos did here before we annoint him, on other hand, I am glad we grabbed him as low risk pick up and a move we seemed to shy away from in the past,

I wish Carlos greatness in Seattle and Takk greatness here. The two of them are not enemies, but some seem to be pitting them against each other, Both have a clean slate, let's see over the next few years (not 1 game) how it pans out.

Hey I agree and told dude the same thing. But we have some folks evaluating it after 0 weeks.


oh....Carlos can kick rocks

(11-12-2020, 10:08 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Well regardless of what we think, Marvin is gone. So you don't have to defend him anymore.

I never mention him unless a hater brings him up.

(11-12-2020, 09:48 AM)fredtoast Wrote: This is 100% bullshit.  Throughout his career Dunlap was always very good against the run.

Not every player that is durable takes plays off.  And Dunlap did not get selected to PFF All-Decade team by taking plays off.

"One of the most underrated players of his generation, Carlos Dunlap has been a consistently excellent player in the NFL for the entire decade," PFF analyst Sam Monson wrote "Drafted in 2010, Dunlap has never had an overall PFF grade below 70.0. That comes on the back of nine straight seasons with 45 or more total pressures, topping out with 80 back in 2015 when he, along with most of the Bengals, enjoyed career seasons. Dunlap has been an impressive run defender and pass rusher"

Hey, don't tell me, tell that to Dan Hoard. He and Lapham are the ones who were discussing it on their podcast after Dunlap was traded. I didn't make up what Dunlap said nor did I embellish their take on it.

Sorry, but, Dunlap gave half assed effort last year until the half way mark and again this year was half assing it. While Marvin was here, Dunlap tried and was kept in line. With the new staff, he went off the rails. That's not me saying that. That is from the local beat reporters and people directly associated with the team.

Do you even listen to these podcasts from the local beat reporters and broadcasters who work in the organization? They are some on literally daily and others several times a week. If you listened to all of these things you wouldn't have the same perspective on a lot of your takes.

(11-12-2020, 11:55 AM)PDub80 Wrote: Hey, don't tell me, tell that to Dan Hoard. He and Lapham are the ones who were discussing it on their podcast after Dunlap was traded. I didn't make up what Dunlap said nor did I embellish their take on it.

Sorry, but, Dunlap gave half assed effort last year until the half way mark and again this year was half assing it. While Marvin was here, Dunlap tried and was kept in line. With the new staff, he went off the rails. That's not me saying that. That is from the local beat reporters and people directly associated with the team.

Do you even listen to these podcasts from the local beat reporters and broadcasters who work in the organization? They are some on literally daily and others several times a week. If you listened to all of these things you wouldn't have the same perspective on a lot of your takes.

I agree with what you say about Dunlap over the last year.  But when you talk about "how he managed to make it this long in the league" you are talking about his entire career instead of just the last year.

As for the local reporters I do pay attention to them.  They run the gamut from homers like Hobson to hates like Daugherty.  They don't always agree and they have different players they like and dislike.  You can pick and choose whatever opinion you want to believe.

(11-12-2020, 09:56 AM)jason Wrote: It's amazing how some of us have rewritten history when it comes to Dunlap. Apparently he was a lazy, greedy, selfish, locker room cancer the entire time he was here.

I think where that comes from is that was a knock on him coming into the draft. I never saw it on the field until this season. I do recall seeing him track down a play 40 or more yards down the field from the DE position. You don't do that by not hustling. For most of his time here, he was very solid to good. It was just time to move on.

Edit: he was pretty bad the first half of last season too, but if memory serves, that was due to playing thru an injury. He was better after the bye.

(11-12-2020, 09:48 AM)fredtoast Wrote: This is 100% bullshit.  Throughout his career Dunlap was always very good against the run.

Not every player that is durable takes plays off.  And Dunlap did not get selected to PFF All-Decade team by taking plays off.

"One of the most underrated players of his generation, Carlos Dunlap has been a consistently excellent player in the NFL for the entire decade," PFF analyst Sam Monson wrote "Drafted in 2010, Dunlap has never had an overall PFF grade below 70.0. That comes on the back of nine straight seasons with 45 or more total pressures, topping out with 80 back in 2015 when he, along with most of the Bengals, enjoyed career seasons. Dunlap has been an impressive run defender and pass rusher"

Wait, aren't you the one who always criticizes PFF individual grades saying they are crap? Or is that only when it doesn't say what you want it to say?