Lou’s Future in the Jungle

[Bronxbengal]

(01-14-2023, 03:10 AM)jason Wrote: Trey Hendrickson may put up better sack numbers, but I feel like Carlos was more versatile. I don't have the almighty grades, but it seems to me Dunlap was better against the run and way more athletic. The dude returned fumbles and interceptions (Trey's next pick will be his first) for TDs. He'd run down guys from behind.

I agree with your general premise though. Zimmer was a better coach than Lou... Period. But Lou's our guy now. So whatever.

Dunlap could have been HOF if he played as hard as Hendrickson, but he didn’t when here. Matter of fact he wanted out of the jungle when Zac and Lou came. Some players are coachable for the system while others are not which I give Lou credit for identifying these types of players. Don’t know if it was Zimmer’s decision but that defense had way too many malcontents and no way that team was going to win.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Soonerpeace]

Meanwhile The Leonard Leap your comments about Volson being challenged by more than me as he garners an All-Rookie team honor.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(01-14-2023, 02:43 AM)Big_Ern Wrote: Not why we lost him 

I know, I was being a sarcastic smartass 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(01-14-2023, 03:13 AM)jason Wrote: It does show that you don't have to draft two "generational" talents back to back to compete though. You don't have to completely flip a roster to have success. Any way you slice it, Zac did a poor job with what he had to work with early on. It's undeniable.

The Giants had a more talented and YOUNGER team than what the Bengals had. Same in Jacksonville. What each team lacked was adequate coaching. The Trevor Lawrence we're seeing this year, could've been last year if Meyer wasn't such a dumbass. The Giants added Martindale too. We had Marvin Lewis leftovers that were all in or approaching their thirties. Context is key.

[Sled21]

(01-14-2023, 10:05 AM)Bronxbengal Wrote: Dunlap could have been HOF if he played as hard as Hendrickson, but he didn’t when here.  Matter of fact he wanted out of the jungle when Zac and Lou came.  Some players are coachable for the system while others are not which I give Lou credit for identifying these types of players.  Don’t know if it was Zimmer’s decision but that defense had way too many malcontents and no way that team was going to win.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

The biggest difference is even when Dunlap was happy playing for Zim, he took plays off. I've never seen Hendrickson take a play off and not go 100%

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2023, 03:13 AM)jason Wrote: It does show that you don't have to draft two "generational" talents back to back to compete though. You don't have to completely flip a roster to have success. Any way you slice it, Zac did a poor job with what he had to work with early on. It's undeniable.

Sorry I’m not a buyer on that in the least. This is what NYG has had to rebuild their roster. Cincy didn’t have anything remotely close to that.

NYG
2018 Saquan Barkley (#2 overall)
2019 3 first rounders (5,17,30)
2020 (#4 overall)
2022 (#5,#7,#43,#67,#81)

What Daboli did versus Zac going to the Super Bowl after 2020 is ridiculous (still stands as the biggest turnaround in NFL history)

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2023, 10:43 AM)WychesWarrior Wrote: The Giants had a more talented and YOUNGER team than what the Bengals had. Same in Jacksonville. What each team lacked was adequate coaching. The Trevor Lawrence we're seeing this year, could've been last year if Meyer wasn't such a dumbass. The Giants added Martindale too. We had Marvin Lewis leftovers that were all in or approaching their thirties. Context is key.

Absolutely the NYG comparison is a dud.

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2023, 03:13 AM)jason Wrote: It does show that you don't have to draft two "generational" talents back to back to compete though. You don't have to completely flip a roster to have success. Any way you slice it, Zac did a poor job with what he had to work with early on. It's undeniable.

Zac was named coach on Feb. 4th. The NFL was closely monitoring tampering. You are restricted in naming him coach until after the Super Bowl. He couldn’t recruit a staff. So he got a ridiculous late start on his staff nevermind the draft. He had little input on his first one. He had other fish to fry. He was woefully inexperienced. So it took him longer. No way his roster was even in the same hemisphere as Daboli’s or Pederson.

