Jonah Williams Requests Trade

[Soonerpeace]

A lot of teams are hesitant to trade for Jonah not knowing how the draft may fall. So many possibilities. One team may be eyeing a tackle in the second or third round or even the first and it not break right. Or their original plans were to draft one but a great WR or Edge rusher is available and they go there. I think we will know after the draft.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-05-2023, 07:20 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Yeah, I hadn't heard that either. I feel like if someone offered a 3rd, Jonah would already be on that team. Lol

I would think so, I am sure the coaches have talked with Jonah since the trade request and made it all good if he does stay even 
if it seems highly unlikely. I bet we trade Jonah after day 1 of the Draft. Should be a very interesting Draft as I think we could go in 
a lot of different ways than we might think if Darnell Wright isn't there at 28.

(04-05-2023, 07:23 PM)tms Wrote: If Jonah truly wants out and there's a team out there that wants him, I really hope the Bengals can work out a deal. Take the best offer and move on.

Yes, I just think we aren't trying to tip our hats at all with what we are going to do. I sure as heck didn't see the Orlando Brown signing 
nor did anyone this FA. No matter how it happened, it was a good move for the Bengals and honestly Orlando. His style of play actually 
fits the way Burrow plays and should make him look even better than he did with the Chiefs.

Mahomes drops back deep, Burrow not near as much and Burrow WILL run around but not near like Mahomes. Burrow has currently the
quickest release in the league with Brady retiring again.

[jj22]

Drafting an OT will lower Jonah's trade value. If he isn't traded, I can't see them taking an OT early. Theoretically we can get an OT in the 2024 draft with as many as we have signed already. OG is much more of a need now. Not only to challenge Volson, but to back up both Volson and Cappa. We right now don't have a legitimate backup for either.

[Soonerpeace]

(04-06-2023, 09:56 AM)jj22 Wrote: Drafting an OT will lower Jonah's trade value. If he isn't traded, I can't see them taking an OT early. Theoretically we can get an OT in the 2024 draft with as many as we have signed already. OG is much more of a need now. Not only to challenge Volson, but to back up both Volson and Cappa. We right now don't have a legitimate backup for either.

Ford and Carman both can play guard. That’s always going to be the case with backups being swing players. I agree that it could hurt our leverage with Jonah if we draft a tackle. But the drafting of a right tackle means more from a long term perspective. They need to solidify that spot long term. Hopefully a clearer picture emerges before the draft. But they are going to draft a TE at 28 unless the top 3 or 4 are gone.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(04-06-2023, 11:23 AM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Ford and Carman both can play guard. That’s always going to be the case with backups being swing players. I agree that it could hurt our leverage with Jonah if we draft a tackle. But the drafting of a right tackle means more from a long term perspective. They need to solidify that spot long term. Hopefully a clearer picture emerges before the draft. But they are going to draft a TE at 28 unless the top 3 or 4 are gone.

Carman was awful at guard and Ford has been poor everywhere he's lined up. Kinda like Adeniji. 

Scharping is still our best reserve IOL. That is scary. 

For me, biggest holes: TE1, RB2, OG4, QB2
Upgrades: CB4-5, pass rush help, WR depth, DT/NT depth, P

RT only if stud falls to us R1. Otherwise,,stick with Jonah/Carman/Collins/Ford.

[Soonerpeace]

(04-06-2023, 12:28 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Carman was awful at guard and Ford has been poor everywhere he's lined up. Kinda like Adeniji. 

Scharping is still our best reserve IOL. That is scary. 

For me, biggest holes: TE1, RB2, OG4, QB2
Upgrades: CB4-5, pass rush help, WR depth, DT/NT depth, P

RT only if stud falls to us R1. Otherwise,,stick with Jonah/Carman/Collins/Ford.

