Good info into the Dunlap saga

[BengalsFanRealist2855]

Someone will have to pay for this losing season,and itll be lou , probably after a few more losses because of the defense.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 01:48 AM)samhain Wrote: I agree with you 90 percent of the time on most things Bengal related.  In this case, not so much.

To the first point, I don't hire a DC that makes adjustments to toss in special packages for 2 guys making a combined 25 million per year.  They are part of the base defense and to some extent dictate what you run, if you're smart anyway.  

I blame the FO for that much.

Other than that, I lay the blame on the staff.  

Zac gets the most.  Whatever happened when they interviewed DC candidates for that excruciating stretch that ended with Lou was a slow-motion abortion.  Why didn't anyone want to be his DC?  Why did we end up with some guy that has never had that title before?  Was it Zac's ego and him not wanting to deal with a respected vet DC possibly detracting from his locker-room authority?  I have no idea, but it was no good at all and will need to be rectified sooner than later.  

IMO this staff has less than zero to complain about in terms of the Brown family, and lord knows I've never been a defender of that bunch.  They backed up a damn Brink's truck to help Lou's incompetent ass build the kind of defense he wanted.  They then gave him 2 new linebackers immediately after getting Burrow and Higgins.  They spent heavily in every tier of free agency all the way through camp.  Marvin Lewis wishes that they gave him that kind of juice even once in his time here, and Zac and his crew got it in year 1.  Zac also got to gut the staff in ways we've never seen here.  

I'm not on board with canning Zac yet.  His play calling seems to be maturing gradually.  The offense shows signs of being great in the near future.  That said, if anything, I think the family needs to exert some power when it comes to his pals on the staff.  These guys are the dregs of the league.  If Zacky Boy can't see that, then they need to save him from himself and show Lou the door along with Golden.  If Zac can't get on board, he can go, too.  I imagine any number of coaches old and young would love a shot at coaching Burrow over the next few years.  

This I agree with totally. We're not far off here in the grand scheme. As to the DC hire.... I'm not sure if it was Zac, the FO, or the record breaking defense that was already here that turned away better candidates. It's hard to say there, because Zac was inexperienced, the FO was notorious, and even Marvin himself couldn't do much with the talent, or lack thereof, that was here. It was a perfect storm.

From watching that podcast, it seems the staff and player were ready to move on last season, and the FO dug in its heels again.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-29-2020, 02:09 PM)cincyfan429 Wrote: So you think Mike Brown is going out there, and spending money on a big name defensive end. Never happen money straight to his pocket.

It won't be straight to his pocket, it will go toward extending an internal guy, potentially overpaying based on who it is.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-30-2020, 10:13 AM)Wyche Wrote: This I agree with totally. We're not far off here in the grand scheme. As to the DC hire.... I'm not sure if it was Zac, the FO, or the record breaking defense that was already here that turned away better candidates. It's hard to say there, because Zac was inexperienced, the FO was notorious, and even Marvin himself couldn't do much with the talent, or lack thereof, that was here. It was a perfect storm.

From watching that podcast, it seems the staff and player were ready to move on last season, and the FO dug in its heels again.

Well, can you blame them? Dunlap should be better than the likes of Khalid Kareem, Amani Bledsoe, and Margus Hunt.
This is yet another case of Bengals trying to fit square pegs into round holes rather than adapt the playcalling to the strength of the players.

Put yourself in Dunlap's shoes.
You're a near-perfect fit as a 4-3 DE. The DC uses you as an OLB, of which you have not really played. As such, you don't produce like you're used to because it's new to you. 
At the end of the day, he didn't want to be converted to an OLB. Given his age, he doesn't really have many more years left, so he wants to play the way he likes. It's his career. He shouldn't have to do something he doesn't want to.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(10-29-2020, 07:10 PM)Nately120 Wrote: The Lions have won 9 games in a span where we have won 3.  The luxury of trading unhappy players to worse teams isn't really in the cards at the moment.