[*jason*]

(01-14-2023, 01:53 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Zac was named coach on Feb. 4th. The NFL was closely monitoring tampering. You are restricted in naming him coach until after the Super Bowl. He couldn’t recruit a staff. So he got a ridiculous late start on his staff nevermind the draft. He had little input on his first one. He had other fish to fry. He was woefully inexperienced. So it took him longer. No way his roster was even in the same hemisphere as Daboli’s or Pederson.

No one is saying he should've made the playoffs like Daboll, and a Super Bowl winning head coach. They weren't even competitive. All the rest of that is excuses. Just like the close loss excuse and the nobody can win with injuries excuse from 2020. We've won with a ton of key injuries this season. The 49ers are on to their 3rd string QB... Still winning. A poor performance is a poor performance, and we got two years of that from them. Is Zac and awful coach? No, but he got off to an awful start. I also have a bunch that we're not here if Daniel Jones is our QB.

It's all just blah blah blah though. We're winning that's all that matters. If this is the best defense in team history to some of us, so be it.

[*Synric*]

The 2019 Bengal coaching job was one of the worst opportunities.

The Bengals were locked into multiple large contracts to aging and declining vets not to mention Andy Dalton was the paid starter. The one offensive weapon was aging been injured for a couple years and in line for a Tag or Contract. The Bengals had an small infamous front office with little fan outreach and a reputation for being cheap and slightly hardheaded in free agency.

That 2019 season was almost as magical as the 2021 season because that LSU season is kinda tied to it. Even though the Bengals were losing everyone was pointing at Joe Burrow smiling saying "That's the Future".

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2023, 02:43 PM)jason Wrote: No one is saying he should've made the playoffs like Daboll, and a Super Bowl winning head coach. They weren't even competitive. All the rest of that is excuses. Just like the close loss excuse and the nobody can win with injuries excuse from 2020. We've won with a ton of key injuries this season. The 49ers are on to their 3rd string QB... Still winning. A poor performance is a poor performance, and we got two years of that from them. Is Zac and awful coach? No, but he got off to an awful start. I also have a bunch that we're not here if Daniel Jones is our QB.

It's all just blah blah blah though. We're winning that's all that matters. If this is the best defense in team history to some of us, so be it.

It’s tough to compare teams. SF has a pretty good roster. 6 All Pros vs us 0. With their OL and ours after losing Burrow is not really apples to apples. Injuries matter and Zac’s second year it was a disaster. Look at the Ravens last year. Look at the Rams this year. So trying to label Zac as awful his second year means you think McVay was awful this year or Harbaugh last year. The Daboli comparison doesn’t work in any shape or form. His roster versus Zac’s the first year just not in the same hemisphere.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-14-2023, 09:01 AM)Graphicguy Wrote: Agree.  The current coaching hires in the NFL seem to be learning towards the offensive minds.  Franchises are looking at teams like the Bengals, Buffalo, KC, Phlly and see elite offenses and decide that’s the direction they need to go.  Can’t argue their point.

But, eventually the pendulum will swing in the other direction towards defensive minds.

That said, I haven’t heard one peep bout Lou getting any interviews…anywhere.

I honestly think Lou is at home and wants to stay with his guys. It is a family now that he helped build on his side of the ball
and even Burrow and the Offense love the guy. I don't think he is going anywhere even if he got interviews I bet he turns them
down. We will see but this is what I believe, I could be wrong though and if someone offered him enough dough and a Head 
Coaching job he would take it, but I doubt it. The Texans or the Broncos would be the teams and those seem like black holes.

[*jason*]

(01-14-2023, 03:08 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: It’s tough to compare teams. SF has a pretty good roster. 6 All Pros vs us 0. With their OL and ours after losing Burrow is not really apples to apples. Injuries matter and Zac’s second year it was a disaster. Look at the Ravens last year. Look at the Rams this year. So trying to label Zac as awful his second year means you think McVay was awful this year or Harbaugh last year. The Daboli comparison doesn’t work in any shape or form. His roster versus Zac’s the first year just not in the same hemisphere.

We'll just leave it at I'm glad Zac has figured out how to compete through inevitable injuries, and now wins close games as opposed to losing them like every other losing team does. Again... I don't think Zac is terrible, but you admitted he was woefully inexperienced, and it showed... For quite awhile.

