If Burrow's 2021 isn't better than Watson's 2020 do we start to worry? I get the notion that Burrow could be better than Watson, but how long do we watch before we can conclude which is better or at which point Burrow has surpassed Watson?

If Burrow in 2021 puts up Watson's exact 2020 statline I think we'd be ecstatic and, amusingly enough, declare him to be better than Watson.

(02-02-2021, 01:27 PM)Nately120 Wrote: If Burrow's 2021 isn't better than Watson's 2020 do we start to worry? I get the notion that Burrow could be better than Watson, but how long do we watch before we can conclude which is better or at which point Burrow has surpassed Watson?

If Burrow in 2021 puts up Watson's exact 2020 statline I think we'd be ecstatic and, amusingly enough, declare him to be better than Watson.

There’s no need to compare Burrow to Watson. 2021 Burrow just needs to be better than 2020 Burrow. That’s the most important thing. I highly doubt he’s going to be better than Watson in just his second season, coming off an injury, and still never having had a real offseason/preseason.

(02-02-2021, 01:51 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: There’s no need to compare Burrow to Watson. 2021 Burrow just needs to be better than 2020 Burrow. That’s the most important thing. I highly doubt he’s going to be better than Watson in just his second season, coming off an injury, and still never having had a real offseason/preseason.

I agree, but I'm only brining it up because of this thread.  Burrow and Watson are never going to be compared to each other in any logical sense other than right here and right now.

Remember, we had a thread of Dalton or Peyton Manning for 2012 and Dalton won in a landslide there, too.  No one looked at 2012 Manning and though "We coulda had that" but it was a topic of discussion for a single thread, that's all.

(02-02-2021, 01:27 PM)Nately120 Wrote: If Burrow's 2021 isn't better than Watson's 2020 do we start to worry?  I get the notion that Burrow could be better than Watson, but how long do we watch before we can conclude which is better or at which point Burrow has surpassed Watson?  

If Burrow in 2021 puts up Watson's exact 2020 statline I think we'd be ecstatic and, amusingly enough, declare him to be better than Watson.

I think we'd all just be happy to see JB's 2nd year come close to DW's second year with both coming off ACL. DW threw for over 4,000 yards, 26 TDs, 9 INTs, and a passer rating of 103. He also chipped in another 550 yards and 5 TDs on the ground. We've also got to hope our oline can protect JB better the DW's did his 2nd year when he was sacked 62 times.

(02-02-2021, 02:00 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I think we'd all just be happy to see JB's 2nd year come close to DW's second year with both coming off ACL. DW threw for over 4,000 yards, 26 TDs, 9 INTs, and a passer rating of 103. He also chipped in another 550 yards and 5 TDs on the ground. We've also got to hope our oline can protect JB better the DW's did his 2nd year when he was sacked 62 times.

^ This is perhaps the most reasonable, yet high expectation I've read in this thread.

I agree!

(02-02-2021, 01:27 PM)Nately120 Wrote: If Burrow's 2021 isn't better than Watson's 2020 do we start to worry?  I get the notion that Burrow could be better than Watson, but how long do we watch before we can conclude which is better or at which point Burrow has surpassed Watson?  

If Burrow in 2021 puts up Watson's exact 2020 statline I think we'd be ecstatic and, amusingly enough, declare him to be better than Watson.

Of course.worry... Burrow was #1 pick projected greatest QB since Luck.. Watson was neither of those 

We should not measure QBs by yardage, a bad team is going to throw more and be give more junk yards. A better measure is wins. 4th quarter comebacks, red zone success and 3rd down 6 or less percentage, turnover to int ratio with minimum 24 tds in season

(02-02-2021, 08:46 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Of course.worry... Burrow was #1 pick projected greatest QB since Luck.. Watson was neither of those 

Watson should have been picked at #2 where Trubisky was taken. Passing on him for that bum will forever haunt the Bears.

(02-02-2021, 11:01 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Watson should have been picked at #2 where Trubisky was taken. Passing on him for that bum will forever haunt the Bears.

Actually Mahomes will haunt them more since he went before Watson..

(02-02-2021, 09:00 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: We should not measure QBs by yardage, a bad team is going to throw more and be give more junk yards. A better measure is wins. 4th quarter comebacks, red zone success and 3rd down 6 or less percentage, turnover to int ratio with minimum 24 tds in season

Very few of Burrow’s yards came in “garbage time.” We were in 8/10 of the games He played in. And why stop at 3rd down? How about 4th down? Burrow was the best in the league on those. And yes yards matter. Tua might have been a decent game manager but he couldn’t carry an offense and they’re already thinking about moving on from him in Miami.

(02-02-2021, 11:09 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Actually Mahomes will haunt them more since he went before Watson..

Nope. Mahomes was a surprise. Watson was a total stud coming off winning a National championship. I’m not going to blame a team for not realizing what Mahomes was going to be. It was evident with Watson though.

(02-02-2021, 11:14 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Nope. Mahomes was a surprise. Watson was a total stud coming off winning a National championship. I’m not going to blame a team for not realizing what Mahomes was going to be. It was evident with Watson though.

And the Bears didn't have an Alex Smith mentor and a 12-4 team when they drafted Trubisky like the Chiefs did with Mahomes, and Mahomes needed that.

