RAS - Bengals 2023 starting OL least athletic in league

[*ochocincos*]

Kent Lee Platte, the creator of ras.football, posted on X/Twitter the average RAS scores for all OLs in the league for 2023.
Bengals OL came in dead last with an average RAS of 4.11 (poor).
The second-closest was Rams at 5.44.
Falcons had the most athletic bunch at 9.78.

Obviously, being the most athletic doesn't translate to "best," but it is useful if trying to understand how some teams may be able to get better.

What do you think, should the Bengals try to draft more athletic OL?

[Joelist]

So what? RAS is just another synthetic score. The correct question is whether the line fits the scheme.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

We did, with Ogbuehi and Fisher.

Kent even says that RAS isn't an end all be all: just another tool in evaluation.

Good athlete or not, the Bengals should draft linemen with great tape

[Hello to everyone]

(03-25-2024, 10:22 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Kent Lee Platte, the creator of ras.football, posted on X/Twitter the average RAS scores for all OLs in the league for 2023.
Bengals OL came in dead last with an average RAS of 4.11 (poor).
The second-closest was Rams at 5.44.
Falcons had the most athletic bunch at 9.78.

Obviously, being the most athletic doesn't translate to "best," but it is useful if trying to understand how some teams may be able to get better.

What do you think, should the Bengals try to draft more athletic OL?

Here we go, some guy named Kent Lee Platte has made up a stat and is pushing his twitter feed, gave the Bengals a bad score trying to get everybody upset and of course Bengal fans are going to oblige to it because we came in last. Cmon, (athletic offensive line) give me a break.

[SunsetBengal]

(03-25-2024, 11:26 AM)Hello to everyone Wrote: Here we go, some guy named Kent Lee Platte has made up a stat and is pushing his twitter feed, gave the Bengals a bad score trying to get everybody upset and of course Bengal fans are going to oblige to it because we came in last. Cmon, (athletic offensive line) give me a break.

RAS can be a valuable tool when evaluating players, however some context needs to be applied to it's usage on traditionally lesser athletic positions, such as OL.

[depthchart]

(03-25-2024, 10:22 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Kent Lee Platte, the creator of ras.football, posted on X/Twitter the average RAS scores for all OLs in the league for 2023.
Bengals OL came in dead last with an average RAS of 4.11 (poor).
The second-closest was Rams at 5.44.
Falcons had the most athletic bunch at 9.78.

Obviously, being the most athletic doesn't translate to "best," but it is useful if trying to understand how some teams may be able to get better.

What do you think, should the Bengals try to draft more athletic OL?

Doesn't Orlando Brown Jr have a really poor RAS score yet he is a Key Piece to the O-line ?

He fell to the 3rd round in part because he tested so poorly at his Combine.

I think the Bengals should lean on proven Free Agents at the Offensive Line positions and Draft other positions early

that they will be more likely to Hit on.  Just hitting on a player at any other position prevents having to get a Free Agent there.

Only Draft say a 1st round Offensive Lineman if it is a really SOLID prospect. (not developmental or riskier 1st rounders)

Use a 2nd round pick only when convinced that the Offensive Line prospect in the Best Player Available.

Take some Offensive Linemen for depth (say rounds 3 or 4 or 5) and hopefully a few of them end up being very good.

Every so often, if another guy that people thought should have been a 1st rounder is falling in the Draft (like Orlando Brown Jr did)

then maybe take that guy say in round 3 or 4. 

In General, lean of Proven Free Agents on the Starting O-line.

[*ochocincos*]

(03-25-2024, 11:35 AM)depthchart Wrote: Doesn't Orlando Brown Jr have a really poor RAS score yet he is a Key Piece to the O-line ?

He fell to the 3rd round in part because he tested so poorly at his Combine.

I think the Bengals should lean on proven Free Agents at the Offensive Line positions and Draft other positions early

that they will be more likely to Hit on.  Just hitting on a player at any other position prevents having to get a Free Agent there.

Only Draft say a 1st round Offensive Lineman if it is a really SOLID prospect. (not developmental or riskier 1st rounders)

Use a 2nd round pick only when convinced that the Offensive Line prospect in the Best Player Available.

Take some Offensive Linemen for depth (say rounds 3 or 4 or 5) and hopefully a few of them end up being very good.

Every so often, if another guy that people thought should have been a 1st rounder is falling in the Draft (like Orlando Brown Jr did)

then maybe take that guy say in round 3 or 4. 

In General, lean of Proven Free Agents on the Starting O-line.

RAS for the 5 OL last year:
OBJ - 0.71
Volson - 6.06
Karras - 5.15
Cappa - 2.93
Jonah - 5.48

I am not sure if they factored in anyone else that might have played some (e.g. Ford) or if maybe some of the guys didn't do some of the drills, as the average I calculate with the above 5 guys is 4.066 not 4.11. Still pretty close calculation.

[*ochocincos*]

(03-25-2024, 11:26 AM)Hello to everyone Wrote: Here we go, some guy named Kent Lee Platte has made up a stat and is pushing his twitter feed, gave the Bengals a bad score trying to get everybody upset and of course Bengal fans are going to oblige to it because we came in last. Cmon, (athletic offensive line) give me a break.

Umm...RAS has been used for a lot of teams and evaluations for 10+ years lol.
Check it out if you haven't before.