Funny looking 6 you wrote there

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 10:42 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Well, can you blame them? Dunlap should be better than the likes of Khalid Kareem, Amani Bledsoe, and Margus Hunt.
This is yet another case of Bengals trying to fit square pegs into round holes rather than adapt the playcalling to the strength of the players.

Put yourself in Dunlap's shoes.
You're a near-perfect fit as a 4-3 DE. The DC uses you as an OLB, of which you have not really played. As such, you don't produce like you're used to because it's new to you. 
At the end of the day, he didn't want to be converted to an OLB. Given his age, he doesn't really have many more years left, so he wants to play the way he likes. It's his career. He shouldn't have to do something he doesn't want to.

Do I blame Carlos? No, not at all, given the recent information. Do I blame the FO for not moving him last season when we could've gotten a better deal? Absolutely. It's a rebuild. There were always going to be some old players that didn't fit into the new direction of said rebuild. You don't wax poetic about 2015, you get with program and move assets that don't fit the new direction, and acquire people that do and begin your rebuild according to the new staffs vision. They're a day late and a dollar short as usual. 

Once you do that, it's sink or swim for the coaching staff. 

[Sled21]

(10-30-2020, 10:57 AM)Wyche Wrote: Do I blame Carlos? No, not at all, given the recent information. 

I just love how everyone is taking what Carlos' dad says as gospel.... think his take might be a little biased?

[thillan]

I wonder how much this will impact FA next year. Seems like Dunlap is a well respected guy in the league, and he aired a bunch of dirty laundry on the team.

Burrow will draw some heads, but has Dunlap steered that same amount away?

[*Nately120*]

(10-30-2020, 10:54 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Funny looking 6 you wrote there

Ah they had 6 wins the year before...damn I really overestimated that squadron. 

[Sled21]

(10-30-2020, 11:07 AM)thillan Wrote: I wonder how much this will impact FA next year. Seems like Dunlap is a well respected guy in the league, and he aired a bunch of dirty laundry on the team.

Burrow will draw some heads, but has Dunlap steered that same amount away?

I think all that stuff is overrated anyway. Players are going to play where they make the most money.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 11:01 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I just love how everyone is taking what Carlos' dad says as gospel.... think his take might be a little biased?

I'm sure it is...but I'm fairly confident that there is a lot of truth in it too. I mean, he even admitted that there was strife and that Dunlap refused to adapt. It's not like he blamed the staff solely, he just said that they didn't mesh, and that they wanted to move on LAST year. That's what should've been done. It's really that simple.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(10-29-2020, 07:31 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: Have you watched LSU this year? LOL.

(10-29-2020, 07:43 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: LMAO, might as well be.... they're not even ranked one season removed from perfection. Maybe Joe CAN carry our sorry asses was the point....

Clearly, you guys haven't watched them.

Brennan isn't putting up Burrow numbers, but that offense is humming.

Bo Pelini is the reason and the ONLY reason why they DON'T have a single loss right now.

[Hoofhearted]

(10-30-2020, 11:11 AM)Wyche Wrote: I'm sure it is...but I'm fairly confident that there is a lot of truth in it too. I mean, he even admitted that there was strife and that Dunlap refused to adapt. It's not like he blamed the staff solely, he just said that they didn't mesh, and that they wanted to move on LAST year. That's what should've been done. It's really that simple.

Right, I didn't take it as absolute truth/fact, but there's some inclination of truth to what he said based off what we know how they've done business previously. There's always three sides to a story though, and two of them we'll never know. 

[Hoofhearted]

(10-30-2020, 10:54 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Funny looking 6 you wrote there

Quit looking at it upside down   

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 11:20 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Clearly, you guys haven't watched them.

Brennan isn't putting up Burrow numbers, but that offense is humming.

Bo Pelini is the reason and the ONLY reason why they DON'T have a single loss right now.

Yeah, I've watched em....I live in SEC country. I watched Miss St take em to the wood shed, and they haven't done squat since. I like Brennan, but he's no Joe B. That may be the difference.

