Irv Smith a Bengal

[Soonerpeace]

(03-28-2023, 02:00 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Definitely understand, I still want Darnell Wright more than anybody or BPA, which could be Darnell Washington or Michael Mayer if 
Wright is gone. Could be Bijan Robinson, Gibbs, Addison, Smith-Njigba or one of the other RT's. Lots of ways we could go I would be
more than fine with.


Dang rights, other TE's will look at this place in a good light.

Like Synric said, our Offense relies on mismatches, if we could get a TE that is truly a mismatch for Defenders it would add another
dimension to take our Offense to another level. Irv Smith is really quick for a TE when he is healthy.

Joe has never had a 5 star college TE or Pro Bowl TE. He’s like a PG on a BB team. He’s going to pass up guys to get it to the guy he thinks can nail the shot. If you are an OC who are you going to target? I think grabbing a TE ( that’s a potential Mark Andrews or George Kittle or Kelce) he would utilize.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-28-2023, 02:24 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Joe has never had a 5 star college TE or Pro Bowl TE. He’s like a PG on a BB team. He’s going to pass up guys to get it to the guy he thinks can nail the shot. If you are an OC who are you going to target? I think grabbing a TE ( that’s a potential Mark Andrews or George Kittle or Kelce) he would utilize.

Completely agree, nothing against Thad Moss, CJ Uzomah or Hayden Hurst but they are not those type of TE's. Other people will say
we don't use the TE the way the other teams use those guys, but I digress, Burrow will hit the open guy. Honestly if Darnell Wright is 
gone the other Darnell from Georgia could be the next great one. His size, strength, athleticism and hands are elite. Washington just
wasn't used as a pass catcher at Georgia, he is like a 6th OL which just makes his upside afterwards gravy IMO.

[THE PISTONS]

(03-28-2023, 10:49 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: I think this is the outcome. Round 1 isn't going to be Mayer, Washington, or any TE. 

And it shouldn't have been. When you are building a team that has a QB that is paid $50 million, your 1st Round pick needs to be guys at premium positions...so you can have them cost-controlled for 4-5 years.

TE just isn't a premium position.

[Bengalholic]

I can't see this signing having any real impact on how they approach TE in the draft, or at least I hope not. I'm fine with the signing because he does have experience and we need bodies in the TE room...but with Smith being injury prone and very inconsistent when he does play, finding a TE in the draft capable of starting games this year is still very much a priority, IMO.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-28-2023, 02:47 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: And it shouldn't have been. When you are building a team that has a QB that is paid $50 million, your 1st Round pick needs to be guys at premium positions...so you can have them cost-controlled for 4-5 years.

TE just isn't a premium position.

If we do go with a TE early he better block, that is all I know. I would be furious if we drafted Kincaid.

(03-28-2023, 02:48 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I can't see this signing having any real impact on how they approach TE in the draft, or at least I hope not. I'm fine with the signing because he does have experience and we need bodies in the TE room...but with Smith being injury prone and very inconsistent when he does play, finding a TE in the draft capable of starting games this year is still very much a priority, IMO.

Best Player Available, if that is your top TE so be it. A guy like Darnell Washington would help our OL.

[THE PISTONS]

(03-28-2023, 02:24 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Joe has never had a 5 star college TE or Pro Bowl TE. He’s like a PG on a BB team. He’s going to pass up guys to get it to the guy he thinks can nail the shot. If you are an OC who are you going to target? I think grabbing a TE ( that’s a potential Mark Andrews or George Kittle or Kelce) he would utilize.

Those guys are really hard to find though. But yes, they are great examples.

We're 0-2 on finding a Kelce type with Eifert/Gresham.

[*Go Cards*]

(03-28-2023, 02:57 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Those guys are really hard to find though. But yes, they are great examples.

We're 0-2 on finding a Kelce type with Eifert/Gresham.

Think Eifert would have been if he was not made of ultra thin glass. 