[*bfine32*]

I saw where the bottom 3 were:

Cleveland
Baltimore
Cincinnati

Coincidence?

[*Synric*]

(03-25-2024, 11:26 AM)Hello to everyone Wrote: Here we go, some guy named Kent Lee Platte has made up a stat and is pushing his twitter feed, gave the Bengals a bad score trying to get everybody upset and of course Bengal fans are going to oblige to it because we came in last. Cmon, (athletic offensive line) give me a break.

RAS is not really a stat. 

It takes the measurements and testing from the combine/pro days and shows where that player is relative to all the prospect testing for his position group.

[*ochocincos*]

(03-25-2024, 11:59 AM)Synric Wrote: RAS is not a stat. 

It takes the measurements and testing from the combine/pro days and shows where that player is relative to all the prospect testing for his position group.

Exactly.
I thought that since I provided the website in the OP that someone who may not have known what it is would have gone and looked that up...

It's why we don't see an OL not getting a poor score for not running a 4.5 40 yard dash or a RB not getting a good size score for not being 300 lbs or 35" arms or 6'6" tall.
It's based on the others at the position group.

[Jojo the Circus Boy]

Not a huge fan of RAS. You can measure well height and weight wise and run fast in the 40, but not do any bench, jumping, or agility drills and you are not penalized. So any athlete can pick the one drill they can nail and suddenly they have a great RAS.
Now if he mandated all drills be accomplished to get a score, it would have more merit athletically

[Hello to everyone]

(03-25-2024, 11:48 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Umm...RAS has been used for a lot of teams and evaluations for 10+ years lol.
Check it out if you haven't before.

I'll be honest with you, I can care less. Only thing I want them to do is pass block and run block, don't care if they weigh 800 lbs and have a ras score of negative 5000, as long as they can pass block and run block.

[Soonerpeace]

(03-25-2024, 10:22 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Kent Lee Platte, the creator of ras.football, posted on X/Twitter the average RAS scores for all OLs in the league for 2023.
Bengals OL came in dead last with an average RAS of 4.11 (poor).
The second-closest was Rams at 5.44.
Falcons had the most athletic bunch at 9.78.

Obviously, being the most athletic doesn't translate to "best," but it is useful if trying to understand how some teams may be able to get better.

What do you think, should the Bengals try to draft more athletic OL?

Yep I posted this the other day on another thread and discussed it with Frank Booth

[*ochocincos*]

(03-25-2024, 12:18 PM)Hello to everyone Wrote: I'll be honest with you, I can care less. Only thing I want them to do is pass block and run block, don't care if they weigh 800 lbs and have a ras score of negative 5000, as long as they can pass block and run block.

Fair, but it's no secret the Bengals OL isn't athletic enough to run a wide zone, which is what they had tried to run multiple times in the past.
Being limited athletically can force a team to operate in a certain way. It can also mean having difficulties when going against some faster, more athletic players on the opposite side of the ball.
That's what I take away from this.
But to your point, being the most athletic doesn't necessarily make someone a great player. That was stated in the OP and also stated by Kent himself. It's just a tool to help in evaluations.

EDIT - And Relative Athletic Score can help indicate if they have the athletic chops to succeed in pass blocking and/or run blocking that the team is asking them to do. For example, if you are asking your OL to move a good amount, they probably need to be pretty athletic to do that.

[*Synric*]

(03-25-2024, 12:11 PM)Jojo the Circus Boy Wrote: Not a huge fan of RAS. You can measure well height and weight wise and run fast in the 40, but not do any bench, jumping, or agility drills and you are not penalized. So any athlete can pick the one drill they can nail and suddenly they have a great RAS.
Now if he mandated all drills be accomplished to get a score, it would have more merit athletically

This has become a bigger issue in recent years but teams have been getting better numbers through different technologies like GPS tracking. I renewed my subscription to PFF this off-season because they have a new data point "GAS" they use visual tracking to measure how fast a player is on the field. 

[Hello to everyone]

(03-25-2024, 12:29 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Fair, but it's no secret the Bengals OL isn't athletic enough to run a wide zone, which is what they had tried to run multiple times in the past.
Being limited athletically can force a team to operate in a certain way. It can also mean having difficulties when going against some faster, more athletic players on the opposite side of the ball.
That's what I take away from this.
But to your point, being the most athletic doesn't necessarily make someone a great player. That was stated in the OP and also stated by Kent himself. It's just a tool to help in evaluations.

EDIT - And Relative Athletic Score can help indicate if they have the athletic chops to succeed in pass blocking and/or run blocking that the team is asking them to do. For example, if you are asking your OL to move a good amount, they probably need to be pretty athletic to do that.

Ok, fair enough. But as the saying goes (sometimes you have to many tools and not enough hands).

[*ochocincos*]

(03-25-2024, 02:14 PM)Hello to everyone Wrote: Ok, fair enough. But as the saying goes (sometimes you have to many tools and not enough hands).

Might be accurate given their tiny scouting department, but I don't think looking at RAS is too complicated or time consuming lol.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(03-25-2024, 12:18 PM)Hello to everyone Wrote: I'll be honest with you,I can care less. Only thing I want them to do is pass block and run block, don't care if they weigh 800 lbs and have a ras score of negative 5000, as long as they can pass block and run block.

So you DO care?

[Soonerpeace]

Let’s start with Orlando Brown. He was a 3 star in recruiting and he did awful at the combine.