(03-04-2024, 11:49 AM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: I think this is overblown. 

Look, in the ZT era, they have drafted 2 OL in the first 3 rounds. Williams Rd1 in 2019 and Carman in Rd2 in 2021. All the rest are Rd4 or below. You cannot expect much out of those guys. 

Williams was not a star. He was a "safe" pick & played like it. Injured year 1 (we should stop doing that). Graded out 70+ i  the first two years. Gutted through leg injury Y3 and grade suffered. Switched to RT and was OK. Someone is gonna pay him $15 mil in FA. That is not a bust. 

Carman is, however. Another guy with injury issues. And not a great work ethic. We tried to convert him to G. Then move him to RT. Did have some good play in the POs at LT, but he appears a LT only guy. Rumored to be an owner/former coach inspired pick. 

Jordan was a 4th, cost Joe his rookie year. 

Adeniji a 6th. What you'd expect from a 6th. 

Smith was a 4th and always a project. 

Volson was a 4th. More successful T to G conversion. Struggles with twists has something to do with it. 

All of those guys were OTs in college save Jordan. 

It is not a stellar record, but the Rd1 busts we all have PTSD over (Price, Ogbuehi) were Marvin. 

(03-04-2024, 11:49 AM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: I think this is overblown. 

Look, in the ZT era, they have drafted 2 OL in the first 3 rounds. Williams Rd1 in 2019 and Carman in Rd2 in 2021. All the rest are Rd4 or below. You cannot expect much out of those guys. 

Williams was not a star. He was a "safe" pick & played like it. Injured year 1 (we should stop doing that). Graded out 70+ i  the first two years. Gutted through leg injury Y3 and grade suffered. Switched to RT and was OK. Someone is gonna pay him $15 mil in FA. That is not a bust. 

Carman is, however. Another guy with injury issues. And not a great work ethic. We tried to convert him to G. Then move him to RT. Did have some good play in the POs at LT, but he appears a LT only guy. Rumored to be an owner/former coach inspired pick. 

Jordan was a 4th, cost Joe his rookie year. 

Adeniji a 6th. What you'd expect from a 6th. 

Smith was a 4th and always a project. 

Volson was a 4th. More successful T to G conversion. Struggles with twists has something to do with it. 

All of those guys were OTs in college save Jordan. 

It is not a stellar record, but the Rd1 busts we all have PTSD over (Price, Ogbuehi) were Marvin. 

(03-05-2024, 12:09 AM)Dr.Z Wrote: I haven't read all of the previous replies in this thread, so I assume it's been mentioned somewhere in here, but the line isn't as bad as many assume.  The offense has been too predictable and opposing defensive coordinators aren't having to worry or account for the threat of the running game.  The reason the line didn't look as bad (and the qb wasn't getting hit as often) late in the season, is bc they were forced to try and establish a running attack.  It kept Browning from being sacked as often and also opened up opportunities for passing success.  I'm not saying that we don't need some help, bc we are going to obviously need the RT position filled, and I would like the interior a bit stronger, but the one dimensional play calling and abandoning of the run after getting stuffed a few times early just makes it easier on opposing DC's.   It wasn't that the line magically started playing better.  It was mostly the way the offense was being called.

(03-05-2024, 12:09 AM)Dr.Z Wrote: I haven't read all of the previous replies in this thread, so I assume it's been mentioned somewhere in here, but the line isn't as bad as many assume.  The offense has been too predictable and opposing defensive coordinators aren't having to worry or account for the threat of the running game.  The reason the line didn't look as bad (and the qb wasn't getting hit as often) late in the season, is bc they were forced to try and establish a running attack.  It kept Browning from being sacked as often and also opened up opportunities for passing success.  I'm not saying that we don't need some help, bc we are going to obviously need the RT position filled, and I would like the interior a bit stronger, but the one dimensional play calling and abandoning of the run after getting stuffed a few times early just makes it easier on opposing DC's.   It wasn't that the line magically started playing better.  It was mostly the way the offense was being called.

(03-05-2024, 12:09 AM)Dr.Z Wrote: I haven't read all of the previous replies in this thread, so I assume it's been mentioned somewhere in here, but the line isn't as bad as many assume.  The offense has been too predictable and opposing defensive coordinators aren't having to worry or account for the threat of the running game.  The reason the line didn't look as bad (and the qb wasn't getting hit as often) late in the season, is bc they were forced to try and establish a running attack.  It kept Browning from being sacked as often and also opened up opportunities for passing success.  I'm not saying that we don't need some help, bc we are going to obviously need the RT position filled, and I would like the interior a bit stronger, but the one dimensional play calling and abandoning of the run after getting stuffed a few times early just makes it easier on opposing DC's.   It wasn't that the line magically started playing better.  It was mostly the way the offense was being called.