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2023, 04:06 PM)jason Wrote: We'll just leave it at I'm glad Zac has figured out how to compete through inevitable injuries, and now wins close games as opposed to losing them like every other losing team does. Again... I don't think Zac is terrible, but you admitted he was woefully inexperienced, and it showed... For quite awhile.

Your comment “ I don’t think Zac is terrible “ qualifies your opinion clearly. The Bengals have made the playoffs in consecutive years for the first time in their history. They won their first playoff game in 31 years the longest drought of any North American Major Sports teams. His teams turnaround the largest in NFL history. They are 20-7 the last 27 games. No he’s certainly not terrible.

[casear2727]

(01-14-2023, 03:39 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I honestly think Lou is at home and wants to stay with his guys. It is a family now that he helped build on his side of the ball
and even Burrow and the Offense love the guy. I don't think he is going anywhere even if he got interviews I bet he turns them
down. We will see but this is what I believe, I could be wrong though and if someone offered him enough dough and a Head 
Coaching job he would take it, but I doubt it. The Texans or the Broncos would be the teams and those seem like black holes.

All coordinators want to be HCs, opportunities that may be turned downed are very rarely because they wanted to stay with players "they love" as the roster changes every season.

I dont see Lou being a top tier HC candidate for either of those teams:
Broncos have a young black DC with a better defense that the players love.  No way they hire a DC for HC over him.

Texans would offer Ryans, former All-Pro Texan and the DC with the absolutely best defense in the league. 

Extremely doubtful we lose Lou this offseason.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(01-14-2023, 02:43 PM)jason Wrote: No one is saying he should've made the playoffs like Daboll, and a Super Bowl winning head coach. They weren't even competitive. All the rest of that is excuses. Just like the close loss excuse and the nobody can win with injuries excuse from 2020. We've won with a ton of key injuries this season. The 49ers are on to their 3rd string QB... Still winning. A poor performance is a poor performance, and we got two years of that from them. Is Zac and awful coach? No, but he got off to an awful start. I also have a bunch that we're not here if Daniel Jones is our QB.

It's all just blah blah blah though. We're winning that's all that matters. If this is the best defense in team history to some of us, so be it.

Best in team history? 

No way. Most clutch? Maybe. 88 had a good, clutch squad....I don't remember 81. From then, up until now, we definitely had some defenses that were good at pissing down their legs when we needed them the most. 


Which defense would you take with the game on the line needing a stop....one of Zimmer's, or this current version? I never thought I'd say it, but I'm taking this one. What about you? 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(01-14-2023, 02:59 PM)Synric Wrote: The 2019 Bengal coaching job was one of the worst opportunities.

The Bengals were locked into multiple large contracts to aging and declining vets not to mention Andy Dalton was the paid starter. The one offensive weapon was aging been injured for a couple years and in line for a Tag or Contract. The Bengals had an small infamous front office with little fan outreach and a reputation for being cheap and slightly hardheaded in free agency.

That 2019 season was almost as magical as the 2021 season because that LSU season is kinda tied to it. Even though the Bengals were losing everyone was pointing at Joe Burrow smiling saying "That's the Future".

Right, I don't understand how people don't get this. Most of the roster was nearing or in its 30s and getting paid handsomely.  A lot of people just can't admit they were wrong about these guys I guess.

Good point about the FO.

[Sled21]

(01-14-2023, 04:57 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Your comment “ I don’t think Zac is terrible “ qualifies your opinion clearly. The Bengals have made the playoffs in consecutive years for the first time in their history. They won their first playoff game in 31 years the longest drought of any North American Major Sports teams. His teams turnaround the largest in NFL history. They are 20-7 the last 27 games. No he’s certainly not terrible.

Uh, Andy Dalton disagrees with this statement. They won the Division back to back for the 1st time. Dalton took the team to 5 straight playoff years.

[Housh]

This roster needs Lou. He’s the glue

[Soonerpeace]

(01-14-2023, 07:23 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Uh, Andy Dalton disagrees with this statement. They won the Division back to back for the 1st time. Dalton took the team to 5 straight playoff years.

That’s right thanks for the correction