Most Excited I've Been in a LONG Time

[*bengalfan74*]

(06-15-2020, 08:47 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Not sure Ross will be counted on or even needed, but could be nice bonus if only. 

Yet think AJ Green, Tyler Boyd, and Tee Higgins  will be very formidable. 

The big "IF" in my mind is still the O-line giving Burrow time to utilize this strong WR group. 

You are right with questions about AJ and unproven Higgins, but think all will be well 

Yep, no matter how it's spun Ross is a big ?. 1. Can he stay on the field ? 2. While he's on the field which Ross will show up on a given play ? Don't get me wrong I'm not hating on him, I just have my doubts Ross is ever gonna be a solid contributor. 

And AJ concerns me as well. Not that he can't get it done anymore, I believe he can. But can he stay healthy ? I think Higgins is the type that will adapt fairly quickly and of course there's Boyd.

And another unanswered question is just what can Sample do ? We could be anywhere from top 10, hell even top 5 in receiver group. To just so-so ? And like you say much depends on the Oline.

[Fan_in_Kettering]

(06-16-2020, 08:58 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote:  And like you say much depends on the Oline.

Absolutely -- and it's not just the ability to keep Joe Burrow upright, either; the run blocking needs to be vastly improved as well.  Joe Mixon and Giovani Bernard are talented running backs but it still takes a sizable crease in the defensive line to spring a runner loose into the secondary.  First contact is still made far too early and that's especially why Bernard gets stuffed at the line so many times.  Even if a crease opens often a linebacker shoots the gap and gets to Mixon or Bernard.  This blocking scheme needs repaired fast.  Whenever I see Mixon or Bernard pulled down from behind I know someone missed a block.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-16-2020, 09:08 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Absolutely -- and it's not just the ability to keep Joe Burrow upright, either; the run blocking needs to be vastly improved as well.  Joe Mixon and Giovani Bernard are talented running backs but it still takes a sizable crease in the defensive line to spring a runner loose into the secondary.  First contact is still made far too early and that's especially why Bernard gets stuffed at the line so many times.  Even if a crease opens often a linebacker shoots the gap and gets to Mixon or Bernard.  This blocking scheme needs repaired fast.  Whenever I see Mixon or Bernard pulled down from behind I know someone missed a block.

All true, I think the run blocking will really improve this year after the way they improved last season as the year went on.

We get Jonah, XSF, Adeniji and Fred Johnson added while younger players like MJ can grow into hopefully mid tier OL.

Plus we should be running out of the Shotgun a lot more with Burrow and Mixon seems to really exceed at this.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(06-16-2020, 02:37 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: All true, I think the run blocking will really improve this year after the way they improved last season as the year went on.

We get Jonah, XSF, Adeniji and Fred Johnson added while younger players like MJ can grow into hopefully mid tier OL.

Plus we should be running out of the Shotgun a lot more with Burrow and Mixon seems to really exceed at this.

And building on what you said about Mixon. During his last year at Oklahoma he ran always from shotgun/pistol formation, never once from behind center.

So its not a question of Mixon adapting to it, its a question of ZT adapting to calling it.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-17-2020, 07:41 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: And building on what you said about Mixon. During his last year at Oklahoma he ran always from shotgun/pistol formation, never once from behind center.

So its not a question of Mixon adapting to it, its a question of ZT adapting to calling it.

Yes sir and Taylor said that they are adapting the playcalls to what Burrow is comfortable with and what he did at LSU.

They were a Shotgun Offense most the time. Think it just might be a perfect fit for Mixon.

[Essex Johnson]

(06-17-2020, 08:36 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yes sir and Taylor said that they are adapting the playcalls to what Burrow is comfortable with and what he did at LSU.

They were a Shotgun Offense most the time. Think it just might be a perfect fit for Mixon.

The trend is shotgun for sure but you can;t get too one dimensional either... especially since Burrow should not be running too much if we want to keep our franchise QB intact...

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-23-2020, 02:49 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: The trend is shotgun for sure but you can;t get too one dimensional either... especially since Burrow should not be running too much if we want to keep our franchise QB intact...

Agree, just saying that Mixon has thrived running out of the Shotgun. 

Should be a perfect fit with the Offense Burrow ran at LSU being implemented here.

The coaches have been saying that it is similar to what we were already running, so not a big change for our guys at all.

[Essex Johnson]

(06-23-2020, 04:03 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Agree, just saying that Mixon has thrived running out of the Shotgun. 

Should be a perfect fit with the Offense Burrow ran at LSU being implemented here.

The coaches have been saying that it is similar to what we were already running, so not a big change for our guys at all.

interesting i thought i remember reading Mixon preferred to run out of under center.. but i could be wrong

[BURROWorBUST]

(06-14-2020, 07:46 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I agree with the OP, the team has made a wholesale change of philosophy, and is now taking a different approach to building a winning football team.  I'll never accuse the team of "tanking" or "playing opossum", but I really believe that last year Coach Taylor was just taking inventory, and calculating what he needed to have changed in order to put forth a winning team, going forward.

Obviously the team management bought into his strategy, as we've seen the most free agency activity in as long as I can remember, as well as a draft that looked to me to be very driven and calculated.  I think that the prospects of the Bengals doing "great things" this year are fair to middling, but we will see a team that gets stronger and gains momentum as the season progresses, giving everyone watching the confidence to know that we will be a force to be reckoned with for years.

The drawback as I see it, is the virus situation.  Getting the team together, as soon as possible is paramount to building that new collection of talent into a cohesive unit.