(04-08-2024, 02:11 PM)tms Wrote: I did a deep dive on all the dynasties (or quasi-dynasties) of the past 40 years. I didn't check every team, it wasn't 100% comprehensive, but most of the major ones like Dallas, Denver, SF, NE, Indianapolis. Even threw in the Giants, Steelers and Ravens for good measure. All their offensive lines were centrally built not just on picks, but on high picks. They weren't necessarily All-Pros (Chris Snee and Will Beatty for the Giants come to mind) but they were high picks nonetheless. The Colts of 2006 had mostly Day 3's (Saturday, Jake Scott, Ryan Diem) but even they were led by a first-rounder in Tarik Glenn. Same with the Pats of 2004 (Matt Light). The 2018 Pats were a bit messier with third-rounder Thuney as their key guy, but even the cast around him (like Shaq Mason and Marcus Cannon) had been mentored earlier by high picks like Nate Solder and Sebastian Vollner.

This idea of a free agent carousel is largely unprecedented. The notable exception might be today's Chiefs, actually. But even they're stabilized by arguably the best OC in the game. I think continuity is important, and it all starts with high draftees you can put on 4 or 5-year contracts and groom into the system. Can't just run a group of rentals out there every year and expect them to thrive together. When push comes to shove, they might look like rentals. If we haven't been developing offensive linemen, the solution is to learn to develop them rather than give up altogether. In fact that's exactly what the coaches are paid to do.

(01-27-2024, 03:51 PM)t3r3e3 Wrote: The o line has to be priority #1. Burrow can’t keep getting murdered behind a turnstile line. The d line should be priority 2.

(04-08-2024, 07:20 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: I think the issue is combo line giving up too many sacks and hits,and Burrow just not being as durable at QB and we would want. I don't think in the limited games Burrow played and lack of mobility he had that the line was getting him crushed... As inexperienced as Browning once, he was able to finish the season healthy behind the line.

(04-09-2024, 05:09 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: Ben Baldwin's latest expectations for all 32 offensive lines has the Bengals near the top in pass protection at No. 7. They're just one spot behind Cleveland and three spots behind Baltimore.

If Joe Burrow has the seventh best pass blocking offensive line this season, then the Bengals' offense is going to be one of the best in football—especially since Cincinnati has Ja'Marr Chase, Tee Higgins and could add extra weapons and linemen to their roster in the 2024 NFL Draft.

https://twitter.com/benbbaldwin/status/1777363558969278464?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1777363558969278464%7Ctwgr%5E75f68727d7855ec259780c84e6a20c4e0b12d07c%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.si.com%2Fnfl%2Fbengals%2Fbengals-offensive-line-ranked-near-top-nfl-pass-blocking

(04-09-2024, 05:09 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: Ben Baldwin's latest expectations for all 32 offensive lines has the Bengals near the top in pass protection at No. 7. They're just one spot behind Cleveland and three spots behind Baltimore.

If Joe Burrow has the seventh best pass blocking offensive line this season, then the Bengals' offense is going to be one of the best in football—especially since Cincinnati has Ja'Marr Chase, Tee Higgins and could add extra weapons and linemen to their roster in the 2024 NFL Draft.

https://twitter.com/benbbaldwin/status/1777363558969278464?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1777363558969278464%7Ctwgr%5E75f68727d7855ec259780c84e6a20c4e0b12d07c%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.si.com%2Fnfl%2Fbengals%2Fbengals-offensive-line-ranked-near-top-nfl-pass-blocking

(04-08-2024, 08:45 PM)JoeyB2023 Wrote: Disagree. Where we have bad olineman and e have bad play. It’s gotten better because we’ve brought in better oline but we lost one to FA and LG is trassshhh. And Volson the only one we drafted imagine that. We’re close but not there yet. Get get Fuaga Latham or mims in 1. And come back later like the 4th or 5th or maybe even 97 if u love a guy who’s there like puni and snag him. Give Volson some competition and depth also at multiple position up n down the line. Boom.

(04-09-2024, 05:27 PM)GodFather Wrote: There's no doubt if we had a good O-Line we would have beaten the Rams in the SB and also beat the Chiefs in the AFC conference championship game a few years ago. This O-Line has been such an issue for years and so beyond tiresome to talk about and not see improvements year after year where it doesn't become a topical sticking point.