Why can’t we get players like Burkhead?

[J24]

(12-03-2017, 10:18 PM)Utts Wrote: What does that mean? How has that translated into production? Their career stats are very similar. If you need to move the chains, Rex is your man.

It means he is better  and more of a threat. Gio has really good numbers when he gets his touches not sure about him being the same with Burkhead. Anyways if Burkhead is as good as you say he is then what's wrong with Gio since you think there the same caliber of player?

[*Nately120*]

(12-03-2017, 09:14 PM)muskiesfan Wrote: A lot of this has to do with the philosophy that Mike Brown has put in place and Marvin Lewis has bought in to. Rumors are that Mike is more willing to play rookies than Marvin, but we all know whoever gets paid the most will get the most snaps. Why else do we have a young DLineman with 7.5 sacks stuck behind Michael Johnson? Why did we let go of Sims and see progress from Billings just to bring Sims back and he will again leap frog Billings on the depth chart. Pacman and DreK over Dennard and WJ3. Hill over Mixon. The list goes on and on every year.

There's zero accountability. Be a vet, make the most money at your position, and your play doesn't matter in the slightest. You will be the starter and the young players will be wasted behind you.

Yes, I understand Malone is getting snaps and Core got some snaps last year, but unless there is a major need (like Dalton and Green) rookies get "eased" in at best.

I get this, but in all fairness people around here have been saying the season is over and that we should spend the rest of the season seeing what we have in players XYZ for the past month or so.  The reality of it is that we still have the (slim) possibility of making the playoffs and declaring this season a "success" by Bengals' measures.  So we are still in it a month after people didn't understand why Marvin didn't just toss players onto the field and hope for the best.

I get it, though...I really do.  I also realize that my job isn't tied to our win column. If someone asked me if I wanted to see Ross I'd say yes. If someone asked if I want to see Ross but I'll lose my job if he doesn't perform, I'd say stick with Lafell.

[chopperbobby]

I just think Rex finished strong last year he was making yards after contact and fighting for everything. The other two did not do much all year. I feel Rex earned a spot. Hill should have been let go.

[Utts]

(12-03-2017, 10:59 PM)chopperbobby Wrote: I just think Rex finished strong last year he was making yards after contact and fighting for everything.  The other two did not do much all year.  I feel Rex earned a spot.  Hill should have been let go.

That's how Rex is on every snap. That's why the Patriots noticed him.

[*bengalfan74*]

(12-03-2017, 10:57 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I get this, but in all fairness people around here have been saying the season is over and that we should spend the rest of the season seeing what we have in players XYZ for the past month or so.  The reality of it is that we still have the (slim) possibility of making the playoffs and declaring this season a "success" by Bengals' measures.  So we are still in it a month after people didn't understand why Marvin didn't just toss players onto the field and hope for the best.

I get it, though...I really do.  I also realize that my job isn't tied to our win column. If someone asked me if I wanted to see Ross I'd say yes.  If someone asked if I want to see Ross but I'll lose my job if he doesn't perform, I'd say stick with Lafell.

When has anyone here had their job tied to the win column ?

And it's not that we can't get players like Burkhead, it's that the broken, busted, messed up thing we have called a system won't allow us to use a Burkhead.

[*Nately120*]

(12-03-2017, 11:37 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: When has anyone here had their job tied to the win column ?

Good point.  I have to say that I honestly believe Marvin being back next year is connected to the W column this year, mostly because he might walk away if things aren't looking even remotely promising going forward.

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-03-2017, 05:10 PM)chopperbobby Wrote: New England keeps getting good players an making them great.  Why can’t we get a player like Rex burkhead.  He can do it all,  

If only marve could get a player like that and use his talent.  
(I know he played for us. Just being sarcastic)

How do you know we don't have players like that right now, riding the bench?  The next coaching staff will probably use a lot more of the roster, including the young guys.  