[J24]

(10-30-2020, 10:42 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Well, can you blame them? Dunlap should be better than the likes of Khalid Kareem, Amani Bledsoe, and Margus Hunt.
This is yet another case of Bengals trying to fit square pegs into round holes rather than adapt the playcalling to the strength of the players.

Put yourself in Dunlap's shoes.
You're a near-perfect fit as a 4-3 DE. The DC uses you as an OLB, of which you have not really played. As such, you don't produce like you're used to because it's new to you. 
At the end of the day, he didn't want to be converted to an OLB. Given his age, he doesn't really have many more years left, so he wants to play the way he likes. It's his career. He shouldn't have to do something he doesn't want to.

Yeah I never understood the way they used Dunlap. Especially when he is so similar to a player that thrived in a similar system in JJ Watt.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(10-30-2020, 12:06 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: Yeah, I've watched em....I live in SEC country. I watched Miss St take em to the wood shed, and they haven't done squat since. I like Brennan, but he's no Joe B. That may be the difference.

But... Wyche... I just said.............

Seriously; they've put up 34, 41, 41 and 52. And I repeat, how is any of this the offense's fault?

Bo Pelini is a POS and is the *sole* reason why they aren't undefeated.

You do know who Bo Pelini is, right?

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 12:17 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: But... Wyche... I just said.............

Seriously; they've put up 34, 41, 41 and 52. And I repeat, how is any of this the offense's fault?

Bo Pelini is a POS and is the *sole* reason why they aren't undefeated.

You do know who Bo Pelini is, right?

Yep, the DC. Yeah, they've scored a bit, but that's against MSU, Vandy, Mizzou, and SCU. Not exactly murderers row. You're right, the defense is trash, but when you watch Joe Burrow, then and now, is it not a bit safe to say that he wins that game against MSU? They're still a good offense though, just not as good. Of course, to be fair, Joe isn't the only one gone off that unit. 

My post was more about responding to Burrow dragging this team to relevance, and how he was balling last year in Baton Rouge. Kind of a joke while giving a nod to number 9.

[TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes]

(10-30-2020, 01:48 AM)samhain Wrote: Zac gets the most.  Whatever happened when they interviewed DC candidates for that excruciating stretch that ended with Lou was a slow-motion abortion.  Why didn't anyone want to be his DC?  Why did we end up with some guy that has never had that title before?  

For the DC's first year the marquee free agency signings were BW Webb and Kerry Wynn and out of 11 picks the D co-ordinator got a 3rd round pick, a 4th round compensatory, a 6th round compensatory and the 7th round pick. How many DC are going to sign up for that to improve the 31st or 32nd ranked D?

It's likely DC candidates looked at that 31st or 32nd ranked D, looked at the void at linebacker, looked at the fact that Cincy had just appointed a Head Coach who was going to call plays on Offense and realized that the next couple of drafts would be offense heavy. They'd have then looked at the rest of talent on D (since 2014 the D has had just one first round pick and one second round pick) and Mike Brown's aversion to paying in free agency and run a mile.

Frankly I don't blame them and for my money that's on the front office and not Zac.

They should be in a much stronger position to attract a good DC this off-season with the acquisition of Reader and the emergence of Bates and a probable top 10 pick to spend on D to dangle in front of candidates.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(10-30-2020, 12:26 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: Yep, the DC. Yeah, they've scored a bit, but that's against MSU, Vandy, Mizzou, and SCU. Not exactly murderers row. You're right, the defense is trash, but when you watch Joe Burrow, then and now, is it not a bit safe to say that he wins that game against MSU? They're still a good offense though, just not as good. Of course, to be fair, Joe isn't the only one gone off that unit. 

My post was more about responding to Burrow dragging this team to relevance, and how he was balling last year in Baton Rouge. Kind of a joke while giving a nod to number 9.

He absolutely does; I feel bad for Brennan because he's had a really good season on the whole, but now with the torn muscle, who know if he even plays another down this year? (he can play through the injury, but should he?).

Anyways, I was beyond-stunned after that opening loss; Pelini is trash.