The problem is we have solid guards. Volson after the first KC game PFF “Volson had his highest-graded game of the season on Sunday in a massive win over the Chiefs," Mike Renner wrote. "He didn’t allow a single pressure on 42 pass-blocking snaps and finished with a 77.2 run-blocking grade." Volson had an above average second half of the season for a rookie. No reason to be overly concerned about him. RT on the other hand has 1. Collins with a bad back that limited his practicing all year, and ACL and MCL surgery, 2. Jonah Williams… unlikely to be on the roster but if so no experience at RT and injury ridden, Jackson Carman who also has not RT experience, and Cody Ford who has not been good enough to stick with the Cardinals and the Bills and in the NFL has played mostly guard. But it’s the fact that none seem a long term answer.

So I’d rank 1A RT/TE 1B CB as BPA at 28. I think it’s really tied to who they think can most help this team immediately.

[Sled21]

(04-06-2023, 01:16 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: The problem is we have solid guards. Volson after the first KC game PFF “Volson had his highest-graded game of the season on Sunday in a massive win over the Chiefs," Mike Renner wrote. "He didn’t allow a single pressure on 42 pass-blocking snaps and finished with a 77.2 run-blocking grade." Volson had an above average second half of the season for a rookie. No reason to be overly concerned about him. RT on the other hand has 1. Collins with a bad back that limited his practicing all year, and ACL and MCL surgery, 2. Jonah Williams… unlikely to be on the roster but if so no experience at RT and injury ridden, Jackson Carman who also has not RT experience, and Cody Ford who has not been good enough to stick with the Cardinals and the Bills and in the NFL has played mostly guard. But it’s the fact that none seem a long term answer.

So I’d rank 1A RT/TE 1B CB as BPA at 28. I think it’s really tied to who they think can most help this team immediately.

Frank will be along shortly to tell you how much Volson sucks. Personally, I think his sophomore season is going to be very good.

[Soonerpeace]

(04-07-2023, 08:46 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Frank will be along shortly to tell you how much Volson sucks. Personally, I think his sophomore season is going to be very good.

Well you are right he will. Volson improved. The OL improved as a whole improved until the injuries. I’m with you on Volson’s second year. Coming from FCS and a rookie year was an adjustment. I’m excited to see his ascension

[Whatever]

(04-06-2023, 12:28 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Carman was awful at guard and Ford has been poor everywhere he's lined up. Kinda like Adeniji. 

Scharping is still our best reserve IOL. That is scary. 

For me, biggest holes: TE1, RB2, OG4, QB2
Upgrades: CB4-5, pass rush help, WR depth, DT/NT depth, P  

RT only if stud falls to us R1. Otherwise,,stick with Jonah/Carman/Collins/Ford.

Carman actually graded better as a rookie at RG than Volson did last year at LG.  He didn't allow a sack in the 1/2 season he played.  

[Whatever]

(04-06-2023, 01:16 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: The problem is we have solid guards. Volson after the first KC game PFF “Volson had his highest-graded game of the season on Sunday in a massive win over the Chiefs," Mike Renner wrote. "He didn’t allow a single pressure on 42 pass-blocking snaps and finished with a 77.2 run-blocking grade." Volson had an above average second half of the season for a rookie. No reason to be overly concerned about him. RT on the other hand has 1. Collins with a bad back that limited his practicing all year, and ACL and MCL surgery, 2. Jonah Williams… unlikely to be on the roster but if so no experience at RT and injury ridden, Jackson Carman who also has not RT experience, and Cody Ford who has not been good enough to stick with the Cardinals and the Bills and in the NFL has played mostly guard. But it’s the fact that none seem a long term answer.

So I’d rank 1A RT/TE 1B CB as BPA at 28. I think it’s really tied to who they think can most help this team immediately.

Jonah played RT for a season at 'bama.  

[Soonerpeace]

(04-07-2023, 10:02 AM)Whatever Wrote: Jonah played RT for a season at 'bama.  

Didn’t know that but awhile ago as a freshman. Now knowing this means he’s not a fan of it.

[*ochocincos*]

(04-06-2023, 09:56 AM)jj22 Wrote: Drafting an OT will lower Jonah's trade value. If he isn't traded, I can't see them taking an OT early. Theoretically we can get an OT in the 2024 draft with as many as we have signed already. OG is much more of a need now. Not only to challenge Volson, but to back up both Volson and Cappa. We right now don't have a legitimate backup for either.

