(09-10-2015, 11:57 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: So, what do you guys think? IMO, he summed up the expectations for this season with one question..."If not now, when?"

(09-10-2015, 12:18 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: Good article. Marv may not be the best X's and O's HC, but the way he develops his players as men is what I really admire/respect about him. Little to no incidents involving our players anymore. He lets it be known that the players should give back to the community and city, as he does himself. He really cares about his players. It seems like the players really care about him, too.

Marv is an excellent, all-around person. Even though it pisses me off to no end with some of the circumstances last 5-6 years (PO & primetime woes) , the way he handles his business off the field should really deserve more praise then he gets. Sometimes we need a little perspective to really judge how someone is doing.

(09-10-2015, 12:18 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: Good article. Marv may not be the best X's and O's HC, but the way he develops his players as men is what I really admire/respect about him. Little to no incidents involving our players anymore. He lets it be known that the players should give back to the community and city, as he does himself. He really cares about his players. It seems like the players really care about him, too.

Marv is an excellent, all-around person. Even though it pisses me off to no end with some of the circumstances last 5-6 years (PO & primetime woes) , the way he handles his business off the field should really deserve more praise then he gets. Sometimes we need a little perspective to really judge how someone is doing.

(09-10-2015, 11:57 AM)Bengalholic Wrote: Paul Daugherty wrote an interesting article concerning the 'legacy' of this current Bengals team and how this season will define them. More specifically, he looks at the legacies of Marvin, Andy and Mike...

Bengals embark upon legacy season

So, what do you guys think? IMO, he summed up the expectations for this season with one question..."If not now, when?"

(09-10-2015, 02:11 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I've seen a few like Daugherty and Dehner talk about 30 free agents next year, as if the team is going to be blown up and this is their last shot. It's total bologna. According to Spotrac, here is a list of 21 players due to hit FA next year (starters in bold):

AJ Green- He'll get signed. If not he'll get tagged. He isn't going anywhere.
Leon Hall- It's time to move on. He's making 9 million this year, so it'll actually be good for the team to have him off the books.
Andre Smith- They pretty much drafted his replacement already.
Andrew Whitworth- Same here, but he could be retained at a lesser rate than he currently makes.
Reggie Nelson- He'll turn 33 early in the 2016 season. That's ancient for a safety. He's making 4.8 million this year. Could be had at a lesser rate.
George Iloka- Making 1.5 million this year, he's due for a raise.
Pacman Jones- Making 2.5 million this year. I don't see him getting much more on the open market with his age and history.
Marvin Jones- He hasn't done anything that will make him hard to retain. 
Mo Sanu- Same here. We'll keep at least 1 out of Jones and Sanu.
Pat Sims- I like him, but he's depth. Very replaceable.
Brandon Thompson- Same here. 
Wallace Gilberry- He's had a good run here, but he'll turn 31 in December.
Vinny Rey- Meh.
Emmanuel Lamur- See ya.
Chris Carter- No matter what he does this year, he should be easy to retain.
Eric Winston- See ya.
Brandon Tate- See ya.
Jayson Dimanche- Bottom of the roster type.
Chris Lewis-Harris- Same here.
Greg Little- And here.
TJ Johnson- Here as well.

We have 8 current starters due to hit FA. Of those, 4 are over 30 and need replaced soon anyway. We'll be able to retain most of the players the FO wants to keep. Some at a lesser rate. IMO, AJ Green and Iloka should be the main priorities. They should also try to keep Pacman, Whit and either Sanu or MLJ around. Other than that, I'm not too concerned about the rest of these players. I'm sure it'll shake out just fine.

(09-10-2015, 02:11 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I've seen a few like Daugherty and Dehner talk about 30 free agents next year, as if the team is going to be blown up and this is their last shot. It's total bologna. According to Spotrac, here is a list of 21 players due to hit FA next year (starters in bold):

