Marvin calls out Ross

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-16-2017, 03:07 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: He sure gives the guy enough chances doesn't he?

I find it unfair to judge the guy until he gets enough snaps. Marv has been handcuffing him just like the rest of the team.

FU Marv!

Reminds me of last year when he stabbed Paulie G in the back when he spoke of starting the younger players on D.

This is not leadership.

To be fair......Merv learned it from Son of Paul during the Chris Henry fiasco.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-16-2017, 03:08 PM)Circleville Guy Wrote: Is it possible that Marvin and Mike had a huge disagreement over this pick, with Marvin not wanting the pick? Is he trying to prove Mike wrong? Is Ross lazy and putting in little effort from week to week? Is he still healing and babying it? The speed and talent is obviously there, something is going on.

All i know is Ross has never been lazy before. Doubt he is now.

Your thought on Marv and MB has me thinking.

Interesting stuff. Bet the next coach gets something out of John Ross.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-16-2017, 03:11 PM)Wyche Wrote: To be fair......Merv learned it from Son of Paul during the Chris Henry fiasco.

Lol, almost forgot about that. These guys sure seem like good old chums stabbing each other in the back all the time.

These guys have failed so bad. Sucks for us, just happy when we move on from Marv and PA. Things have got to get better.

[*Nately120*]

Who's spot would Ross be taking? Would he be in there instead of Lafell, or would he rotate in with the other #3 WRs?

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-16-2017, 03:17 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Who's spot would Ross be taking?  Would he be in there instead of Lafell, or would he rotate in with the other #3 WRs?

If it were me, I'd use Lafell as the possession guy, and rotate Ross with the others.  For now.....

[*Nately120*]

(11-16-2017, 03:19 PM)Wyche Wrote: If it were me, I'd use Lafell as the possession guy, and rotate Ross with the others.  For now.....

Yeah, but Lafell has been playing pretty well, actually.  The closest thing I have to a guess why Ross isn't on the field much (other than Marvin is spiteful or crazy) is that Ross is a well-known disappointment on the practice field and sitting guys who are doing better jobs than him because he is a higher draft pick might send yet another negative vibe through the team.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-16-2017, 03:17 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Who's spot would Ross be taking?  Would he be in there instead of Lafell, or would he rotate in with the other #3 WRs?

(11-16-2017, 03:19 PM)Wyche Wrote: If it were me, I'd use Lafell as the possession guy, and rotate Ross with the others.  For now.....

Same here.

(11-16-2017, 03:26 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Yeah, but Lafell has been playing pretty well, actually.  The closest thing I have to a guess why Ross isn't on the field much (other than Marvin is spiteful or crazy) is that Ross is a well-known disappointment on the practice field and sitting guys who are doing better jobs than him because he is a higher draft pick might send yet another negative vibe through the team.

Lafell got the TD against the Titans cause of a broken coverage.

I wouldn't say he has been playing pretty well just cause of one game. His stats on the year are pretty pathetic for a #2 WR.

[3wt]

(11-15-2017, 04:29 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: I honestly think that behind the scenes that these guys are held accountable.  It's the calling out players in the press lately that really makes me scratch my head.

Nothing says "My coach doesn't have my back" more than doing this crap.

This

[3wt]

(11-15-2017, 04:47 PM)lone bengal Wrote: “ said Ross let him down “ Marvin could say the same thing for Bodine the last 4 years and Ogbuehi just about every week lol.

And you have to wonder why has he not???

[BengalsRocker]

Man F this guy.

Same guy who stood up for our crappy long-snapper and kicker who clearly lost his mojo.

But let's just put this in terms of wide receivers.

Marvin freaking Jones OFTEN disappeared in games when Green was taking most of the coverage.

I really don't remember him openly complaining about that or letting the team down.

Sanu dropped passes that were thrown right to him.

Same deal.

These were starters for crap's sake!

Ross is a rookie who will more than likely make some mistakes.