[Bengalbug]

(03-28-2023, 02:24 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Joe has never had a 5 star college TE or Pro Bowl TE. He’s like a PG on a BB team. He’s going to pass up guys to get it to the guy he thinks can nail the shot. If you are an OC who are you going to target? I think grabbing a TE ( that’s a potential Mark Andrews or George Kittle or Kelce) he would utilize.

So we need to look for a tight end in the 3rd-5th rounds Kittle (5) and andrews and kelce (3).

Easier said than done, unfortunately tight end doesn’t translate to the NFL that easy.

First round tight ends since 200 below. I broke it up into two groups, mostly based on talent. Since 2007 there has been very little productivity from first round tight ends. Not horrible, but not Kittle/andrews/kelce. Maybe it’s better to double dip and try to increase our chances of hitting. Could we steal pitts for a 2nd or 3rd from atl?

Since 2007
Pitts
Noah Fant
Tj Hockenson
Hayden hurst
David Njoku
Evan engram
Oj Howard
Eric Ebron
Tyler eifert
Jermaine Gresham
Brandon petigrew
Dustin Keller

Before 2007
Greg Olson
Marcedes Lewis
Vernon davis
Heath Miller
Ben watson
Kellen Winslow
Dallas clark
Dan graham
Jeremy shockey
Todd heap
Anthony becht
Bubba franks

[Soonerpeace]

(03-28-2023, 03:16 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Think Eifert would have been if he was not made of ultra thin glass. 

Mark Andrews wasn’t. He was a star in college. Can’t specifically remember Kelce. Kittle I watched in high school. He had 1 offer Iowa and it was last minute and because his Dad starred there. He really developed exponentially

[THE PISTONS]

(03-28-2023, 03:29 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: So we need to look for a tight end in the 3rd-5th rounds Kittle (5) and andrews and kelce (3).  

Easier said than done, unfortunately tight end doesn’t translate to the NFL that easy.

First round tight ends since 200 below. I broke it up into two groups, mostly based on talent.  Since 2007 there has been very little productivity from first round tight ends.  Not horrible, but not Kittle/andrews/kelce. Maybe it’s better to double dip and try to increase our chances of hitting.  Could we steal pitts for a 2nd or 3rd from atl?

Since 2007
Pitts
Noah Fant
Tj Hockenson
Hayden hurst
David Njoku
Evan engram
Oj Howard
Eric Ebron
Tyler eifert
Jermaine Gresham
Brandon petigrew
Dustin Keller

Before 2007
Greg Olson
Marcedes Lewis
Vernon davis
Heath Miller
Ben watson
Kellen Winslow
Dallas clark
Dan graham
Jeremy shockey
Todd heap
Anthony becht
Bubba franks

Wow. That's an interesting list.

I doubt that the Falcons would trade Pitts.

[THE PISTONS]

(03-28-2023, 03:30 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Mark Andrews wasn’t. He was a star in college. Can’t specifically remember Kelce. Kittle I watched in high school. He had 1 offer Iowa and it was last minute and because his Dad starred there. He really developed exponentially

Yep.

TE is a tough spot to scout. Some colleges use them like a WR, but those guys can't block. Others use them as blockers, and you have no idea if they can catch.

Here's a guy I'll call. Will Mallory from Miami. Should be there in the 6th and 7th. I think he could have an above average to good career as a TE.

4.54 40. Has good athleticism. Miami's QB situation has been messed up for a few years, so I think he might be a better pro than college player.

[THE PISTONS]

Kittle's draft profile had him as an average backup or special teamer. 11th best TE that year. Shows how draft is a crapshoot.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/george-kittle/32004b49-5438-8290-eeed-c9c9cca62ec1

[*Go Cards*]

(03-28-2023, 03:30 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Mark Andrews wasn’t. He was a star in college. Can’t specifically remember Kelce. Kittle I watched in high school. He had 1 offer Iowa and it was last minute and because his Dad starred there. He really developed exponentially

Was only referring to Eifert not becoming a Kelce type per being too brittle but feel the talent was there. 