Honestly, with the additions of Brown and Ford with the re-signing of Scharping, I wouldn't be surprised to see them skip drafting an OL altogether unless they can move Jonah before/during the draft.

Bengals normally keep 9 OL.

OT - Brown, Williams, Carman, Ford
OG - Cappa, Volson, Scharping
C - Karras, Hill

Once Collins is back healthy, they may either slot him in as the 10th OL, release him, or choose to let go of Scharping or Ford.
Another option would be trying to trade Jonah at the trade deadline, but only if Collins is back before then or Carman or Ford has shown enough to let Williams go.

[Forever Spinning Vinyl]

So is there a list of teams that may have a LT that's considered worse than JW?

[kalibengal]

(04-06-2023, 11:23 AM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Ford and Carman both can play guard. That’s always going to be the case with backups being swing players. I agree that it could hurt our leverage with Jonah if we draft a tackle. But the drafting of a right tackle means more from a long term perspective. They need to solidify that spot long term. Hopefully a clearer picture emerges before the draft. But they are going to draft a TE at 28 unless the top 3 or 4 are gone.

if they could hit in Draft for once on a highly selected  OT and have him on a rookie deal for a while thats the way to go.

[bengals1969]

(04-06-2023, 01:16 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: The problem is we have solid guards. Volson after the first KC game PFF “Volson had his highest-graded game of the season on Sunday in a massive win over the Chiefs," Mike Renner wrote. "He didn’t allow a single pressure on 42 pass-blocking snaps and finished with a 77.2 run-blocking grade." Volson had an above average second half of the season for a rookie. No reason to be overly concerned about him. RT on the other hand has 1. Collins with a bad back that limited his practicing all year, and ACL and MCL surgery, 2. Jonah Williams… unlikely to be on the roster but if so no experience at RT and injury ridden, Jackson Carman who also has not RT experience, and Cody Ford who has not been good enough to stick with the Cardinals and the Bills and in the NFL has played mostly guard. But it’s the fact that none seem a long term answer.

So I’d rank 1A RT/TE 1B CB as BPA at 28. I think it’s really tied to who they think can most help this team immediately.

Volson was terrific last season.  He looks to be the type of guy who learns fast and works harder.  

[bengals1969]

(04-07-2023, 11:52 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Honestly, with the additions of Brown and Ford with the re-signing of Scharping, I wouldn't be surprised to see them skip drafting an OL altogether unless they can move Jonah before/during the draft.

Bengals normally keep 9 OL.

OT - Brown, Williams, Carman, Ford
OG - Cappa, Volson, Scharping
C - Karras, Hill

Once Collins is back healthy, they may either slot him in as the 10th OL, release him, or choose to let go of Scharping or Ford.
Another option would be trying to trade Jonah at the trade deadline, but only if Collins is back before then or Carman or Ford has shown enough to let Williams go.

The Bengals really need to improve their pass defense at the front and back, that's to me job 1.  For the oline the best result is Williams plays lights out at RT, wins the starter job and Carman plays well and is a good backup to LT or RT.  Then a very sold front 5 for JoeB.  Draft a good rusher and DB at #28 and #60 and TE and RB later.  Maybe sneak in a OG in round 5 for the future and practice squad.

[Joelist]

The nice thing is 4 out of the 5 slots now have legit solid NFL starters in them. RT is up in the air and has a couple of possibilities:

1) Collins comes back 100% and in shape and plays like he used to.

2) Williams handles the spot and does it well to cash in in Free Agency.

3) Carman shows he can do it at RT (he showed last season he potentially can do it at LT).

4) Ford takes the "prove it" deal to heart and makes the RT spot his own.

[*ochocincos*]

(04-07-2023, 12:11 PM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: So is there a list of teams that may have a LT that's considered worse than JW?