Don't get me wrong, Mahomes is great and would have gotten where he is eventually, but I think him sitting an entire year and getting to learn behind a 3x Pro Bowler for a year before getting to step into an already playoff-ready team? Huge difference in speed of ascension. Very much like Aaron Rodgers in that way.

The Bears had neither the support system nor the leeway to be able to do that coming off a 3-13 season, and hadn't had a winning season since 5 year before Trubisky was picked. Trubisky obviously wasn't the answer, but the Bears simply weren't in a position to let Mahomes succeed. 

Nope, absolutely not. Burrow hasn't even reached his ceiling yet which is in the Aaron Rodgers/Peyton Manning level. Watson has reached his and.... Well frankly he is Tony Romo 2.0, a guy who can put up top 5 numbers in stata but isn't legitimately elite and can't elevate his teammates or win games.

(02-04-2021, 06:05 PM)Headless Horseman Wrote: Nope, absolutely not. Burrow hasn't even reached his ceiling yet which is in the Aaron Rodgers/Peyton Manning level. Watson has reached his and.... Well frankly he is Tony Romo 2.0, a guy who can put up top 5 numbers in stata but isn't legitimately elite and can't elevate his teammates or win games.

When do we declare that Burrow has hit his ceiling?  You say Watson has hit his at the ripe old age of 25, so Burrow has what...1 year to prove to us that he's one of the best QBs to ever play the game?  

(02-04-2021, 06:05 PM)Headless Horseman Wrote: Nope, absolutely not. Burrow hasn't even reached his ceiling yet which is in the Aaron Rodgers/Peyton Manning level. Watson has reached his and.... Well frankly he is Tony Romo 2.0, a guy who can put up top 5 numbers in stata but isn't legitimately elite and can't elevate his teammates or win games.

I don't think that's something we can really declare.  The fact is, we have no idea what Burrow's ceiling is, or when he's going to reach it.  Maybe he already has.  I love the guy and thinks he has the skills to keep improving, but we don't KNOW that as fact.  Yet the majority are willing to state Burrow is going to up there with some of the all-time greats.  I hope he is, but we have no idea what will happen.  We can say Burrow is a great leader and elevates his teammates, but obviously he didn't elevate them that much this past year.  Not enough to overcome everything else at least.  I think Burrow has high potential, but potential means nothing at the end of the day until it becomes results. 

The question being posed shouldn't come down to assumptions about where Burrow's ceiling is, but whether the move would make sense from a team standpoint.  I don't think it would be a good move for a few reasons, but none of them are me hanging my hat on assuming Burrow is going to be the GOAT, because we just don't know that.  

(02-04-2021, 06:05 PM)Headless Horseman Wrote: Nope, absolutely not. Burrow hasn't even reached his ceiling yet which is in the Aaron Rodgers/Peyton Manning level. Watson has reached his and.... Well frankly he is Tony Romo 2.0, a guy who can put up top 5 numbers in stata but isn't legitimately elite and can't elevate his teammates or win games.

Tony Romo was one of the most underappreciated QBs of all time. Having said that, Watson is probably second only to Mahomes in the NFL at the moment, and has played for a franchise so terrible that the 2020 Cincinnati Bengals beat them. I like Joe Burrow too, but c'mon.

(02-04-2021, 08:25 PM)Nately120 Wrote: When do we declare that Burrow has hit his ceiling?  You say Watson has hit his at the ripe old age of 25, so Burrow has what...1 year to prove to us that he's one of the best QBs to ever play the game?  

Who said any of that? No one. Burrows may hit his ceiling in a year, it might be 3 years. Maybe never. Who knows, especially with this franchise. Irregardless, Watson had a low ceiling from the get, media hype be damned and we see where it is at. He isn't worth overpaying for, and definitely cannot carry a franchise o  his own which he would have to do here. Can Burrow? We certainly will see. 

(02-05-2021, 02:26 PM)Headless Horseman Wrote: Who said any of that? No one. Burrows may hit his ceiling in a year, it might be 3 years. Maybe never. Who knows, especially with this franchise. Irregardless, Watson had a low ceiling from the get, media hype be damned and we see where it is at. He isn't worth overpaying for, and definitely cannot carry a franchise o  his own which he would have to do here. Can Burrow? We certainly will see. 

Weren't the Texans up 24 - 0 against the Chiefs in the playoffs lady year? The Texans have been mediocre at best for years, and Watson had them in the hunt. The dude's pretty good.

(02-05-2021, 02:26 PM)Headless Horseman Wrote: Who said any of that? No one. Burrows may hit his ceiling in a year, it might be 3 years. Maybe never. Who knows, especially with this franchise. Irregardless, Watson had a low ceiling from the get, media hype be damned and we see where it is at. He isn't worth overpaying for, and definitely cannot carry a franchise o  his own which he would have to do here. Can Burrow? We certainly will see. 

Watson just had a near MVP season at age 25.  I think you may be downplaying how good he is. 

Low ceiling on Watson?  Are you the GM of the Chicago Bears, by chance?

(02-05-2021, 03:24 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Watson just had a near MVP season at age 25.  I think you may be downplaying how good he is. 

Low ceiling on Watson?  Are you the GM of the Chicago Bears, by chance?

It's Mitch Trubisky himself... I kid.

We all have opinions I suppose. Deshaun Watson's pretty good at what he does though. I watched him slaughter my Buckeyes, and as a professional, I don't see how anyone can say he's meh... Low ceiling is the last thing I think when I see him play.