(11-06-2020, 04:42 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Well if you just look at a players best games then you get back to my original point that Burrow is no better than the average NFL QB this season.

You list three games with a passer rating over 105.  Eight QBs have at least 4 games with a passer rating that high.  Burrow is just 1 of 17 that have had three games with a passer rating over 105.

His highest rated game was 112.5.  This year 25 other QBs have had a game that good.  19 QBs have had multiple games with a passer rating as high as Burrow's single best game.

(11-06-2020, 05:10 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Give me a break.

You believe in finding things to argue about on the internet.

(11-06-2020, 05:16 PM)fredtoast Wrote: But instead of getting caught up in radical extremism I will just post a simple fact.  This is from after the Ravens game.

"But on the occasions when the offensive line gave Burrow time to throw, he didn't help matters. According to NFL Next Gen, five of his seven sacks took longer than four seconds." 

(11-06-2020, 05:20 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote:   So what debate are we having then?

(11-06-2020, 05:28 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The debate started with a comment that Burrow is a QB who could win a Super Bowl.

(11-06-2020, 05:41 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Yeah, so?  He could win a Super Bowl.

Brad Johnson won a Super Bowl.  So did Joe Flacco and Trent Dilfer.  Eli Manning won two of them.

What's wrong with saying Joe Burrow could win a Super Bowl?

(11-06-2020, 05:28 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I responded that if what he has shown so far proves he could win a Super Bowl then 95% of the QBs in the league could win a Super Bowl.

(11-06-2020, 05:44 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Are those 95% of QB's you're referring to rookie QB's, playing behind a terrible OL?

(11-06-2020, 03:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: People accuse me of "just liking to argue" buy the fact is that I have to because everyone here is a radical extremist.  Any player/coach that is not a fan favorite is the worst piece of garbage who ever lived and would never even play on another NFL team, and every player that is a fan favorite is the greatest of all time.

I repeatedly say that I like Burrow and think he has what it takes to be a very good NFL QB, but the fact is that he has not won shit or played at an extremely efficient level.  I remember when so many people here said that winning head-to-head matchups with Hall of Fame QBs leading division champion teams meant nothing if it was in the regular season.  Now all Burrow has to do is "almost" beat a mediocre team and that is proof he can win a Super Bowl.  And "great QBs don't need great players around them because they make everyone better" has turned into "He'd be great if he only had a better O-line."

All I do is speak the truth of moderation instead of jumping on the radical extremist positions so many people here have, and I am accuse of "just wanting to argue".  But if I say a player is "not as bad as many people claim" the radical extremists come back with "Fred thinks Bobby Hart is an All-Pro."

(11-06-2020, 03:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: People accuse me of "just liking to argue" buy the fact is that I have to because everyone here is a radical extremist.  Any player/coach that is not a fan favorite is the worst piece of garbage who ever lived and would never even play on another NFL team, and every player that is a fan favorite is the greatest of all time.

I repeatedly say that I like Burrow and think he has what it takes to be a very good NFL QB, but the fact is that he has not won shit or played at an extremely efficient level.  I remember when so many people here said that winning head-to-head matchups with Hall of Fame QBs leading division champion teams meant nothing if it was in the regular season.  Now all Burrow has to do is "almost" beat a mediocre team and that is proof he can win a Super Bowl.  And "great QBs don't need great players around them because they make everyone better" has turned into "He'd be great if he only had a better O-line."

All I do is speak the truth of moderation instead of jumping on the radical extremist positions so many people here have, and I am accuse of "just wanting to argue".  But if I say a player is "not as bad as many people claim" the radical extremists come back with "Fred thinks Bobby Hart is an All-Pro."

(11-06-2020, 06:19 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No.

But you are talking about pretending what he will do in the future while i am talking about what he has done right now.

I agree he may develop into a very good NFL QB in the future, but he has not shown it on the filed yet.  He has never even played in a "big game" in the NFL.

(11-06-2020, 05:16 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I never thought you would make it this easy to rove my point.

But instead of getting caught up in radical extremism I will just post a simple fact.  This is from after the Ravens game.

