Our O-Line Sucks

[THE Bigzoman]

(08-16-2016, 04:17 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Our Center sucks, get it right. Everyone else is very good. Need to replace the Center and the entire OL will be tops
in the league. Fisher, Ogbuehi and Westerman all could be great in the future and Whitworth, Boling and Zeitler are
all pretty damn good right now.

We could have lot worse problems.

To be less crass.


Your assessment of our line hinges on a lot of assumptions.

And also, i'll ask again, would you trust our line in a run heavy scheme?

[wolfkaosaun]

(08-17-2016, 02:39 AM)THE Bigzoman Wrote: To be less crass.


Your assessment of our line hinges on a lot of assumptions.

And also, i'll ask again, would you trust our line in a run heavy scheme?

I mean, we were a run heavy scheme in 2014 and had one of the best rushing attacks whenever Jeremy Hill started. In fact, he had the most rushing yards of any RB since November and December.

So. Yeah. I do.

It's also playing to their strengths. We can't act like O-lineman are asked to just block. There's different types and such. Such as zone blocking, and that's not everyone's strength.

There's a lot more key elements to blocking schemes.

[Jpoore]

(08-16-2016, 05:49 PM)jonesy84 Wrote: So do our RBs just suck?  I mean, I love the team, the whole team (including Oline), but why are we so average (or below average) on the ground?  If it's not the Oline's run blocking ability, is it the RBs ability?  Or just bad play call against the defense's play call (consistently)? 

I do not think our offensive line sucks nor do i think our running backs suck i think we have a top 3 rb tandem in nfl i think it is part of these 3 problems 1. We have generally always had a big arm qb since lewis was here palmer loved to sling it down the field and dalton likes to sling it as well 2. We play in the afc north which has always been known for the biggest touvhest men in thr trenches plus nobody plays in domes so snow and rain factor in and 3. I think rbs slipped a little as far as fivhting throug contact last year i believe gio will get 1500 all purpose yards and hill will get 12-1500 yards tbis year

[jeremydc]

(08-17-2016, 04:23 AM)Jpoore Wrote: I do not think our offensive line sucks nor do i think our running backs suck i think we have a top 3 rb tandem in nfl i think it is part of these 3 problems 1. We have generally always had a big arm qb since lewis was here palmer loved to sling it down the field and dalton likes to sling it as well 2. We play in the afc north which has always been known for the biggest touvhest men in thr trenches plus nobody plays in domes so snow and rain factor in and 3. I think rbs slipped a little as far as fivhting throug contact last year i believe gio will get 1500 all purpose yards and hill will get 12-1500 yards tbis year

Even with our depleted Wr depth and run-first mentality, you are drinking some alcohol infused Kool-Aid.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(08-16-2016, 04:46 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Honestly, pass blocking is the only thing I care about because Hill can hit the holes quick enough and with enough power that the run blocking won't even need to be that great, but I'm worried about keeping Dalton upright and giving him time to drop back and throw.

He must've had a shortage of power and quickness last season.

[*SHRacerX*]

(08-17-2016, 03:14 AM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: I mean, we were a run heavy scheme in 2014 and had one of the best rushing attacks whenever Jeremy Hill started. In fact, he had the most rushing yards of any RB since November and December.

So. Yeah. I do.

It's also playing to their strengths. We can't act like O-lineman are asked to just block. There's different types and such. Such as zone blocking, and that's not everyone's strength.

There's a lot more key elements to blocking schemes.

This.  Very good points and that example proves it isn't 100% on the line.  When Hill was hitting the hole hard, the line looked great. I still wish I would see this:  throw the ball out of the unbalanced line formation.  When #74 was eligible for nearly the entire season, it generated some push in the running game but it became predictable.  

Back to topic:  I can't help but wonder if Zamp will be using more of what he saw out of Rudi Johnson?  Success with a true FB.  I hope Luc makes it for that reason.  

[Jpoore]

(08-17-2016, 05:52 AM)jeremydc Wrote: Even with our depleted Wr depth and run-first mentality, you are drinking some alcohol infused Kool-Aid.

It's actually not as insane as you might think in Giovanni Bernard's first 3 years 2 16 game seasons and 1 13 game season he has amassed 3340 yards or 1113 yards a season there abouts now factor in depleted wr depth he could potentially get another 387 yards over the course of the season that one is the easy assessment and much more probable with Jeremy hill it comes down to this if he can play like he did the last half of the 2014 season over the course of all next season then he gets 1500 but that's the question isn't it can he get back to that form???