This clearly is an ego thing by Lewis to show how much smarter he is than everyone else at judging talent.

Just like when Maualuga was being chastised about his shortcomings, and Marvin came back with "No one needs to tell me anything about linebackers" statement.

As if HE was the one who had suited up for the Ravens.

[Shake n Blake]

(11-16-2017, 10:10 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I'm not saying the fumble and giving up on the deep route are the things keeping Ross off the field.  I just assume that he looks pretty un-ready in practice and when he has been on the field he's either been perfect but unlucky on that reverse or just not ready.  I don't know how Ross looks in practice, and I don't know how he reacted to that fumble.  Maybe he wanted back in ala Kareem Hunt and maybe he looked gunshy.  I don't recall.

This whole "Get Marvin out so we can see Ross" stuff just reminds me of the narrative we had floating around here where we were pleased as punch to have Zampese as our OC because he was going to be "less cute" than Hue and center the offense around Jeremy Hill.  

We have this narrative where we progress through steps:
1.  Player X needs to get on the field, he's got super potential, he will be great
2.  Player X isn't productive enough because he needs to be on the field more
3A.  Player X can't be judged because (insert myriad of franchise issues here)
3B . Player X is a bum, let's put Player Z in

Look, maybe Ross will be great and it's very possible Marvin Lewis is benching a guy who could produce and save his job (that's a scary thought).  This year we've already gone through steps 1 through 3A with Mixon over Hill after going from steps 1 through 3B with Hill himself and we seem to be on step 2 for Ross.  Personally, I'd wave a magic wand and make the whole gameplan based around AJ McCarron handing the ball to Mixon 30 times a game and taking deep shots to Ross for the other plays, but my career isn't tied to what goes on there.

EDIT:  the frustrating part is that Marvin Lewis' career isn't tired to what goes on on the field either.  ZING!

I don't think it's so much that as people have seen 15 years worth of Marv and like 7 snaps worth of John Ross, so Ross gets more benefit of the doubt.

We're 3-6 right now. The offense is abysmal. Throwing Ross in as a starter isn't going to fix anything, but he should be getting more snaps than he has at least. If for nothing else but to get his feet wet for next season and beyond. Maybe know a little about what we have in our 9th overall pick. It's hard to buy anything Marv is selling at this point. Especially when he's been very selective with who he embarrasses publicly. Which brings me to...

(11-16-2017, 10:22 AM)Big Boss Wrote: Let me see if I've got this straight.

Cedric Ogbuehi was a late first-round pick.  As soon as he was made a starter in 2016, he got pulverized on a consistent basis.  But game after game, bad play after bad play, they kept trotting him out onto the field.  They didn't end up benching him until, what?  November or December of the 2016 season?  The guy was given a A LOT of rope.  

John Ross is a top-10 pick.  A top-10 pick for a wide receiver corps where nobody seems to be able to get separation (save AJ Green).  He makes one bad play, and he gets benched the rest of the game?  Then Marvin waits three days to go down the list of all the people Ross personally let down?  Over one mistake?  

Yeah, I'll throw on the tin-foil hat.  Something's up.

Kid gloves for the biggest bust we've ever drafted at tackle, but stern as a Drill Sergeant with Ross, who he barely lets touch the field?

If Ross were the WR equivalent of Ogbuehi, he'd start almost every game, drop 20 passes and finish with a 25-200-1 stat line.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-16-2017, 03:26 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Yeah, but Lafell has been playing pretty well, actually.  The closest thing I have to a guess why Ross isn't on the field much (other than Marvin is spiteful or crazy) is that Ross is a well-known disappointment on the practice field and sitting guys who are doing better jobs than him because he is a higher draft pick might send yet another negative vibe through the team.

Which is why I put him in the Houshmanzadeh role.  If Ross can run a go route, it makes defenders get out of the box to cover the speed, and the thought here is, maybe it opens up some stuff underneath.  Have you noticed how tightly our guys are covered?  Defenses are doubling AJ and pressing the hell out of everyone else.  I like Malone, but outside of him, I haven't really seen anything out of any of the other guys to be honest.