[PlayadLc]

(12-03-2017, 07:21 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I think the more knowledgeable of us knew that Burkhead would be the type of player that would fit in at NE and do well.

How many guys like Evan Mathis have we had that looked ok here in limited opportunity then leave and become better? Justin Smith fits the mold. He was good here but great in SF.

That said, what is the Bengals system?

On the flip side, how many guys have we picked up who were struggling and ended up blossoming here?

Just to name a few:

Adam Jones
Reggie Nelson (Jags basically gave him to us)
Terrence Newman
Brandon Lafell
Deltha O’Neal
Tory James
Antwan Odom
Cedric Benson

The Bengals do get things right sometimes.

[muskiesfan]

(12-03-2017, 10:57 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I get this, but in all fairness people around here have been saying the season is over and that we should spend the rest of the season seeing what we have in players XYZ for the past month or so.  The reality of it is that we still have the (slim) possibility of making the playoffs and declaring this season a "success" by Bengals' measures.  So we are still in it a month after people didn't understand why Marvin didn't just toss players onto the field and hope for the best.

I get it, though...I really do.  I also realize that my job isn't tied to our win column. If someone asked me if I wanted to see Ross I'd say yes.  If someone asked if I want to see Ross but I'll lose my job if he doesn't perform, I'd say stick with Lafell.

I get what you're saying too. In the case of WJ3 though, he's played at a high level when given the opportunity. He should play more snaps. I would think you have to find a way to get him on the field more since he's performing better than those ahead of him. I think that would help give us a better chance to win. Same with Lawson. He doesn't have to play every snap, but he should be getting an increased workload with his production. I understand there's a chance he may not perform as well if he's playing a lot more, but I feel it's a chance you have to be willing to take because he improves the team.

Ross is an enigma. Whatever issues there are there, we'll probably never know the truth. While I like to think that Ross would improve our chances to win, I honestly have no idea. The players on the defensive side are showing they deserve more opportunities, but we keep trotting out the same underperforming veterans.

[*jason*]

(12-03-2017, 06:29 PM)Interceptor Wrote: ^^^^ What was said right here. We HAD Rex Burkhead and what happened? He looked less than stellar in this system. So now everyone knows it isn't the players.

And another tough win for Zimmer! Ugly win but a win nonetheless.

I don't know man. I remember watching Rex play very well on special teams, and when his number was called on offense he seemed to look solid at worst. I kinda remember several of us thinking that was the sort of player Bill Belichick could work wonders with... The same way I think Gio and Jeremy Hill would be world beaters in the Patriots offense.

[coachmcneil71]

(12-03-2017, 05:37 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: He did have good games for us but he also had two players in Gio and Hill that were better than him. As for why we didn't sign him back idk but to tell you the truth it's not that huge of a deal because players like him are a dime in a dozen.

Neither of the players that mentioned above are better than Rex. I love the crap out of Gio, but Rex can do everything that he can and more.

[*jason*]

Probably not the best time to mention that we could've landed Alvin Kamara is it? Of course on the flip side of that, Kamara would probably struggle behind our line while Joe Mixon would be in the ROTY debate in New Orleans.

[*ochocincos*]

(12-03-2017, 05:50 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Yeah...maybe start using Burkhead more and instead of Mixon draft a Center?

I do like Mixon...but how many good RB's do you need to see that the line is the main issue? No the Bengals have 3 2nd Round RB's on the roster.

The state of the Bengals OL reminds me a lot of the Colts OL from about a decade ago. They constantly tried to draft a new RB (early) but practically no RB could accomplish much because there was no ability to run between the tackles.

For them to have success, they often had to rely on great performances from Peyton Manning, Marvin Harrison, and Reggie Wayne.

The Bengals are now built the same way but have a downgrade at QB and WR2, and therefore they struggle.

