Bengals working out TE's

[Sled21]

(10-17-2017, 11:33 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: But can he block?. A TE blocks a ton more than being targeted to catch a pass.

Yes and no. That was the only knock on him coming out of college, was that he needed to improve his blocking. His sheet says he has the size, and more importantly the willingness, to block, but needs to improve his technique. Technique can be improved, size and willingness can not...

[Sled21]

(10-17-2017, 12:10 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Especially a TE3/4. It's why the Bengals put so much value in guys like Kroft, Uzomah, and Hewitt.

That's true, but we also need one that can catch... Kroft and Hewitt can both catch, but are hurt. Uzomah scares me when he gets the ball thrown to him...

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(10-18-2017, 08:03 AM)Sled21 Wrote: That's true, but we also need one that can catch... Kroft and Hewitt can both catch, but are hurt. Uzomah scares me when he gets the ball thrown to him...

  Why?

And its not because of Hikutini bias am I questioning you, I'm actually curious as to why you're afraid lol.

[Sled21]

(10-18-2017, 09:16 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote:   Why?

And its not because of Hikutini bias am I questioning you, I'm actually curious as to why you're afraid lol.

Uh, because I don't trust him to catch it.....

[XenoMorph]

(10-16-2017, 10:11 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: Of course not. There's nothing wrong with the offensive line. We just need to play better 

only gave up 1 sack to the #1 defense in the league of the bills....  that's major improvement compared to seasons start.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-18-2017, 08:03 AM)Sled21 Wrote: That's true, but we also need one that can catch... Kroft and Hewitt can both catch, but are hurt. Uzomah scares me when he gets the ball thrown to him...

Except Hewitt is very rarely used as a pass catcher. Now should he be used more in that role? Probably, but the Bengals don't like to use him for anything besides a blocker for whatever reason.
Uzomah showed last year that he can catch.
And last, Cole Hikutini is off the table now, as he was just signed to the 49ers active roster a few days ago.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(10-18-2017, 09:21 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Uh, because I don't trust him to catch it.....

(10-18-2017, 09:21 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Uh, because I don't trust him to catch it.....

But why? Its not like he has a history of drops or fumbles or anything like that.

Hell, his only 2 drops (1 credited) were in a Stooler game that was sopping wet and EVERYONE was dropping balls.

[Sled21]

(10-18-2017, 10:06 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: But why? Its not like he has a history of drops or fumbles or anything like that.

Hell, his only 2 drops (1 credited) were in a Stooler game that was sopping wet and EVERYONE was dropping balls.

That may well be true. You asked me why and I told you, I don't trust him. That's simply because I have not seen him catch enough, it's not a hack on him. He's only caught 2 balls this season if I remember right. I watched Hikutini catch balls for a long time, so I figure when it goes to him, he's gonna catch it. Mind you, I'm not suggesting cutting any of our current TE's, just if we were going to bring one in I would have preferred Hikutini. But, evidently that is now off the table if SF activated him.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-18-2017, 10:30 AM)Sled21 Wrote: That may well be true. You asked me why and I told you, I don't trust him. That's simply because I have not seen him catch enough, it's not a hack on him. He's only caught 2 balls this season if I remember right. I watched Hikutini catch balls for a long time, so I figure when it goes to him, he's gonna catch it. Mind you, I'm not suggesting cutting any of our current TE's, just if we were going to bring one in I would have preferred Hikutini. But, evidently that is now off the table if SF activated him.

And you just made the argument for why the Bengals often keep certain players or bring back players they've had in the past vs bringing in or playing someone new.
It's a level of trust that they have due to what they've seen compared to what they haven't seen personally.
You really think the Bengals would trust some new TE to come in and catch passes over Kroft or Uzomah or Hewitt given they've been in the system and the coaches have seen them practice day in and day out?

With all that said, I feel the "trust/familiarity" thing often can doom a team from being willing to upgrade a position, and I'd argue that it has doomed the Bengals on multiple occasions.
How many times have we all complained about bringing back or sticking with a mediocre talent who knows the system like Maualuga, Bodine, etc when we've felt there were (far) better options to bring in from the outside?

[Sled21]

(10-18-2017, 10:42 AM)ochocincos Wrote: You really think the Bengals would trust some new TE to come in and catch passes over Kroft or Uzomah or Hewitt given they've been in the system and the coaches have seen them practice day in and day out?

I never said bring him in over any of them, I said if they are going to bring one in either in the draft and let him compete, or as a replacement due to those guys being injured, he is the one I would pick. Eifert's out, Kroft and Hewitt are dinged up. Someone is going to have to play tight end, and I'd take Cole Hikutini over Cethan Carter all day long.... but again, it's a moot now as he is now on SF's 53 man roster.

[Foolishpride]

How about Chase Coffman? He was supposedly this stud pass catcher coming out of college, and he never saw the field. The excuse was that he couldn't block. Now we want a "Pass Catching" Tight End. Maybe he was Bengalized like many others!

[Shake n Blake]

(10-18-2017, 07:53 AM)Air Force 1 Wrote: Where is Sean Brewer when you need him???

On a smoke break.

[bengalhoel]

(10-18-2017, 07:53 AM)Air Force 1 Wrote: Where is Sean Brewer when you need him???