[wolfkaosaun]

(08-17-2016, 05:52 AM)jeremydc Wrote: Even with our depleted Wr depth and run-first mentality, you are drinking some alcohol infused Kool-Aid.

I mean, they came close to it in 2014.

Gio had over 1000 all-purpose yards. Hill had over 1300 all-purpose yards as well.

Last year Gio had over 1200 all-purpose yards. And Hill only had over 800 all-purpose yards.

So it's not too crazy to believe once you look back on 2014. Plus Gio has gotten better and better as years have gone on.

[wolfkaosaun]

(08-17-2016, 08:32 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: This.  Very good points and that example proves it isn't 100% on the line.  When Hill was hitting the hole hard, the line looked great. I still wish I would see this:  throw the ball out of the unbalanced line formation.  When #74 was eligible for nearly the entire season, it generated some push in the running game but it became predictable.  

Back to topic:  I can't help but wonder if Zamp will be using more of what he saw out of Rudi Johnson?  Success with a true FB.  I hope Luc makes it for that reason.  

Even in 2014 you could tell that Hue impemented more of a zone blocking scheme in running situations, and Gio didn't excel at that. Actually, the line seemed to struggle a few times.

I believe he will, and that seems to be a strength to this team, especially with Hill. There were numerous times we've seen Hewitt make great blocks. I think Hewitt is going to be the most underrated piece to this offense in 2016.

[jonesy84]

So we are now trending toward thinking the Oline doesn't suck, that it is more likely questionable play calling? (ie calling for plays where the blocking techniques needed aren't really something our guys are particularly strong in?) Because I could agree with that idea...

[wolfkaosaun]

(08-17-2016, 03:30 PM)jonesy84 Wrote: So we are now trending toward thinking the Oline doesn't suck, that it is more likely questionable play calling? (ie calling for plays where the blocking techniques needed aren't really something our guys are particularly strong in?)  Because I could agree with that idea...

Pretty much. In 2014 you could tell there were some blocking schemes that didn't suit some strengths. The Bengals run game struggled early on, but then you started to see different blocking and it helped out a lot.

Bodine is the weak link. But he didn't look too bad in preseason. But. It is preseason. And I'm not big on Ogubehi, but I actually really like Fisher at RT and think he is better suited there anyway.

[jonesy84]

(08-17-2016, 03:35 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: Pretty much. In 2014 you could tell there were some blocking schemes that didn't suit some strengths. The Bengals run game struggled early on, but then you started to see different blocking and it helped out a lot.

Bodine is the weak link. But he didn't look too bad in preseason. But. It is preseason. And I'm not big on Ogubehi, but I actually really like Fisher at RT and think he is better suited there anyway.

We should get a better feel for that tomorrow night, right?

[*SHRacerX*]

It seems both the new tackles were drafted with a zone blocking scheme in mind...more athletic, and less road-graders. Makes me wonder if they really thought Hue would leave?

[Goalpost]

For whatever reason roadgraders aren't as valued so highly throughout the league. The top two road grading guards in last year's draft, Vadal Alexander LSU and Landon Turner UNC, went in the 7th round and undrafted respectfully.

[Brownshoe]

The offensive line is only as good as its weakest link. When we have bad center play that makes our OL a lot worse than what some people try to act like.

[fredtoast]

(08-17-2016, 09:50 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: The offensive line is only as good as its weakest link. When we have bad center play that makes our OL a lot worse than what some people try to act like.

Actually this logic would imply that Bodine is one of the best pass blocking centers in the league.

[Brownshoe]

(08-17-2016, 10:12 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Actually this logic would imply that Bodine is one of the best pass blocking centers in the league.

Most of the pressures and sacks come from up the middle. Bodine is probably one of the worst starting centers in the league. He has been showing improvement over the last couple of years, but he's still a ways away from being one of the best pass blockers in the league.

[BFritz21]

Hopefully we draft someone like Pat Eifein out of OSU or Ethen Pocic out of LSU to shore-up our center position so we have a dominant line in 2017.

[fredtoast]

(08-17-2016, 10:28 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Most of the pressures and sacks come from up the middle. Bodine is probably one of the worst starting centers in the league. He has been showing improvement over the last couple of years, but he's still a ways away from being one of the best pass blockers in the league.

Then your claim that an O-line is only as strong as its weakest link is completely false.

Bengals have a very good pass blocking O-line.

[Emeritus]

I'm not going that far as of yet.
" We suck is a bit premature"
Maybe November