Camp Battles

[Fan_in_Kettering]

(07-20-2017, 10:03 AM)SHRacerX Wrote:   I hope JJ can show some of what the Bengals believe he can be.  Love that he can supposedly play any position on the line.  

I totally forgot this is the case.  While JJ Dielman is a natural center, he can also play guard or tackle although, as I understand it, he's a  better guard than he is a tackle.  Being able to play any position on the offensive line is yuge; it means he's smart because the footwork for each of the five positions is different.  

[*bengalfan74*]

A lot of interesting camp battles for sure. But in my opinion none are more important than the O-line ! I hope we put the best 5 out there and don't just go with the pet projects and/or who MB says is playing.

It all hinges on the O-line

[jeremydc]

(07-20-2017, 10:06 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I don't understand why you would draft Willis and Lawson in the 3rd and 4th round to sit on the bench.  It makes no sense to trot Dunlap and MJ (especially MJ) out there for 97% of the snaps.  I think Willis and Lawson will get significant snaps this season and will push the starters to up their game.  Right now, they are both stronger and faster than the starters. Especially Willis.

Bengals logic

[sandwedge]

Our kicker battle will be very interesting. Remember we lost at least 3 games last year because of missed of Fg.

As for O-line, I don't really see any battles in TC, unless someone really shines. Our starters are pretty much written n stone already. D-line, well that don't really matter because of playing a rotation, not that there won't interesting stories, but everyone should play a lot. I'm not down on MJ as much as some are, because they had him dropping back into coverage a lot last year. Hard to rush the QB when you're dropping into coverage.

[*Synric*]

I take the consensus on the WR subject that most of you believe Lafell will be pushed out on that I disagree I think Lafell is the a better receiver than Tyler Boyd. He brings a more physical presence blocking and as a receiver not to mention his versatility being able to play inside and out, redzone threat, yards after catch, yards after contact....yadda yadda lolol.

Some other interesting competitions brought up. Safety was mentioned I understand Shawn Williams had a down year compared to Reggie Nelson's 2015 season but he got better and better as the season continued.(Reminds me of Kirkpatricks first starting season in 2015.)

Bodine will be the starter in 2017 barring injury I dont see a change, but JJ Dielman was a interesting pick to me. Dielman is alot different than most Oline (especially interior) picks we've seen from the Bengals less of a powerhouse and more athletic. Im very interested to see his progress.

Willis will get his share of snaps this season and most likely behind MJ at RDE. Clarke will probably move over to the LDE to backup Dunlap and move inside to rush the passer the same snaps that Hunt got in the preseason last year.

[corpjet]

Lets be honest Boyd was underused like all rookies are with the Bengals.............Boyd will have a bigger role and will more than exceed expectations......

On the defensive side we need the young guys to step up, honestly if Michael Johnson is our starting DE opposite #96 we are in trouble.

[Whatever]

(07-20-2017, 07:47 PM)Synric Wrote: I take the consensus on the WR subject that most of you believe Lafell will be pushed out on that I disagree I think Lafell is the a better receiver than Tyler Boyd. He brings a more physical presence blocking and as a receiver not to mention his versatility being able to play inside and out, redzone threat, yards after catch, yards after contact....yadda yadda lolol.

Some other interesting competitions brought up. Safety was mentioned I understand Shawn Williams had a down year compared to Reggie Nelson's 2015 season but he got better and better as the season continued.(Reminds me of Kirkpatricks first starting season in 2015.)

Bodine will be the starter in 2017 barring injury I dont see a change, but JJ Dielman was a interesting pick to me. Dielman is alot different than most Oline (especially interior) picks we've seen from the Bengals less of a powerhouse and more athletic. Im very interested to see his progress.

Willis will get his share of snaps this season and most likely behind MJ at RDE. Clarke will probably move over to the LDE to backup Dunlap and move inside to rush the passer the same snaps that Hunt got in the preseason last year.

I have to agree on Boyd.  LaFell was a much better player last year, and it was the first year in the offense for both.  Boyd will have to show a great deal of improvement to take reps from LaFell.  Indications would seem to hint at the staff not being too enamored with Boyd.  They wouldn't have reupped LaFell and then spent a Top 10 pick on Ross and a 4th on Malone if they were happy with Boyd.

