(01-04-2021, 06:34 PM)Amalone002 Wrote: So many outsiders and fans wanting to change and fire everyone.  

Says alot that Burrow and Boyd, two of our best players don't want a new coach and believe in zac. We need consistency and when you fire coaches too early (see Cleveland) it's hard and the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

I'm alone here but I also agree with Mike browns message and like what we are building.  We need to get healthy and add more free agents which it sounds like they are going to do and will be fine.  

Cleveland fired their 1 yr horrible coach at 6-10, this year they're in the playoffs. Everyone knew they had the talent.

Ever been to a restaurant where everything is immaculate & perfect, year later, place is trashed? the difference, new (bad) manager.

Coach communication in this team is fragmented. The left hand doesnt know what the right is doing. Seems like Zac is too invested in calling  plays and letting the other coaches quasi-independently run the team. McVay always seems in control of the entire team when I compare him with Zac who is too busy thinking about the next play to call.   This method will never work, specially with a green-behind-the-ears HC like Zac. 

GAME OVER.   :paul:

(01-05-2021, 10:50 AM)Bengalitis Wrote: Cleveland fired their 1 yr horrible coach at 6-10, this year they're in the playoffs.  Everyone knew they had the talent.

Ever been to a restaurant where everything is immaculate & perfect, year later, place is trashed? the difference, new (bad) manager.

Coach communication in this team is fragmented. The left hand doesnt know what the right is doing. Seems like Zac is too invested in calling  plays and letting the other coaches quasi-independently run the team. McVay always seems in control of the entire team when I compare him with Zac who is too busy thinking about the next play to call.   This method will never work, specially with a green-behind-the-ears HC like Zac. 

GAME OVER.   :paul:

Not even close to game over.  How many times did Cleveland turn and burn coaches and how many years were they WAY WORSE than us.  I mean cmon.  They did get it right, finally.  That much is very clear.

(01-05-2021, 10:50 AM)Bengalitis Wrote: Cleveland fired their 1 yr horrible coach at 6-10, this year they're in the playoffs.  Everyone knew they had the talent.

Ever been to a restaurant where everything is immaculate & perfect, year later, place is trashed? the difference, new (bad) manager.

Coach communication in this team is fragmented. The left hand doesnt know what the right is doing. Seems like Zac is too invested in calling  plays and letting the other coaches quasi-independently run the team. McVay always seems in control of the entire team when I compare him with Zac who is too busy thinking about the next play to call.   This method will never work, specially with a green-behind-the-ears HC like Zac. 

GAME OVER.   :paul:

The coaching carousel in Cleveland is almost as bad as their QB carousel. They FINALLY made the playoffs after decades of it not working. Wow, game over...

(01-05-2021, 10:16 AM)Sled21 Wrote: He's called some good ones and some bad ones. And in many we really don't know because the line didn't hold up enough for any play to develop.

If the line couldn't hold up for the plays he called, can we say he called the right plays?  

(01-05-2021, 12:56 PM)MileHighGrowler Wrote: If the line couldn't hold up for the plays he called, can we say he called the right plays?  

We can definitely say he had more faith in the line than he should have. But if you watch some of those games, no play could develop, the defense was in the pocket as soon as the ball was snapped.

(01-04-2021, 06:55 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Conspiracy theory: The Bengals are having interns do online damage control by saying positive stuff about Zac.

This and the Mike Brown comment about "this is what the fans wanted" are dead on.  It is basically trying to spin positive the fact that they are giving him another year.  

A pessimist will say that it is a guaranteed failure next year. 

An optimist will say that if next year is a failure, there will be a complete change of coaches (win). And if they in fact win and get to the playoffs and have a young, energetic squad and show better game management, that is also a win.   

I would hate to lose a year on Burrow's rookie contract but the way I look at it, we, as fans, either win next year of the year after.  

(01-04-2021, 07:52 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: And so has people that are only see from one end of the lense..

Well... one end of the lens is based on wishful thinking and speculation ("hoping" Zac improves.)
While the other end of the lens is based on objective reality (Zac has been a coach with a bad W-L record, with no indication he'll get better.)

(01-05-2021, 12:46 AM)MileHighGrowler Wrote: In the AFC, other than the Bengals I think there's one team that was below 8-8, and it was the Pats, who have enough history with Bill B to not fire him after this season.  Every other team in the conference that dropped below that 8-8 mark is replacing their coach.  