I wonder if he ever quit smoking?  LMAO

[*ochocincos*]

A lot of people also care more about pass catching TEs over blocking TEs because of fantasy football. For a long time, this went against the grain for what the Bengals prioritized in TE. As fantasy football grew in popularity, more and more people were clamoring for the Bengals to get a TE that could be a receiving threat. They tried with Chase Coffman, but he couldn't block worth a damn so he never saw the field. They then tried with Gresham but he was criticized for timely turnovers and mental mistakes and wasn't a truly elite receiver. Now Eifert who had the elite receiving ability but has been injured often. The Bengals just haven't been able to find that TE that can do everything well and stay healthy.

[Shake n Blake]

(10-18-2017, 02:25 PM)ochocincos Wrote: A lot of people also care more about pass catching TEs over blocking TEs because of fantasy football. For a long time, this went against the grain for what the Bengals prioritized in TE. As fantasy football grew in popularity, more and more people were clamoring for the Bengals to get a TE that could be a receiving threat. They tried with Chase Coffman, but he couldn't block worth a damn so he never saw the field. They then tried with Gresham but he was criticized for timely turnovers and mental mistakes and wasn't a truly elite receiver. Now Eifert who had the elite receiving ability but has been injured often. The Bengals just haven't been able to find that TE that can do everything well and stay healthy.

This is kind of a smug and inaccurate way of looking at it, IMO. It has nothing to do with fantasy and more to do with the fact that blocking-only TE's are archaic. It's a passing league now, and guys like Reggie Kelly starting and getting most of the snaps just doesn't happen much anymore. Guys need to be able to catch. There's a reason pass catching TE's get paid the big bucks while the best blocking TE's bounce around the league like ping pong balls on minimum contracts.

That's not to say it's ok to be a walking turnstile as long as you can catch, but an average blocking TE that can put up 800 yards is always going to be more valuable than a great blocker that brings little to nothing as a receiver.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-18-2017, 02:47 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: This is kind of a smug and inaccurate way of looking at it, IMO. It has nothing to do with fantasy and more to do with the fact that blocking-only TE's are archaic. It's a passing league now, and guys like Reggie Kelly starting and getting most of the snaps just doesn't happen much anymore. Guys need to be able to catch. There's a reason pass catching TE's get paid the big bucks while the best blocking TE's bounce around the league like ping pong balls on minimum contracts.

That's not to say it's ok to be a walking turnstile as long as you can catch, but an average blocking TE that can put up 800 yards is always going to be more valuable than a great blocker that brings little to nothing as a receiver.

How exactly is my statement "smug"?

[Bengal Dude]

(10-18-2017, 01:20 PM)bengalhoel Wrote: I wonder if he ever quit smoking?  LMAO

The guy is a freaking strength and conditioning coach in high school now. If he's still smoking 2 packs a day, then I want to see what his conditioning session is like. He'd have to be winded after blowing a whistle.

[Shake n Blake]

(10-18-2017, 03:00 PM)ochocincos Wrote: How exactly is my statement "smug"?

Assuming other fans are basically idiots that can't see past fantasy football. 

[Sled21]

(10-18-2017, 02:25 PM)ochocincos Wrote: A lot of people also care more about pass catching TEs over blocking TEs because of fantasy football. For a long time, this went against the grain for what the Bengals prioritized in TE. As fantasy football grew in popularity, more and more people were clamoring for the Bengals to get a TE that could be a receiving threat. They tried with Chase Coffman, but he couldn't block worth a damn so he never saw the field. They then tried with Gresham but he was criticized for timely turnovers and mental mistakes and wasn't a truly elite receiver. Now Eifert who had the elite receiving ability but has been injured often. The Bengals just haven't been able to find that TE that can do everything well and stay healthy.

And a lot of people care about pass catching tight ends because of wide receivers not named AJ Green that cannot seem to get separation..... and it's nice to have more than one reliable target for a QB to throw to.....

[*ochocincos*]

(10-18-2017, 04:21 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Assuming other fans are basically idiots that can't see past fantasy football. 

I never stated other fans are "basically idiots that can't see past fantasy football" at all. I stated that most people care more about pass catching TEs because of fantasy football. There's a difference there. You made the assumption. In fact, I'd put myself in the category of caring much more about receiving stats over blocking for TEs around the league because of fantasy football. I couldn't tell you who the top 5 blocking TEs are in the NFL or exactly how good or bad of a blocker some of the big-name TEs are.

Besides, many fans have increased their interest in football because of fantasy football, and fantasy football has grown in popularity over the past 10-20 years. Especially when caring about other teams outside their favorite team and/or knowing many other players around the league. And in fantasy football, TEs are listed as being good based on their receiving stats, nothing about their blocking ability. So it's only natural that those people who are getting to know other players around the league outside of their own team and doing that through fantasy football put a focus on those TEs who get receiving stats.

I know a lot of people that if I say "who are the best TEs in the league" would say Gronk, Olsen, Graham, Reed, and Kelce. Why? Because they get the highlights and receiving stats.
Ask people who the top five blocking TEs are and I guarantee you most wouldn't be able to tell you.
Now, that doesn't make them "basically idiots" for not knowing, just that receiving ability has a much higher visibility over blocking unless fans are really willing to do the research.