With the current depth at DT, I can also see them kicking Hardison to LDE to back up Dunlap.

[StLucieBengal]

LaFell vs Boyd.

Ross will get his once he is able to play, and as long as he is competent, I wonder how many snaps LaFell will take away from Boyd in the slot. I can't see LaFell dropping to #4.

Hill vs Mixon

really isn't a battle until Gio gets in the mix. And obviously Mixon and Gio are the future.

Nickel front will also be interesting to see who joins Carlos s and Geno.

Excited to see how Billing's does this preseason.

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-20-2017, 11:22 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: I totally forgot this is the case.  While JJ Dielman is a natural center, he can also play guard or tackle although, as I understand it, he's a  better guard than he is a tackle.  Being able to play any position on the offensive line is yuge; it means he's smart because the footwork for each of the five positions is different.  

Yep.  He was someone that wasn't on any of our radar (from what I remember), but the Bengals seem to think very highly of him.  The more I learn about him, the more I like him and I think he will bust his butt to not only make the team but become a starter.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-20-2017, 11:46 AM)jeremydc Wrote: Bengals logic

I felt this way in the past when the likes of Robert Geathers was trotted out there time and time again over Dunlap.  Marv seemed to hint that it had to do with practice habits and maturity.  Regardless, it must have worked as Dunlap is one of our best players.

Core and Boyd got extensive playing time as rookies, and you can bet Ross and Mixon will this year also.  I hope Willis and Lawson get pass rushing opportunities early and prove their worth so the real rotation can be in full effect.  I think that is such a tremendous advantage to be able to run out fresh (or at least fresh-er) guys late in a game against offensive lineman that have been getting pounded all game long.  

[PV Bengal]

(07-20-2017, 11:44 PM)Whatever Wrote: I have to agree on Boyd.  LaFell was a much better player last year, and it was the first year in the offense for both.  Boyd will have to show a great deal of improvement to take reps from LaFell.  Indications would seem to hint at the staff not being too enamored with Boyd.  They wouldn't have reupped LaFell and then spent a Top 10 pick on Ross and a 4th on Malone if they were happy with Boyd.

With the current depth at DT, I can also see them kicking Hardison to LDE to back up Dunlap.

We've got to remember that (1) Boyd was a rookie last year; (2) Ross was probably the best player available when we picked him; and (3) you can't coach speed.

IMHO, Boyd did fine in his first year and you need depth. Had they not re-upped LaFell, they would need to start Ross immediately in 3 WR sets.

[Essex Johnson]

(07-19-2017, 07:39 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Camp battles always make a team better.  Remember the almost-battle between Andy Dalton and AJ McCarron two summers ago?  There's no doubt AJ made Andy a better quarterback and 2015 was an amazing year for the Bengals.

My camp battle du jour for 2017 will involve Russell Bodine and JJ Dielman for the starting center position.  Now being next to Andre Smith at right guard will make most any center better but I give JJ better than even odds at earning the starting position.  If he doesn't, this will push Russell into a level of play he hasn't been able to reach yet.

Have to disagree with you one there is not a thing called Almost Camp battle AJ was in no position to take Andy's job if remember Andy mentioned you had a really good offseason workouts and things clicked that year that's what made it a great season AJ had no effect on Andy's performance in 2015

[Essex Johnson]

(07-20-2017, 10:06 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I don't understand why you would draft Willis and Lawson in the 3rd and 4th round to sit on the bench.  It makes no sense to trot Dunlap and MJ (especially MJ) out there for 97% of the snaps.  I think Willis and Lawson will get significant snaps this season and will push the starters to up their game.  Right now, they are both stronger and faster than the starters. Especially Willis.

