Jonah Williams Requests Trade

[THE PISTONS]

(03-29-2023, 12:14 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Jonah is an interesting situation. I ask myself, why have the Bengals not given Jonah's agent permission to seek a trade?

I know many devalue Jonah, but to devalue the LT position is another story.

For all we know, the Bengals may have a potential deal already in place, but it depends on how the draft falls. If Bengals take a T with pick 28, may mean they will deal Jonah.

Or another team may be targeting a specific tackle, but if that T is gone, they want Jonah.

Many assume since they are hearing nothing from the Bengals FO, no discussions are or have taken place for Jonah. We will find out in about 30 days in  my opinion. our 1st round draft pick can be telling, FO is going to trade him or FO is going to keep him and possibly cut Collins, or keep them all.

One other take, Bengals could keep him and then see if another team loses an OT and is desperate. He can still be traded prior the trade deadline, it would be for 2024 equity and cap space, but equity all the same.

There aren't many teams that have 12 million in cap space to trade him to. So I don't know. I feel like we'd know if there was a deal.

The combination of injury history, salary, and 1 year rental status make trading him much harder. Not saying it's impossible. But, it's harder.

[007BengalsFan]

(03-29-2023, 12:14 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Jonah is an interesting situation. I ask myself, why have the Bengals not given Jonah's agent permission to seek a trade?

I would 100% give Jonah's agent permission to seek a trade and tell him the cost is a 2nd round pick.  That way his agent can negotiate with other teams about a possible contract extension which would allow the other team to feel safe about not having Jonah leave after 1 season.  This way a 2nd round pick is more realistic.  I dont think too many teams would give up a 2nd without having an extension already worked out with Jonah.  He is gone anyway after this season so they should allow his agent to negotiate with other teams so both Jonah and the Bengals can move on.

[SunsetBengal]

(03-29-2023, 03:29 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Many fans devalue Jonah, not me. If a 2nd was offered and they said no then I trust their long term plan for Jonah. They will be shelling out 12.6 million so their money and their decision

Often a value is determined by the level of desperation of the buyer.  Caleb McGary who the Falcons had turned down the 5th year option on, was re-signed by the team that drafted him for 3yrs/$34.5M after 62 starts over 4 seasons.  Andre Dillard had his 5th year option declined by the Eagles, but managed to get a lucky signing by a very desperate Titans team for 3yrs/$29M after a whopping 9 starts over 4 seasons with Philly.  Jonah Williams, who I see as somewhere in the middle of those two in terms of talent and durability, was put on notice by the Bengals after an injury filled season where he let his QB get sacked a whopping 12 times.

[PDub80]

(03-29-2023, 03:58 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: If the Bengals really were offered a 3rd they should seriously consider it.  If they get a 2nd, they need to take it

Honestly, if he is being a tool and refusing to play they should take a 4th just tk move on. The cash is more valuable at this point.

This draft is DEEP. They should snag a 4th and gain the $12mil or whatever in cap space and be happy.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-29-2023, 04:36 PM)PDub80 Wrote: Honestly, if he is being a tool and refusing to play they should take a 4th just tk move on. The cash is more valuable at this point.

This draft is DEEP. They should snag a 4th and gain the $12mil or whatever in cap space and be happy.

No doubt, just sheds a dude who doesn't want to be here and money along with him so we can have a competition at RT with 
OL that want to be here. Adding a mid round pick is gravy, we even draft pretty damn well in the 4th.

[Bengalholic]

“I’m not sure he said he doesn’t want to be with the team. These things happen. We’re going to try and get our best team out there. We hear his concerns, but at the end of the day we’ll just have to see where it all plays out and if he’s here we’re going to get our five best guys out there. We’ve obviously looked at our offensive line the last couple of years and really tried to strengthen it and I think we’ve done a great job with that. So we’ve got some good options.” - Katie Blackburn

[*Go Cards*]

(03-29-2023, 12:14 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Jonah is an interesting situation. I ask myself, why have the Bengals not given Jonah's agent permission to seek a trade?

I know many devalue Jonah, but to devalue the LT position is another story.

For all we know, the Bengals may have a potential deal already in place, but it depends on how the draft falls. If Bengals take a T with pick 28, may mean they will deal Jonah.

Or another team may be targeting a specific tackle, but if that T is gone, they want Jonah.

Many assume since they are hearing nothing from the Bengals FO, no discussions are or have taken place for Jonah. We will find out in about 30 days in  my opinion. our 1st round draft pick can be telling, FO is going to trade him or FO is going to keep him and possibly cut Collins, or keep them all.

One other take, Bengals could keep him and then see if another team loses an OT and is desperate. He can still be traded prior the trade deadline, it would be for 2024 equity and cap space, but equity all the same.

Agree that the draft should be the "tell". If the Bengals draft a RT and have Carman, Jonah, Collins, and a rookie then believe something is probably askew and a trade is imminent. If they go CB, DL, the, or RB then Jonah is probably on the block. 

(03-29-2023, 03:58 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: If the Bengals really were offered a 3rd they should seriously consider it.  If they get a 2nd, they need to take it

Agree

know that they will get a 3rd round comp pick for losing him next year anyway but would rather have that pick this year when the window is wide open. Plus a team pick will be earlier than a comp pick. Yet understand holding out hoping for more at this time. 

[Stewy]

(03-29-2023, 01:55 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Nice post Go Cards. 

BTW, this was exactly why I was criticizing Brian Callahan and Pollack saying they weren't going to move Jonah a month ago.

That made it even more of a blindside hit to Jonah. Should of said we are open to whatever gets our 5 best OL on the field starting.