[*Nately120*]

(12-04-2017, 11:07 AM)muskiesfan Wrote: I get what you're saying too. In the case of WJ3 though, he's played at a high level when given the opportunity. He should play more snaps. I would think you have to find a way to get him on the field more since he's performing better than those ahead of him. I think that would help give us a better chance to win. Same with Lawson. He doesn't have to play every snap, but he should be getting an increased workload with his production. I understand there's a chance he may not perform as well if he's playing a lot more, but I feel it's a chance you have to be willing to take because he improves the team.

Ross is an enigma. Whatever issues there are there, we'll probably never know the truth. While I like to think that Ross would improve our chances to win, I honestly have no idea. The players on the defensive side are showing they deserve more opportunities, but we keep trotting out the same underperforming veterans.

Yes, but wasn't WJ3 on the same trajectory as (possibly) Ross and Kirkpatrick?  1st round pick who is various shades of injured and not ready as a rookie and then gradually brought into the system?  I don't recall WJ3 being tossed into the fire because we simply had to see what we had in him, not at least until there was some faith he had his feet under him.  I think that's how it went.

As for Ross, I just run it through my "What would we be saying if the Steelers did this, instead of us" filter.  If the Steelers picked a WR top 10 (or just in the 1st round) and he had 0 catches deep in the season and just wasn't getting on the field we would be more likely to laugh at them for drafting a bust rather than worried they have a super secret gem they're going to unleash on the NFL.  Hope springs eternal, though.

Sadly, even if Ross plays and does well we can't rule out that he's having a misleading surge ala Jerome Simpson at the end of 2010 when everything was over.  Stuff like this is what makes me think coaches know a lot more about player potential than we do.  With that being said, I hope we stuff Ross into the gameplan tonight and run him down the field full speed over and over again.

[WeezyBengal]

I would love to see Rex Burkhead running behind this offensive line.

[BengalChris]

(12-03-2017, 05:37 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: He did have good games for us but he also had two players in Gio and Hill that were better than him. As for why we didn't sign him back idk but to tell you the truth it's not that huge of a deal because players like him are a dime in a dozen.

According to Mike Brown, so are guards and centers. 

[Murdock2420]

(12-03-2017, 06:58 PM)Utts Wrote: I argued a long time ago, that Burkhead had an intangible that Gio does not have. Burkhead is a grind it out playmaker, and I'm sure that's what the Patriots saw in him. Their career stats are vary similar, albeit Gio has way more attempts. On paper they are actually very similar at this point. Given a choice between the two, I'd take Rex. 

I have to disagree with this one. Burkhead has some grind it out skills and is a solid role player, but send Gio to New England instead of Rex and see how slanted in Gio's favor the numbers would be. 

Gio on a team with competent coaching would be one of the top back in the league, like a Brian Westbrook was for the Eagles in 06 and 07. 

[*jason*]

(12-04-2017, 01:17 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: I would love to see Rex Burkhead running behind this offensive line.

He did in week 17 last year. I do believe he balled out if I recall correctly.

[Millhouse]

I still think it wasnt a good move to not re-sign Burkhead while keeping Hill on for the last year of his deal. At the time Burkhead's arrow was going up, Hill's was down, and Gio coming off his knee injury. They still could have drafted Mixon with Burkhead as Gio was still recovering.

Regardless, it worked out better for Rex, and he has had a good year so far with their rb rotation. Not to mention he missed about a month, which has hurt his numbers so far there. But going forward, he will be more featured in their offense and we will be watching him play in the playoffs.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-03-2017, 05:10 PM)chopperbobby Wrote: New England keeps getting good players an making them great.  Why can’t we get a player like Rex burkhead.  He can do it all,  

If only marve could get a player like that and use his talent.  
(I know he played for us. Just being sarcastic)

These coaches just don't know how to use players to their strengths.

The Patriot coaches do.

Lots of us fans were calling for more Burkhead over Hill way before we played him and he ran for over 100 yards against the Ravens.

Weird how these coaches have no eye for talent. Rex played well here everytime he got a chance. He just didn't get many chances.

The fact that he is playing well in New England is no surprise.