They will play especially Willis in a rotation as long as they perform the Bengals one more rotation at the offensive line but hunt and others have not perform that is why you saw increase reps with Johnson and Dunlap last year. 
Lawson on the other hand could see limited time because remember he might be a hybrid learning linebacker in this system also it might take a little bit more time for him to get on the field but I could see him in specific down situations getting on the field earlier.
This idea of the Bengals just sit rookies because the rookies is a total misconception there are a lot of variables that go into playing time

[jeremydc]

(07-21-2017, 09:22 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I felt this way in the past when the likes of Robert Geathers was trotted out there time and time again over Dunlap.  Marv seemed to hint that it had to do with practice habits and maturity.  Regardless, it must have worked as Dunlap is one of our best players.

Core and Boyd got extensive playing time as rookies, and you can bet Ross and Mixon will this year also.  I hope Willis and Lawson get pass rushing opportunities early and prove their worth so the real rotation can be in full effect.  I think that is such a tremendous advantage to be able to run out fresh (or at least fresh-er) guys late in a game against offensive lineman that have been getting pounded all game long.  

Offensive rookies tend to get more playing time than defensive though. Besides Burflict, I can't recall any rookie d players getting significant playing time/ making an immediate impact. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

[XenoMorph]

(07-20-2017, 10:06 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I don't understand why you would draft Willis and Lawson in the 3rd and 4th round to sit on the bench.  It makes no sense to trot Dunlap and MJ (especially MJ) out there for 97% of the snaps.  I think Willis and Lawson will get significant snaps this season and will push the starters to up their game.  Right now, they are both stronger and faster than the starters. Especially Willis.

They will rotate in... but they say it takes about a year to fully learn the defense...  You got Billings coming in for playing time on the inside.

Willis  Will probly back up MJ and rotate with him.     Clarke with dunlap.    

And Lawson will come in on pass rushing downs.

[XenoMorph]

(07-21-2017, 11:45 AM)jeremydc Wrote: Offensive rookies tend to get more playing time than defensive though. Besides Burflict, I can't recall any rookie d players getting significant playing time/ making an immediate impact. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

Not lately because there hasn't been a need to immediately plug and play the rookies.

[Mike M (the other one)]

I wouldn't sleep on Jordan Evans, he won't be starting right away, but as the season go along. He'll earn his rotation status.
Lawson will get cut. Just doesn't get it, it takes work to be better. No one wanted him last year when he was cut and then signed to PS. He's a headache.

[Whatever]

(07-21-2017, 10:29 AM)PV Bengal Wrote: We've got to remember that (1) Boyd was a rookie last year; (2) Ross was probably the best player available when we picked him; and (3) you can't coach speed.

IMHO, Boyd did fine in his first year and you need depth. Had they not re-upped LaFell, they would need to start Ross immediately in 3 WR sets.

During the draft process, it was well known that the Bengals were looking hard at the top three WR prospects and it eventually leaked that Ross was their guy before the draft.  He may also have been the bpa on their board, but it wasn't a situation like Eifert or WJ3 where a guy fell further than expected and the Bengals nabbed him.

The year before, they were looking hard at speedsters Coleman and Fuller, and settled for Boyd in the 2nd because they desperately needed a #3 despite the fact Boyd didn't possess the deep speed they wanted.

Since Arians has taken over at OC, it's pretty obvious through the team's drafting that he doesn't feel the team has enough speed at the skill positions.  There was nobody that can make a guy miss and take a short throw to the house. They need a guy on the outside opposite AJ that will affect the other S and force them to cover Eifert, Gio, and Mixon with LB's.  They need a guy in the slot that the slot CB fears enough to give cushion to knowing he won't have help behind him.  Boyd is none of that.

[Whatever]

(07-21-2017, 01:17 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: I wouldn't sleep on Jordan Evans, he won't be starting right away, but as the season go along. He'll earn his rotation status.
Lawson will get cut. Just doesn't get it, it takes work to be better. No one wanted him last year when he was cut and then signed to PS. He's a headache.

You mean Dawson will get cut?

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-21-2017, 11:45 AM)jeremydc Wrote: Offensive rookies tend to get more playing time than defensive though. Besides Burflict, I can't recall any rookie d players getting significant playing time/ making an immediate impact. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

On our team?  Very true...although we seemed to ignore the pass rushing DE by trying to get by with later round picks and never really investing in what is a key position on the defense.  Here's to hoping Willis and Lawson buck that trend.