Also, 8-8 would be a pretty good year in this division?  Are we hoping for the participating trophy or winning a SB?  You can't win out very easily if you can't get out of your own division.  Absolutely I would not accept 8-8 as a final record, this division or not.  We've got a HC going into his third year now.  They better do a lot better than 8-8 / mediocrity.  

anything short of a winning record is a lossing one

(01-05-2021, 10:16 AM)Sled21 Wrote: He's called some good ones and some bad ones. And in many we really don't know because the line didn't hold up enough for any play to develop.

I agree he has called some good games and obviously bad ones but the bad offensive line is his fault directly. This offseason he could've addressed it and made more of a priority but he was confident about the line this upcoming year along with Turner and comfortable where they were at. That falls on him directly and he should've known more than anyone that is anything but the case.

Taylor can't go 8-8 next year as the NFL is planning on expanding to a 17 game season. Well, I guess he could go 8-8-1.

(01-05-2021, 02:36 PM)GodFather Wrote: I agree he has called some good games and obviously bad ones but the bad offensive line is his fault directly. This offseason he could've addressed it and made more of a priority but he was confident about the line this upcoming year along with Turner and comfortable where they were at. That falls on him directly and he should've known more than anyone that is anything but the case.

The moves he made didn't work out... XFS, Prince, etc., but I agree he did not do enough to fix our biggest weakness. He relied on getting Jonah back and having him and Hart at Tackles. Hart actually graded out pretty good. XFS was brought in to play guard, and immediately broke his ankle. They counted on Jordan developing, but he didn't. That's why I hope they don't just go with one big name like Thuney and call it quits, because that's one injury from being right back where we are.

(01-04-2021, 06:42 PM)MileHighGrowler Wrote: Pleeeeeeaaaaase stop saying that Boyd and Burrow and any other player who says publicly they believe/support their coach means the players are all-in on Zac or would be upset if the HC was replaced.  Please.  You cannot read into those comments.  Some guys want to stir the pot enough to get dropped or traded like Los did.  But most of them will say the right thing, because, well, it's the right thing.  And maybe they do also support Zac 100%.  But we don't know that, and I'm getting tired of hearing how our guys love Zac so much so we should too.  

You know what I bet Boyd and Burrow like even more than Zac?  Winning.  Winning enough to go the playoffs.  Winning in the playoffs.  Playing a Superbowl.  Winning a Lombardi trophy.  

You know what I expected from Zac?  Not a 5 year learning curve and slow progression where no one knew his ceiling.  Coming off a tired 6-win performance from Merv, I expected Zac to take the team with some energy and knock out 7 or 8 wins the first year and be in the playoff picture this year.  Injuries aren't an excuse.  Losing one-score games isn't an excuse.  

And, the points still remain that Zac doesn't do anything to change and try to improve.  If he'd started out and realized he was in over his head and needed to hand off play calling duties, I'd say he learned something and grew.  If his assistants were keeping the team up and he replaced them I'd say he was striving for excellence.  But the guy hasn't done crap in 2 full years.  It's just the same thing over and over.  I'm not sure where anyone can point to his effort over 32 games and show where the improvement has been.  Learning curve?  There is no curve. It's a learning flat.  Which means there's no learning.  Which means there's no improvement.  

Have to agree with MHG on pretty much everything. We are going nowhere with Taylor if he keeps up his poor play calling and
we don't get in some proven coaches on both sides of the ball at the Coordinator positions. Could Taylor improve? Sure, how 
much is the question cause he is the worst HC in the NFL right now. Hope we bring in a damn good OL coach and that Taylor 
was just trusting Turner cause if Taylor had any call in Jordan starting he is a joke.

We brought in our Franchise QB and people were dreading him getting hurt all season before it actually happened.

No excuse for this when the fans could see it coming.

(01-05-2021, 01:32 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: This and the Mike Brown comment about "this is what the fans wanted" are dead on.  It is basically trying to spin positive the fact that they are giving him another year.  

A pessimist will say that it is a guaranteed failure next year. 

An optimist will say that if next year is a failure, there will be a complete change of coaches (win). And if they in fact win and get to the playoffs and have a young, energetic squad and show better game management, that is also a win.   

I would hate to lose a year on Burrow's rookie contract but the way I look at it, we, as fans, either win next year of the year after.  

Hope you and the OP are right SHRacer.