I've thought to same thing about Zac's approach to 2019. I think he reached his conclusion about Dalton by the end of the Rams game in London. Dalton was NOT the QB he wanted/needed in order to win. He brought him back after Ryan Finley convinced Zac that he wasn't the answer, either. By that time, we were aligned to land that most promising QB to come out of college for many years. 

Look at what we did in free agency! As the OP mentioned, we spent the most money on free agency in franchise history, and it was primarily spent on the defense. DJ Reader and Von Bell have to be regarded as the biggest of those signings, but Bynes could prove to have been just as big. 

It's a good day to say WHO DEY! 

[Daddy-O]

(06-15-2020, 09:40 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: One thing excites me and that is winning. If Joe can't do what AD did in year one after being locked out and a 2nd round pick, it is just another lost year.

I am happy the FO was more active in FA, but excited = winning, Everything else is just a smoke screen and I will be upset if we don't win more games than we lose.

I don't doubt Joe can do what Dalton did in year 1.  What I doubt is Joe will have the defense behind him Dalton had those first 5 years.  That is what will make the difference between winning and losing this year.  

99% of the time it always boils down to stopping the other team.  If they don't score they can't win.  Pretty simple really, and why historically the top defensive teams are always in the hunt.

[Daddy-O]

(06-15-2020, 10:24 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote: I was very excited to start the season but now I have this feeling that it’s gonna be half about politics.  Hopefully they do their disrespectful kneeling and then play the game without any other political crap being brought up by the NFL or the announcers.

Understand you don't want to see the politics on the field, so why bring it into the thread?

I was enjoying reading through the posts in this thread and for some reason now feel like the rest will spiral into the political abyss.  Hope I'm wrong.

[Wes Mantooth]

For those that feel Joe should match Andy's win total in year 1 (9 wins) for it to be considered a success, I think you really need to look at the big picture. Using a win total, and only a win total, as a measure for QB performance isn't at all practical. Obviously this is a team game, and obviously there is only so much Burrow can control and be held responsible for.

So lets take a look at look at a few things that surrounded Andy in 2011, that are not a direct reflection of his ability or success as QB.

-The defense in 2011 ranked 7th in yards allowed.

-The defense in 2011 ranked 9th in points allowed.

-The defense in 2011 ranked 10th in rushing yards allowed.

-Using metrics on PFO, the 2011 special teams group ranked 7th.

-The running back group in 2011 rushed for 1,547 yards. For comparison: 2019 = 1,307, 2018 = 1,413, 2017 = 1,200, 2016 = 1,510.

-The 2011 team featured an in his prime Andrew Whitworth, an in his prime Andre Smith, and Bobbie Williams. All of who would start on this 2020 roster.

-The 2011 team featured Mike Zimmer and Jay Gruden at the helm of their respective sides of the ball. The 2020 team features Brian Callahan and Lou Anarumo. (TBD....)

Why am I poiting these things out? Because all of them need to be accounted for when you consider or try to explain why 2011 was what it was (A 9 win season).

If you want to judge the TEAM on a win total this is more than fair. If you want to assign a pre-determined benchmark, or compare season A vs season B, then that makes perfect sense. But when you start using a team stat to define the success of an individual player then it becomes entirely unfair.

Andy Dalton's TEAM went 9-7 and had a pretty successful season. This is true. He threw 3,338 yards, had a 58.1% completion %, and had 20 TD's vs 13 INT's. Good for a respectable 80.4 rating. This is also true.

Now let's post a hypothetical season for Joe Burrow and the Bengals in 2020, and then really compare the two:

Joe and the Bengals go 7-9. The defense ranks 14th (vs. 7th in 2011), the special teams ranks 16th (vs. 7th in 2011), and Joe throws for 3,900 yards with 27 TD's and 13 INT's, with a 63 completion %, and a 89 QB rating.

He lost two more games than Andy. But he threw over 500 more yards, with 7 more TD's, a 5% higher completion %, and a 9 pt higher QB rating. Are you really going to say Andy had the more successful season just because his team won 2 more games? Couldn't that be explained by the differences surrounding him?

If Joe Burrow gets a 7th ranked defense, a 7th ranked special teams, a run game that produces more yards than in any of the others in the last 5 years, and he gets comparible OL play, then and only then can I think you judge him on wins.

It seems "some people" go out of their way to place unreasonable expectations on Joe Burrow. It's almost as if they want to see him fail. "Some people" hold him soley responsible for the teams success. "Some people" expect him throw for 4000 yards and 40 TD's in year 1. "Some people" expect the playoffs immediately, despite the fact this team is coming off a franchise worst 2 wins, and 4 straight losing seasons.

Let me tell you something: "Some people" have agendas. "Some people" are butthurt Andy is gone so they throw out these numbers like demands, in order for them to feel ok that we've moved on. "Some people" need to get over it, and give this kid a fair shake. Cuz none of this is at all fair or objective. It's nonsense.

[fredtoast]

(06-24-2020, 12:21 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote:  Obviously this is a team game, and obviously there is only so much Burrow can control and be held responsible for.  

You need to tell that to the crowd around here who claim "Good QBs make everyone around them better" or "leadership and swagger" win games.


That is what "some people" used to say in order to blame Dalton for every problem on the team.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-23-2020, 08:00 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: interesting i thought i remember reading Mixon preferred to run out of under center.. but i could be wrong

Mixon runs his best out of the Shotgun, did so in college and has done so for the Bengals when it has been called.