Maybe a few? Here are the LTs currently for teams:

AFC North:
CIN - Orlando Brown
CLE - Wills
PIT - Dan Moore
BAL - Stanley

AFC East:
BUF - Dawkins
NE - Trent Brown
NYJ - Bekton
MIA - Armstead

AFC South:
HOU - Tunsil
TEN - Dillard I think (Although Vrabel said he'll have to "earn" the LT job)
IND - Raimann
JAX - Cam Robinson

AFC West:
LAC - Slater/Salyer
KC - Taylor (They said they were shifting him to LT at least)
LV - Miller
DEN - Bolles

NFC West:
ARZ - Humphries
LAR - Noteboom
SEA - Cross
SF - Trent Williams

NFC East:
NYG - Thomas
WAS - Leno
DAL - Tyler Smith
PHI - Mailata

NFC South:
NO - Hurst
ATL - Matthews
TB - ?? (was Donovan Smith but he still FA)
CAR - Ekwonu

NFC North:
MIN - Darrisaw
GB - Bakhtiari
DET - Sewell
CHI - Braxton Jones

The ones I think that COULD be possibilities are in bold. So I really only see 5 potential spots.
However, there are a few LTs I'd look to take in the draft before trading for Jonah - Peter Skoronski, Paris Johnson, Broderick Jones
You may be able to toss Anton Harrison in there too.

Here's where each of the bolded teams have their first draft pick:
TEN - 11th overall
NYJ - 13th overall
TB - 19th overall
NO - 29th overall
LAR - 36th overall

Jets and Titans are in a great position to get one of the three OTs I mentioned if they want a new guy instead of Becton/Dillard. 
Titans just signed Dillard, so I doubt they'll draft LT, but they might if they get their pick of the litter.
TB I think is a lock to draft an OT.
Lewan and Donovan Smith are out there to sign off the street if anyone doesn't get an OT they like and doesn't want to give up a draft pick.
Reports are New Orleans believe in Trevor Penning as potential future LT if he can stay healthy, but we'll have to see.

[Frank Booth]

(04-07-2023, 01:10 PM)bengals1969 Wrote: Volson was terrific last season.  He looks to be the type of guy who learns fast and works harder.  

Volson is a terrific player I agree

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-07-2023, 01:52 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Maybe a few? Here are the LTs currently for teams:

AFC North:
CIN - Orlando Brown
CLE - Wills
PIT - Dan Moore
BAL - Stanley

AFC East:
BUF - Dawkins
NE - Trent Brown
NYJ - Bekton
MIA - Armstead

AFC South:
HOU - Tunsil
TEN - Dillard I think (Although Vrabel said he'll have to "earn" the LT job)
IND - Raimann
JAX - Cam Robinson

AFC West:
LAC - Slater/Salyer
KC - Taylor (They said they were shifting him to LT at least)
LV - Miller
DEN - Bolles

NFC West:
ARZ - Humphries
LAR - Noteboom
SEA - Cross
SF - Trent Williams

NFC East:
NYG - Thomas
WAS - Leno
DAL - Tyler Smith
PHI - Mailata

NFC South:
NO - Hurst
ATL - Matthews
TB - ?? (was Donovan Smith but he still FA)
CAR - Ekwonu

NFC North:
MIN - Darrisaw
GB - Bakhtiari
DET - Sewell
CHI - Braxton Jones

The ones I think that COULD be possibilities are in bold. So I really only see 5 potential spots.
However, there are a few LTs I'd look to take in the draft before trading for Jonah - Peter Skoronski, Paris Johnson, Broderick Jones
You may be able to toss Anton Harrison in there too.

Here's where each of the bolded teams have their first draft pick:
TEN - 11th overall
NYJ - 13th overall
TB - 19th overall
NO - 29th overall
LAR - 36th overall

Jets and Titans are in a great position to get one of the three OTs I mentioned if they want a new guy instead of Becton/Dillard. 
Titans just signed Dillard, so I doubt they'll draft LT, but they might if they get their pick of the litter.
TB I think is a lock to draft an OT.
Lewan and Donovan Smith are out there to sign off the street if anyone doesn't get an OT they like and doesn't want to give up a draft pick.
Reports are New Orleans believe in Trevor Penning as potential future LT if he can stay healthy, but we'll have to see.

Thanks for this Ochocincos. Looks like there are about half a dozen possibilities in a trade for us.