AJ Green- He'll get signed. If not he'll get tagged. He isn't going anywhere.
Leon Hall- It's time to move on. He's making 9 million this year, so it'll actually be good for the team to have him off the books.
Andre Smith- They pretty much drafted his replacement already.
Andrew Whitworth- Same here, but he could be retained at a lesser rate than he currently makes.
Reggie Nelson- He'll turn 33 early in the 2016 season. That's ancient for a safety. He's making 4.8 million this year. Could be had at a lesser rate.
George Iloka- Making 1.5 million this year, he's due for a raise.
Pacman Jones- Making 2.5 million this year. I don't see him getting much more on the open market with his age and history.
Marvin Jones- He hasn't done anything that will make him hard to retain. 
Mo Sanu- Same here. We'll keep at least 1 out of Jones and Sanu.
Pat Sims- I like him, but he's depth. Very replaceable.
Brandon Thompson- Same here. 
Wallace Gilberry- He's had a good run here, but he'll turn 31 in December.
Vinny Rey- Meh.
Emmanuel Lamur- See ya.
Chris Carter- No matter what he does this year, he should be easy to retain.
Eric Winston- See ya.
Brandon Tate- See ya.
Jayson Dimanche- Bottom of the roster type.
Chris Lewis-Harris- Same here.
Greg Little- And here.
TJ Johnson- Here as well.

We have 8 current starters due to hit FA. Of those, 4 are over 30 and need replaced soon anyway. We'll be able to retain most of the players the FO wants to keep. Some at a lesser rate. IMO, AJ Green and Iloka should be the main priorities. They should also try to keep Pacman, Whit and either Sanu or MLJ around. Other than that, I'm not too concerned about the rest of these players. I'm sure it'll shake out just fine.

(09-10-2015, 02:29 PM)RoyleRedlegs Wrote: Andre is all but gone. (Ogbuehi)
So is Gilberry. (Hardison is basically his replacement)
Nelson could be on the outs (Smith or Shaw)
Hall could be brought back cheap enough, other wise Dennard takes his spot. 
Sims is a nice piece but NT needs to be a top draft priority.
Vinny Rey could be replaced by Roach in 2016. Dawson, Burfict, Maualuga probably the starters. Flowers could be in the running for the NLB same with Shawn Williams. 

If Carter has a good year, he's the only non-starter who is a must keep. 

(09-10-2015, 12:42 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: I really don't know why this year would be any more of a "legacy" year than last.  At least as far as the thinking that "this has to be the year or else...".

[INSERT VALID AND EXCELLENT POINTS ABOUT YEARS 1-3]

Which brings us to last year.  Now this, this had to be the year.  No more excuses.  Mike, Marvin, Andy, AJ, etc.  They had to win this year.  This was year 4.  There was no youth excuses any longer.  Surely this was to be the year.  For whatever reason it wasn't.  People gave them another year.  That "no excuses" mantra turned into a ton of excuses.

And here we are now.  Why does this year have to be the year any more than any of the last 3?  Year, 2, 3, and 4 of Reboot 2.0 were all, in differing degrees, "have to get it done" years.  Yet they weren't.  And our front office gave and bought into another year.  Many of our fans did, or do, the same.  So why exactly should we expect any different if they fall short this year?  What greater demands are being put on the team by ownership in year 5/year 25.  Why now, after all this time, should we think there is any more urgency than before?

If this team falls short I would love the idea of the experiment ending.  Kick Giggles to the curb.  Shake up the staff.  Be open to personnel and approach changes.  That would be great.  But I'm not going to be at all shocked if next year at this time we're doing the same thing we've been doing...  "This has to be the year for this bunch."  Until Mike makes no changes and we're saying things the following year.

(09-10-2015, 02:32 PM)ExtraRadiohead Wrote: "For lots of you, Brown could lord over 10 Super Bowl champions, and he'd still be the guy who stole your wallet. If there were 10 rings behind glass at PBS, you'd lament the public money spent on the trophy case. Brown can't win, even if he does."




This is so true.

In fairness, we have no way of knowing how the majority of fans would react to Mike lording over multiple championships...because he's yet to 'lord over' a single playoff win in a quarter century. 

(09-10-2015, 03:18 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I thought it was a great article by Doc, and I agreed with most of what he said...but the sentence you quoted was kind of silly, IMO. 


In fairness, we have no way of knowing how the majority of fans would react to Mike lording over multiple championships...because he's yet to 'lord over' a single playoff win in a quarter century. 

(09-10-2015, 03:20 PM)Who Dey Time Wrote: Does it really matter?  As Daugherty astutely points out, many have already formulated their opinion about this particular Bengals era.

Marvin could win the big one - "fans" will still consider him a big game bust, giggles, etc.

Andy could win the big one - "fans" will still present the same negatives they always do.

Mike could win the big one - idiots will still decry the stadium deal, cheapness, etc.

Thus, IMO, the legacy question is irrelevant.  Having said that, 2015 could be a future defining season for many on this team including Marvin Lewis.  That becomes the ultimate question.