[Shake n Blake]

(11-16-2017, 03:39 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Lafell got the TD against the Titans cause of a broken coverage.

I wouldn't say he has been playing pretty well just cause of one game. His stats on the year are pretty pathetic for a #2 WR.

This. Don't let one game fool ya. LaFell has had an awful year. Even after the big game, he's still only on pace for 539 yards and 4 TDs on 9.8 YPC.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-16-2017, 04:11 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: This. Don't let one game fool ya. LaFell has had an awful year. Even after the big game, he's still only on pace for 539 yards and 4 TDs on 9.8 YPC.

And we were two of the main guys defending Lafell when he was playing decent.

But he isn't playing well right now as the stats you provide here show.

Ross needs much more snaps so we know what we have in him. This shit where Marv calls him out on one play and sits him is
complete BS. He is a rookie he is going to make mistakes, he has to so he can learn from them. What Big Boss said is really
telling how much different Marv treated Blodine and Og from Ross.

There is something going on as Big Boss and Circleville alluded to i think.

[*bfine32*]

(11-16-2017, 03:39 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Same here.


Lafell got the TD against the Titans cause of a broken coverage.

I wouldn't say he has been playing pretty well just cause of one game. His stats on the year are pretty pathetic for a #2 WR.

Depends on who one looks at it.  He has 31 catches on only 49 targets. Has zero dropped passes (our entire WR corps only has 2 dropped passes on the year) or fumbles. There's a difference between playing poorly and being poorly utilized.

[*PhilHos*]

(11-16-2017, 04:22 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Depends on who one looks at it.  He has 31 catches on only 49 targets. Has zero dropped passes (our entire WR corps only has 2 dropped passes on the year) or fumbles. There's a difference between playing poorly and being poorly utilized.

Of course they have so few dropped passes; between Dalton being sacked and forced out of the pocket and throwing passes away and to the receivers not getting any separation preventing Dalton from throwing the ball to them, it's no wonder they have so few dropped passes. :tongue:

[*bfine32*]

(11-16-2017, 04:25 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Of course they have so few dropped passes; between Dalton being sacked and forced out of the pocket and throwing passes away and to the receivers not getting any separation preventing Dalton from throwing the ball to them, it's no wonder they have so few dropped passes. 

So it's not to there credit they've dropped only 2 passes all year?

What if I could show you something that would completely destroy the notion that it's the WRs fault they don't get thrown to because they cannot create separation?

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-16-2017, 04:22 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Depends on who one looks at it.  He has 31 catches on only 49 targets. Has zero dropped passes (our entire WR corps only has 2 dropped passes on the year) or fumbles. There's a difference between playing poorly and being poorly utilized.

Of course they are being poorly utilized, Ross is being poorly utilized if he is being utilized at all.

Then he gets called out by the Head Coach for one play all the while the HC said nothing while Bodine and Og ruin entire seasons.

(11-16-2017, 04:25 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Of course they have so few dropped passes; between Dalton being sacked and forced out of the pocket and throwing passes away and to the receivers not getting any separation preventing Dalton from throwing the ball to them, it's no wonder they have so few dropped passes. :tongue:

True, hard to get it to the receivers with this O-line. But look at that Slant route to AJ last game that we rarely see.

Works, is a quick throw and gets it to your playmakers. Sure would be nice to see Ross get a few of those a game.

[Shake n Blake]

(11-16-2017, 04:22 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Depends on who one looks at it.  He has 31 catches on only 49 targets. Has zero dropped passes (our entire WR corps only has 2 dropped passes on the year) or fumbles. There's a difference between playing poorly and being poorly utilized.

So QB's fault, right?

[*bfine32*]

(11-16-2017, 04:37 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: So QB's fault, right?

Nope, most likely scheme, I prefer a punt over a turnover.

But we do know WRs do not get credit for lack of drops