(12-20-2020, 03:44 PM)Destro Wrote: I remember hearing some sports talk show mention that people were looking for "anyone who had a cup of coffee with Sean McVay." Rams flashed and we picked out a "who is he" guy from their team. The proof is that he did not make the team any better.

"No body" is a stretch, but when it comes to true, blue chip coaches, Cincy is not that attractive, as the same for players. It was Parcells who had some quote about making the dinner and having some decisions when it came to the groceries. A team that didn't let Marvin Lewis, second only the Bill Belichick in NFL tenure, get some things he wanted, is telling. The small market of Cincy, with the reputation it has ( deserved or not ), may get some interest, but not the star power. Think the likes of Andy Reid, Sean Payton, Bruce Arians, Jon Gruden would even look at a job here?

Oh, they have Burrow. Coming back from a knee injury. And we can do whatever comparisons you like, but we just don't know how that may be going forward. A dumpster fire of an O-line, bad defense, family ownership that despite what you think, may only draft who they want. Small scouting department to help, and no matter how much we suck, they may not be motivated to make changes ( just like now ). FA tend to avoid this place. And before mentioning players who you have to google to find when they were a decent player, find where they were a top 20 prospect and they choose Cincy. When players say they want to go somewhere else and play for a winner or compete for a championship, that does not mean coming here.

Want a great coach? Convince them you will do whatever it takes to make the team great. When has Cincinnati done that? Even in the last few weeks? Falling into the #1OA pick in the draft is not that, BTW.

Spot. On.

(12-20-2020, 07:41 PM)bfine32 Wrote: You accidentally cut off my post before it got to the question posed. So I cannot blame you for not answering it. 

Development came because he got better and led a team to the Super Bowl. 

I get it; you're mad that Zac is still our coach and the crappy job he's done to date., But none of your anger changes the fact that Zac was an "en vogue" hire when the Bengals took him and I assert another hot prospect would take this gig if given the chance.

ZT was an "en vogue" hire to the Bengals only, not anyone else.  Heck, I never even heard of the dude prior to the media speculation that Cincy was pursuing him.  When I looked him up on the web I was shocked at his resume - or should I say lack of resume.  Absolutely zero skins on the wall.  

Did any other team even want to interview the guy?  And don't give me he was coaching in the SB.  Did any other team looking for a new HC that year express an interest?

(12-21-2020, 10:34 AM)Daddy-O Wrote: ZT was an "en vogue" hire to the Bengals only, not anyone else.  Heck, I never even heard of the dude prior to the media speculation that Cincy was pursuing him.  When I looked him up on the web I was shocked at his resume - or should I say lack of resume.  Absolutely zero skins on the wall.  

Did any other team even want to interview the guy?  And don't give me he was coaching in the SB.  Did any other team looking for a new HC that year express an interest?

ZT was a pseudo hot commodity for HC in the sense that multiple teams were going for the younger offensive-minded guy to be their HC.  We skimped a bit by grabbing a QB coach rather than an OC to be our HC, but that wasn't a guarantee of failure.

BUT the thing is, ZT isn't the only one of that crew who is on the hot seat (or should be on it), because Matt Nagy, Anthony Lynn, and Adam Gase are all looking vulnerable and ZT is the least successful and least capable of that group of "get yer McVey" HCs.  It's possible ZT was just the least successful dude in a group of mostly fad-driven hires.  

Many teams and fans in the NFL are constantly operating in the "day late, dollar short" club. It wasn't all that long ago fanbases were saying their team needed to "Get their Dak Prescott in the mid rounds" or "bring in Nick Foles to initiate win-now mode" and last year Ryan Tannehill had people thinking that just getting a re-tread away from a bad situation could be an instant upgrade at a crucial position. This year nothing too wild is going on. You have the Brown getting a new HC and improving by 4+ wins, but it's mostly Andy Reid/Mahommes, Tomlin/Ben, Payton/Brees, Arians/old QB, and so on vying for the top spots.

(12-20-2020, 09:31 AM)BengalChris Wrote: So, because "nobody" wants to come to the Bengals, the fans should have to endure more years of this suck ass coaching staff?

NO!

Taylor has made the team worse, not better. This means the team is further away from a championship than it was two years ago. I guess Mike Brown should just give up on any championship notions for the remaining of his years? He should not.

Further more, coaches do come to the Bengals. You listed several who did and there are several who would come.

With Taylor it was the assistants who said no to working under him. That was a big red flag right there. The quality assistants don't want to work for Boy Wonder. That's pretty clear. Marvin had some good assistants. People wanted to work for him.

Taylor had free rein to bring in the assistants he wants, something Marvin didn't have. He was given the largest free agent budget the Bengals have ever spent. Yet, he still managed to f' it all up.

 

Taylor didn't exactly have the ability to bring in any coach he wanted in 2019, as he was the last HC hired and not until Feb.
But he definitely had the opportunity to replace any of the coaches this past offseason.

(12-21-2020, 10:50 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Taylor didn't exactly have the ability to bring in any coach he wanted in 2019, as he was the last HC hired and not until Feb.
But he definitely had the opportunity to replace any of the coaches this past offseason.

Flores coached in the same SB as Taylor. It's pretty common for guys who are going to be hired for HC jobs to line up their staffs before they are actually hired.

I thought he'd bring some of the Rams guys with him. He didn't. That was kind of telling too.

Taylor became HC Feb 4. Flores was hired Feb 6.

Frank Reich became the Colts HC Feb 11 in the year he was hired.