Yeah and fans believe too much of what comes out of the coaches and Team Leaders mouthes.

Remember Joe and Zach praising the OLine's after the 2021 and 2022 seasons?  Nothing but good things to say, which peeved the chicken littles here right off.  Then the Bengals went out and made changes.

Sorry Nate, but if you're overreacting to what BC and FP are saying when FA/FO are still going on and there still the draft to go, then you're a chicken little.

[Bengalholic]

Jonah needs to think about why this situation even exists.

The entire reason Orlando in a Bengal is because the open market didn't value him as a LT...and the market might end up being pretty harsh on Jonah as well, especially right now since it requires giving up a pick to get him.

I saw on Sports Illustrated where one unnamed GM had this to say:

"He’s not a big man with long arms and he plays like it. He might not even be a tackle. So who trades for a player perhaps best suited to play an interior position when he’s insisting on playing left tackle? So far, nobody."

I don't think Jonah is doing himself any favors by publicly refusing to give RT a shot, given the current market and the draft coming up. 

[PDub80]

(03-29-2023, 05:17 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: “I’m not sure he said he doesn’t want to be with the team. These things happen. We’re going to try and get our best team out there. We hear his concerns, but at the end of the day we’ll just have to see where it all plays out and if he’s here we’re going to get our five best guys out there. We’ve obviously looked at our offensive line the last couple of years and really tried to strengthen it and I think we’ve done a great job with that. So we’ve got some good options.” - Katie Blackburn

I get the quote. Or, maybe I don't.... "Trade me" after a better player is signed for his spot and he will have to move positions 100% = "I don't want to be with the team".

I cannot believe she's trying to suggest that can be interpreted any other way.

[Bengalholic]

(03-29-2023, 05:58 PM)PDub80 Wrote: I get the quote. Or, maybe I don't.... "Trade me" after a better player is signed for his spot and he will have to move positions 100% = "I don't want to be with the team".

I cannot believe she's trying to suggest that can be interpreted any other way.

She's just being careful with the wording...trying to show a level of optimism.

[SunsetBengal]

(03-29-2023, 05:58 PM)PDub80 Wrote: I get the quote. Or, maybe I don't.... "Trade me" after a better player is signed for his spot and he will have to move positions 100% = "I don't want to be with the team".

I cannot believe she's trying to suggest that can be interpreted any other way.

Owner speak.  Think of it like "coach speak", just with more power and authority.

[Bengalholic]

(03-29-2023, 06:09 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Owner speak.  Think of it like "coach speak", just with more power and authority.

Yep.

[Frank Booth]

(03-29-2023, 05:32 PM)Stewy Wrote: Yeah and fans believe too much of what comes out of the coaches and Team Leaders mouthes.

Remember Joe and Zach praising the OLine's after the 2021 and 2022 seasons?  Nothing but good things to say, which peeved the chicken littles here right off.  Then the Bengals went out and made changes.

Sorry Nate, but if you're overreacting to what BC and FP are saying when FA/FO are still going on and there still the draft to go, then you're a chicken little.

like when people say Cordell Volson is really good and reference Ted Karras saying Volson will be one of the best in the league as proof 

[Bengalbug]

(03-29-2023, 06:21 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: like when people say Cordell Volson is really good and reference Ted Karras saying Volson will be one of the best in the league as proof 

Who has said volson is really good? Being average on a rookie contract is different than average at a franchise tag cost. The two are not compareable.

Only bengals fans.

[puddycat]

I gotta admit I'm curious about the situation. Does he really think he's gonna be fully healthy by the start of the season? He had surgery (yesterday?) and should be cleared by June. The Bengals are locked into paying him 12M to spend a year getting totally healthy. If the market is soft he can get a prove-it deal. I mean, he's a 25 yr. old starting LT; he's gonna get a chance. If he can even kind of prove it, he'll get a multiyear deal.

[Luvnit2]

(03-29-2023, 04:07 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: There aren't many teams that have 12 million in cap space to trade him to. So I don't know. I feel like we'd know if there was a deal.

The combination of injury history, salary, and 1 year rental status make trading him much harder. Not saying it's impossible. But, it's harder.

Did you know the Bengals could eat some of 2023 salary? Would a team be willing to trade for him if Bengals piad 4 or 5 million of the 12.6 million?

Maybe not an option for our FO, but it is an option.

As far as knowing, we have a tight lipped FO and my belief is they may nix any team with loose lips.

 I think you are others are going on the assumption the Bengals are desperate and want him gone. Me, I am not so sure about that as based our injuries derailing last 2 seasons, we can't get enough quality OL and especially OT's.

[Frank Booth]

(03-29-2023, 06:57 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: Who has said volson is really good?  Being average on a rookie contract is different than average at a franchise tag cost. The two are not compareable.

Only bengals fans.

He's not even average. He's below average

and Im sure it was Nate or something lol Im not gonna go back and check, but basically the poster said

"I'll take Karras' word over yours about Volson eventually becoming one of the best in the league"

because Karras put a ton of praise on Volson not knowing it's just player speak

[Bengalbug]

(03-29-2023, 07:25 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: He's not even average. He's below average

and Im sure it was Nate or something lol Im not gonna go back and check, but basically the poster said

"I'll take Karras' word over yours about Volson eventually becoming one of the best in the league"

because Karras put a ton of praise on Volson not knowing it's just player speak

If volson is below average so is Jonah. One just is a significantly more important position

[Frank Booth]

(03-29-2023, 08:45 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: If volson is below average so is Jonah. One just is a significantly more important position

Jonah has proven to be average/above average when healthy. It's just a position that is more prone to giving up sacks

man, it's like talking to a wall