"But on the occasions when the offensive line gave Burrow time to throw, he didn't help matters. According to NFL Next Gen, five of his seven sacks took longer than four seconds." 

(11-06-2020, 11:52 PM)QueenCity Wrote: Pretty sure Fred was one of the 1% of Bengals fans who didn't want Burrow.

The truth is my friend there is a nice term around the Tr-State for Bengals fans who have accepted losing.... Fred is Bengalized.

(11-03-2020, 02:13 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Before anyone thinks I've got absolutely mad, please know that I'm not letting one game completely change my mind on this team. (It was a really nice win though)

There are reports out now that the NFL is strongly considering moving to a 16 team (8 in each conference) playoffs for this season.  What they're saying that would make this all but inevitable is if any team has to cancel a game without a remaining bye, or if he a game is played where a team is forced to play missing multiple players.  Apparently, adding a week 18 is off the table.  This is where the expanded playoffs come in.

So, that is really the point of this thread.  The potential of expanded playoffs.  And according to Adam Schefter it's very likely to happen.

That changes things quite a bit.  Now, do I think that, even with 8 AFC's teams potentially getting in, that we have a great chance?  No.  But....but, it's not completely out of the question.

We currently sit at 2-5-1.  Even if we lose to the Steelers (we could beat them), which would put us at 2-6-1, all is not lost.  Are next 4 game are as follows:  @Washington, Giants, @ Dolphins, Cowboys.

Could we run those stretch of games?  Could we win 3 of 4?  What do we look like at 2-2?

If this team is sitting at, say, 5-7-1, we would at least be in the hunt for a final spot.  I'm not saying we'll get one, but at least the last month of the season would be exciting with meaningful games.

Now here's what we're looking at with the final 3 games: Steelers, @Texans, Ravens.

The Texans game is definitely winnable, as they stink and are in the midst of a complete regime change.  The Ravens, while very good, is the last week of the season.  What happens if they rest their starters?  And the Steelers, if you just chalked up next week as a loss, and can you automatically penciled them in for 0-2?

I'm not sold on this team at all, but a lot of these scenarios intrigue me.  And in a year like this, if we get to 7-8-1, that will give us a chance at the 8th spot.  If we somehow got to 8-7-1 then I'd guess we'd be all but a lock.

Just food for thought.  Might want to watch for the playoff developments, and keep your fingers crossed that we can at least make this interesting.

(11-06-2020, 10:34 AM)fredtoast Wrote: And so far Burrow has not been able to win more than 2 games in 8 starts.

I think he has tons of potential, but he is not an elite QB yet.  He is putting up big yardage numbers just because he is throwing the ball more than any QB in the league.

(11-06-2020, 01:12 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: You don't really need statistics to see that Burrow is "remarkable".  All you need to do is watch the games.  Seeing what Burrow is doing now as a rookie compared to Dalton last year is truly amazing.  If he even had a half-ass OL, he'd be off the charts and this team would be a playoff contender I think.  

Things are coming together and even though we're a losing team, I think I'm having just as much fun watching what's developing as I did in 2015.  I really believe this team is going somewhere special.  Having this kid leading the team is awesome.

(11-06-2020, 03:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: People accuse me of "just liking to argue" buy the fact is that I have to because everyone here is a radical extremist.  Any player/coach that is not a fan favorite is the worst piece of garbage who ever lived and would never even play on another NFL team, and every player that is a fan favorite is the greatest of all time.

I repeatedly say that I like Burrow and think he has what it takes to be a very good NFL QB, but the fact is that he has not won shit or played at an extremely efficient level.  I remember when so many people here said that winning head-to-head matchups with Hall of Fame QBs leading division champion teams meant nothing if it was in the regular season.  Now all Burrow has to do is "almost" beat a mediocre team and that is proof he can win a Super Bowl.  And "great QBs don't need great players around them because they make everyone better" has turned into "He'd be great if he only had a better O-line."

All I do is speak the truth of moderation instead of jumping on the radical extremist positions so many people here have, and I am accuse of "just wanting to argue".  But if I say a player is "not as bad as many people claim" the radical extremists come back with "Fred thinks Bobby Hart is an All-Pro."