Guess you're referring to developing them which I did not see mentioned even in the post he was responding to which I replied. Must have missed something, sorry. 

 Responded to statement the Bengals being 0-2 finding a Kelce type TE with Eifert/Gresham.

[jj22]

I don't know about double dipping on a TE in the draft for this offense. I'd double dip on a RB and cut Mixon, or find a way to get a WR which I fear is falling off the board given some of these needs (RT, G, SS, DE, 3TDT, TE, RB, Punter, CB). 4th Wideout isn't important some may say, but we saw last year (even though we survived) how quickly we can be down to 1 wideout, and until Tee is re-signed (for those who think he will be), we need to prepare as if he won't be. Before free agency I thought Wideout at 28 may be in play. Needs have overruled that tho.

[XenoMorph]

(03-28-2023, 11:24 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: It won’t matter who our TE is.  If healthy and competent, the production will be there.  Just like the last two years.

Well he hasnt been able to stay healthy.

And it does matter...    Or you want to call Dan Coats back?

[Housh]

(03-28-2023, 02:57 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Those guys are really hard to find though. But yes, they are great examples.

We're 0-2 on finding a Kelce type with Eifert/Gresham.

I mean If your grading scale is you have to be Travis Kelce then you’ll never be happy. Eifert and Gresham were both great TEs. If we had either right now most ppl would say we’re good at TE.



Our track record of picking TE in the 1 round is actually pretty good.

[*ochocincos*]

(03-28-2023, 03:29 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: So we need to look for a tight end in the 3rd-5th rounds Kittle (5) and andrews and kelce (3).  

Easier said than done, unfortunately tight end doesn’t translate to the NFL that easy.

First round tight ends since 200 below. I broke it up into two groups, mostly based on talent.  Since 2007 there has been very little productivity from first round tight ends.  Not horrible, but not Kittle/andrews/kelce. Maybe it’s better to double dip and try to increase our chances of hitting.  Could we steal pitts for a 2nd or 3rd from atl?

Since 2007
Pitts
Noah Fant
Tj Hockenson
Hayden hurst
David Njoku
Evan engram
Oj Howard
Eric Ebron
Tyler eifert
Jermaine Gresham
Brandon petigrew
Dustin Keller

Before 2007
Greg Olson
Marcedes Lewis
Vernon davis
Heath Miller
Ben watson
Kellen Winslow
Dallas clark
Dan graham
Jeremy shockey
Todd heap
Anthony becht
Bubba franks

Out of that list of TEs selected in Rd 1 since 2007, every single TE in that list had at least one season of 500+ yards.
Chances are if you're selecting a TE in Rd 1, you're gonna get some solid production, if not more.

[jj22]

(03-28-2023, 04:14 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: And it does matter...    Or you want to call Dan Coats back?

I thought they brought him in for a workout or was that another blast from the past.... 

[*ochocincos*]

(03-28-2023, 02:47 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: And it shouldn't have been. When you are building a team that has a QB that is paid $50 million, your 1st Round pick needs to be guys at premium positions...so you can have them cost-controlled for 4-5 years.

TE just isn't a premium position.

I think it is depending on how you deploy a TE.
The Chiefs and Ravens, for example, have their best pass catcher at TE.
I would change the term to the more generalized "offensive weapon."

If your team doesn't feature a RB, don't spend big on the position.
If your team doesn't feature the TE as a top 2-3 option, no need to invest much there.
If your team doesn't feature 3-WR sets too much, no need to invest much in that 3rd WR.

With that said, you don't want the position to be a liability either, and you want to have someone competent in case one of the top guys goes down with injury.
For example, if Chase or Higgins gets injured, the Bengals either need to lean more on the TE, the RB, or possibly a backup WR to fill that void.

[Essex Johnson]

(03-28-2023, 01:07 AM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Nice pickup.  I would rather have Smith than waste a 1st round pick on a TE.  I think this opens up the draft a little more for the Bengals.

Let's stop the rotation of soso TEs and let get go for a rookie that is expected to make a real impact...