2 of those guys put together good staffs. 1 hired a staff of his friends and seems to be happy with them.

(12-21-2020, 10:50 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Taylor didn't exactly have the ability to bring in any coach he wanted in 2019, as he was the last HC hired and not until Feb.
But he definitely had the opportunity to replace any of the coaches this past offseason.

if as you say he didnt get who he wanted in 2019 why did he make no changes in 2020

there's an article out stating Marvin is ready to come back to the NFL.

Sitting with millions can get boring fast it seems. Come back to the NFL coach! Not with us though.

(12-21-2020, 11:01 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Flores coached in the same SB as Taylor. It's pretty common for guys who are going to be hired for HC jobs to line up their staffs before they are actually hired.

I thought he'd bring some of the Rams guys with him. He didn't. That was kind of telling too.

Taylor became HC Feb 4. Flores was hired Feb 6.

Frank Reich became the Colts HC Feb 11 in the year he was hired.

2 of those guys put together good staffs. 1 hired a staff of his friends and seems to be happy with them.

Flores was hired on Feb 4. https://www.nfl.com/news/dolphins-announce-hire-of-brian-flores-as-head-coach-0ap3000001016390
I thought he was hired before that, but it definitely wasn't Feb 6.

Remember though, Flores did not have as good of a coaching staff when he first came on.
The team went from 7-9 in 2018 to 5-11 last year.
This past offseason, the following coaches were changed:
- OC (Chad O'Shea to Chan Gailey)
- DC (Patrick Graham to Josh Boyer)

So Flores made the good decision to change out coordinators whereas Taylor didn't.
Also, Flores doesn't also call plays. Taylor chooses to do two roles still. I assume it's because McVay did it and he thinks he can too.
Perhaps Taylor would be a better HC if he gave OC duties to someone else. But at this point, would he?

(12-21-2020, 11:01 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Flores coached in the same SB as Taylor. It's pretty common for guys who are going to be hired for HC jobs to line up their staffs before they are actually hired.

I thought he'd bring some of the Rams guys with him. He didn't. That was kind of telling too.

Taylor became HC Feb 4. Flores was hired Feb 6.

Frank Reich became the Colts HC Feb 11 in the year he was hired.

2 of those guys put together good staffs. 1 hired a staff of his friends and seems to be happy with them.

Not to nitpick but Reich didn't pick his coaching staff.  That was the staff that McDaniels put together before opting out.

There's some validity that if given the choice of any HC gig, CIN would probably be near the bottom.
However, it's still one of 32 spots, so someone would at least be interested in coming in as CIN HC to build their resume before jumping to a bigger franchise.

(12-21-2020, 02:21 PM)ochocincos Wrote: There's some validity that if given the choice of any HC gig, CIN would probably be near the bottom.
However, it's still one of 32 spots, so someone would at least be interested in coming in as CIN HC to build their resume before jumping to a bigger franchise.

AND, if you made it work, got this team to the playoffs and actually WON there, you'd have one of the most excited fanbases in the country at your feet.  Winning a Superbowl in Cincinnati, you'd get a statue made and no one would ever forget your name.  

I'd put the Bengals HC job as high risk, high reward.  Not going to be the easiest HC gig.  There is a mountain to climb.  But if you get to the top, the reward is significant, and I think bigger than with a franchise that has already won Superbowls.  

All of the well run teams are winning. They are not looking for new coaches. So those are not the teams the Bengal will be competing against to hire a new coach.

That being said, there are only 32 NFL head coaching jobs available, and there are dozens of guys dreaming of them. Plenty of guys will be glad to take this job.

Just look at the only four teams that have been outscored by 100 points this year. . .

-The Jets have ONE winning season in the last decade.

-The Jags hove one winning season in the last 13 years. (9 of those 13 years they have won 5 games or fewer)

-The Lions have had 4 winning season in the last 20 years. Their defense is dead last in the NFL (32nd in yards allowed) and on offense their QB is 32, their leading rusher is 35, and their top 2 WRs are both over 30.

-The Broncos have not made the playoffs since winning the Super Bowl in 2015. They can't find a QB and they are not going to have one of the top picks to get one this year.

Bengals is probably the least desirable coaching job in NFL but it is still one of 32 so someone with ability would still want it. Would not be able to compete with a better organization in wooing someone but definitely could attract a good candidate. We have had a number of assistants go on to better things so there definitely is an opportunity to show you can successful. I don't believe for one second that Bengal ownership thinks they cannot attract talent. If anything I think they believe in their approach.

(12-21-2020, 11:01 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Flores coached in the same SB as Taylor. It's pretty common for guys who are going to be hired for HC jobs to line up their staffs before they are actually hired.

I thought he'd bring some of the Rams guys with him. He didn't. That was kind of telling too.

Taylor became HC Feb 4. Flores was hired Feb 6.

Frank Reich became the Colts HC Feb 11 in the year he was hired.

2 of those guys put together good staffs. 1 hired a staff of his friends and seems to be happy with them.

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/dave-hyde/fl-sp-hyde5-dolphins-assistants-20200114-iyigmhl2erevtilsvmup4qeg7e-story.html

Flores overhauled much of the staff his second year.

ZT got stuck with people willing to come to cincinnati and coach on a team whose best offensive player hasn't played in years and best defensive player hasn't done much other than go to Seattle.

How much of it is ZT sticking by his coordinators and how much is mike Brown and family saying 'we paid these coordinators, deal with it'? I honestly don't know. But the constant comparison to flores is apples and oranges.